Are communist's welcome?

[LittlePinky82]

Socialism and communism isn't really a huge leap from each other just communism is more radical and all. I was wondering if Communist's were welcome to post here (I'm a Communist). I know there are people who don't want to associate socialism and communism and their members so I was just wondering. Thanks.

 

[Katzpur]

Socialism and communism isn't really a huge leap from each other just communism is more radical and all. I was wondering if Communist's were welcome to post here (I'm a Communist). I know there are people who don't want to associate socialism and communism and their members so I was just wondering. Thanks.

Everybody's welcome here, Pinky. Why don't you explain what has drawn you to communism.

 

[LittlePinky82]

Thanks! I used to post frequently at the YPSL and they were last I was there talking about not being associated with a communist so I wanted to make sure. Well I just did a lot of reading on the manifesto, Marx and Engels and even Fidel Castro. Communism to me is just more radical version of socialism. There really isn't much difference between the two. Socialism is the transition phase between one form of government and a communist government. Communism is the socialist utopia. So you can't really have one without the other in my opinion. Of course people who are socialist's doesn't mean they're communist. A lot of socialsit's just see communism as more radical and that's one reason why I like being a communist. Nothing else felt right if that makes any sense.

 

[blackout]

LOL! JUST KIDDING!

Well, this is America after all!

I for one, associate with people I like.
Regardless of political affiliation.:cover:
(of which I BTW really have none)

Welcome to RF Little Pinky!

~Violet~

 

[Katzpur]

Thanks! I used to post frequently at the YPSL and they were last I was there talking about not being associated with a communist so I wanted to make sure. Well I just did a lot of reading on the manifesto, Marx and Engels and even Fidel Castro. Communism to me is just more radical version of socialism. There really isn't much difference between the two. Socialism is the transition phase between one form of government and a communist government. Communism is the socialist utopia. So you can't really have one without the other in my opinion. Of course people who are socialist's doesn't mean they're communist. A lot of socialsit's just see communism as more radical and that's one reason why I like being a communist. Nothing else felt right if that makes any sense.

I'm curious about one thing... You're a gnostic Christian and a communist. If you were living under communist rule, you'd have to be pretty darned careful not to admit to being a theist, wouldn't you? I'm sure you know a lot more about communism than I do, but my friends who grew up in the former Soviet Union were scared to death that they'd be caught reading their Bible and sent to Siberia. I'm not making that up. They used to be a part of a group of Christians who took a Bible apart and took turns reading a few chapters at a time and them swapping pages.

 

[Magic Man]

I'm curious about one thing... You're a gnostic Christian and a communist. If you were living under communist rule, you'd have to be pretty darned careful not to admit to being a theist, wouldn't you? I'm sure you know a lot more about communism than I do, but my friends who grew up in the former Soviet Union were scared to death that they'd be caught reading their Bible and sent to Siberia. I'm not making that up. They used to be a part of a group of Christians who took a Bible apart and took turns reading a few chapters at a time and them swapping pages.

Communism and atheism have nothing to do with each other. It is true that if a theist lived in Communist Soviet Union, there would be a problem, but it wasn't because it was communist. It was just because that particular government didn't like religion. It would be perfectly normal to have a theistic communist state. That's why I'm glad to have Pinky here, to be a good example of a Christian communist. Communism is a political philosophy that can co-exist with any religious philosophy. It just so happens that the most well-known examples we have of communism in practice have been in atheistic states.

 

[Katzpur]

Communism and atheism have nothing to do with each other. Communism is a political philosophy that can co-exist with any religious philosophy. It just so happens that the most well-known examples we have of communism in practice have been in atheistic states.

Thanks for setting me straight. I'm happy to have Pinky here, too -- a whole lot happier than I am to have certain Christian fundies here! I do still wonder, though, can there be true freedom of religion under communism? Or are religious practices, whatever they may be, controlled by the state?

 

[LittlePinky82]

LOL! JUST KIDDING!

Well, this is America after all!

I for one, associate with people I like.
Regardless of political affiliation.:cover:
(of which I BTW really have none)

Welcome to RF Little Pinky!

~Violet~

Aw thanks UV! :angel2:

 

[Magic Man]

Thanks for setting me straight. I'm happy to have Pinky here, too -- a whole lot happier than I am to have certain Christian fundies here!

My pleasure, and agreed.

 

[LittlePinky82]

I'm curious about one thing... You're a gnostic Christian and a communist. If you were living under communist rule, you'd have to be pretty darned careful not to admit to being a theist, wouldn't you? I'm sure you know a lot more about communism than I do, but my friends who grew up in the former Soviet Union were scared to death that they'd be caught reading their Bible and sent to Siberia. I'm not making that up. They used to be a part of a group of Christians who took a Bible apart and took turns reading a few chapters at a time and them swapping pages.

Nope. Even Fidel Castro is a Catholic. Not long ago he attended the opening of a new Catholic Church in Cuba and a lot more radical communist's I used to know got mad at him for it but I think he was going there as an individual and not the president of Cuba. Even in Cuba there are different religions. Even a Jewish population! The thing with Communism is we believe in a very strong separation of church and state. We've seen what happens in history (and even present day) what happens with the government and religion gets too close for comfort. Stalin was a paranoid jerk so he of course wanted to get rid of all opposition. Many communist's are atheist but not all of us are. We just think religion is very personal and should be kept as such. If you're curious for more check out CPUSA Online - and their faq and media section (there they have interviews about issues). Personally I believe Jesus was a socialist because of his stance on some issues we know he talked about (or that's in the Bible anyways).

 

[LittlePinky82]

Communism and atheism have nothing to do with each other. It is true that if a theist lived in Communist Soviet Union, there would be a problem, but it wasn't because it was communist. It was just because that particular government didn't like religion. It would be perfectly normal to have a theistic communist state. That's why I'm glad to have Pinky here, to be a good example of a Christian communist. Communism is a political philosophy that can co-exist with any religious philosophy. It just so happens that the most well-known examples we have of communism in practice have been in atheistic states.

Exactly. As I already mentioned even Fidel Castro is a known Catholic. Communism is just for a strong separation of church and state like we're supposed to have here. My religion actually helped play a role of me becoming a communist.

 

[LittlePinky82]

Thanks for setting me straight. I'm happy to have Pinky here, too -- a whole lot happier than I am to have certain Christian fundies here! I do still wonder, though, can there be true freedom of religion under communism? Or are religious practices, whatever they may be, controlled by the state?

They aren't controlled by the state I don't believe. At least not in true Communist state. There is more true freedom of religion under communism. I believe under communism there is more protection for religion and the government because too many times if you combined the two together you can get some pretty scary results. They aren't controlled by the state since we believe in that separation. In my opinion I think in Cuba they have churches be registered through the government to keep an eye on them and that they don't separate that boundary. Even here we have that with the IRS. Churches here can't just do whatever they want. Endorsing a candidate and campaigning for them is supposed to be against the law (however that's different than a candidate coming to speak to your church as an individual and not a candidate). Aw I'm more popular than a fundie. Yay!

 

[LittlePinky82]

I hope everyone checks out the CPUSA faq section. It's too long to post here I think so it'd be best to go there.

 

[Father Heathen]

Christian communism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[LittlePinky82]

Christian communism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

While that's true however you have to keep in mind that communism is for a very strong separation of church and state. Personally I think Acts is more socialist than communist since communism is more radical. Of course I do think that for those times they could be considered radical and could be considered communist. Thanks for the link. It was very good to read.

 

[Katzpur]

Thanks for the info, Pinky!

 

[Dunemeister]

The problem, of course, is that Christianity isn't a private faith. It's very public. And it makes claims that challenge a totalitarian interpretation of government's role. In practice, communism has had to eliminate (USSR) or severely control (Viet Nam, Cuba) Christian religion in order to maintain its hold on power. I don't know about communism's response to other religions, so I can't comment much about that.

 

[LittlePinky82]

The problem, of course, is that Christianity isn't a private faith. It's very public. And it makes claims that challenge a totalitarian interpretation of government's role. In practice, communism has had to eliminate (USSR) or severely control (Viet Nam, Cuba) Christian religion in order to maintain its hold on power. I don't know about communism's response to other religions, so I can't comment much about that.

No it's not. Are you aware of Matthew chapter six? It's not supposed to be.

Matthew six (from biblegateway.com )

Matthew 6 (New International Version)


Matthew 6

Giving to the Needy

1"Be careful not to do your 'acts of righteousness' before men, to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven. 2"So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. 3But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, 4so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.
Prayer

5"And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. 6But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. 7And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. 8Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him. 9"This, then, is how you should pray:
" 'Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name,
10your kingdom come,
your will be done
on earth as it is in heaven.
11Give us today our daily bread.
12Forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
13And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from the evil one.[a]' 14For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.
Fasting

16"When you fast, do not look somber as the hypocrites do, for they disfigure their faces to show men they are fasting. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. 17But when you fast, put oil on your head and wash your face, 18so that it will not be obvious to men that you are fasting, but only to your Father, who is unseen; and your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.Treasures in Heaven

19"Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. 22"The eye is the lamp of the body. If your eyes are good, your whole body will be full of light. 23But if your eyes are bad, your whole body will be full of darkness. If then the light within you is darkness, how great is that darkness!
24"No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money.
Do Not Worry

25"Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes? 26Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they? 27Who of you by worrying can add a single hour to his life[b]? 28"And why do you worry about clothes? See how the lilies of the field grow. They do not labor or spin. 29Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these. 30If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more clothe you, O you of little faith? 31So do not worry, saying, 'What shall we eat?' or 'What shall we drink?' or 'What shall we wear?' 32For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. 33But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. 34Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.

 

[Dunemeister]

No it's not. Are you aware of Matthew chapter six? It's not supposed to be.

Matthew six (from biblegateway.com )

Um, if you're going to try to prove that Christianity is not supposed to be a public faith, you had better not point to the Sermon on the Mount as you have done. There, as elsewhere, Jesus sets forth the sort of ethics he wants his new community to follow. And among them are very political and economic principles which, if followed, lead ultimately to confrontation with the state. Heck, it got Jesus killed as an insurrectionist without him ever lifting up a sword. Rome did not misread him. He was definitely a threat to the political status quo. If he's a king (as both he and his followers claimed and as the whole city celebrated as he rode into the city at the beginning of his passion week) with the sort of authority he was claiming, namely the authority of God (he had authority to replace the Temple, for instance), that means that Ceasar is not, at least ultimately. Similarly, if Jesus is Lord, then whatever group holds political power at the moment isn't. There's a higher power in town.

 

[LittlePinky82]

Um, if you're going to try to prove that Christianity is not supposed to be a public faith, you had better not point to the Sermon on the Mount as you have done. There, as elsewhere, Jesus sets forth the sort of ethics he wants his new community to follow. And among them are very political and economic principles which, if followed, lead ultimately to confrontation with the state. Heck, it got Jesus killed as an insurrectionist without him ever lifting up a sword. Rome did not misread him. He was definitely a threat to the political status quo. If he's a king (as both he and his followers claimed and as the whole city celebrated as he rode into the city at the beginning of his passion week) with the sort of authority he was claiming, namely the authority of God (he had authority to replace the Temple, for instance), that means that Ceasar is not, at least ultimately. Similarly, if Jesus is Lord, then whatever group holds political power at the moment isn't. There's a higher power in town.

I am talking about separation of church and state. As a Communist I believe very strongly in that. I am not talking about not challenging your government etc. I believe that the government should not be involved with religion and religion not be involved with the government. And Jesus is talking about spirituality not physically on Earth. Jesus also refused to bow down to Satan when he was going through that temptation in the desert. Satan said to Jesus if he bowed down to him he could rule over all the kingdoms on Earth. Jesus refused. Jesus wasn't interested in ruling the Earth physically. We are not talking about a physical King here. Everything Jesus talked about dealt with spirituality and the other side. So even Jesus denied ruling the Earth and wasn't interested in that.

Matthew 4:
8Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. 9"All this I will give you," he said, "if you will bow down and worship me."
10Jesus said to him, "Away from me, Satan! For it is written: 'Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.'[d]"
11Then the devil left him, and angels came and attended him.

Oh and how can you not point to the sermon on the Mtn? It's very important in Christianity. To not point to it would be leaving out something so important to the faith next to Jesus's two commandments.

I also did not start this thread to get into a religious discussion. I got into this thread to see if I was welcome in this part of the forum as a communist.