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Anyone worship Lilith?

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
Lilith never existed. She was created after the lilitu in Mesopotamian mythology.
Lilitu is an invention of Mesopotamian lore, all these deities are simply archetypal structures. None of them are any more or less existent than the other.
 

Liu

Well-Known Member
That doesn't change anything.
It doesn't necessarily change anything about the existence of these beings, but what it does change is that it makes it much more difficult for us to know whether these beings exist.

I mean, even if you'd now encounter the Lilitu, who is to tell that those are the same beings of ancient Mesopotamia?

And even if they are, how does that mean that Lilith doesn't exist as well? I have heard of a lot of people who work with her, but maybe one who works with the Lilitu so far.
 

Maponos

Welcome to the Opera
It doesn't necessarily change anything about the existence of these beings, but what it does change is that it makes it much more difficult for us to know whether these beings exist.

I mean, even if you'd now encounter the Lilitu, who is to tell that those are the same beings of ancient Mesopotamia?

And even if they are, how does that mean that Lilith doesn't exist as well? I have heard of a lot of people who work with her, but maybe one who works with the Lilitu so far.
Well, if they are the lilitu, then they'd be of Mesopotamia, no?

A lot of people work with many fictional beings as well. Remember, there are people who worship Cthulhu and his ilk (gods forbid they actually exist) among a myriad of other literary characters as well.
 

Liu

Well-Known Member
Well, if they are the lilitu, then they'd be of Mesopotamia, no?

A lot of people work with many fictional beings as well. Remember, there are people who worship Cthulhu and his ilk (gods forbid they actually exist) among a myriad of other literary characters as well.
Sure, but why would you claim to know that the Lilitu exist or existed?

From what I hear of people who work with such entities, their experiences don't differ depending on whether the entities are of ancient Mesopotamia or by Lovecraft.
 

Kapalika

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Lilith never existed. She was created after the lilitu in Mesopotamian mythology.

You're not real. How can you say my mom isn't real?

What is the basis of the existence of Lilith or lilitu? Neither are in the Bible.

Isaiah 34:14

Many translations note Lilith as it's the most modern term for what is meant.

Also from @Erebus 's earlier link: Lilith

"To her that flies in rooms of darkness – pass quickly, quickly, Lil[ith]." In Scripture there is only one reference to Lilith (Isa. 34:14), among the beasts of prey and the spirits that will lay waste the land on the day of vengeance. In sources dating from earlier centuries, traditions concerning the female demon who endangers women in childbirth and who assumes many guises and names are distinct from the explicit tradition on Lilith recorded in the Talmud.

So it actually is in there, some translations don't translate the word as you would recognize it, but many do such as the Common English translation.

Also I've encountered her (fleetingly thank god she's scary lol), as well as her children (quite a lot). I'm pretty darn sure they are real all things considered.
 

DavidFirth

Well-Known Member
You're not real. How can you say my mom isn't real?



Isaiah 34:14

Many translations note Lilith as it's the most modern term for what is meant.

Also from @Erebus 's earlier link: Lilith

"To her that flies in rooms of darkness – pass quickly, quickly, Lil[ith]." In Scripture there is only one reference to Lilith (Isa. 34:14), among the beasts of prey and the spirits that will lay waste the land on the day of vengeance. In sources dating from earlier centuries, traditions concerning the female demon who endangers women in childbirth and who assumes many guises and names are distinct from the explicit tradition on Lilith recorded in the Talmud.

So it actually is in there, some translations don't translate the word as you would recognize it, but many do such as the Common English translation.

Also I've encountered her (fleetingly thank god she's scary lol), as well as her children (quite a lot). I'm pretty darn sure they are real all things considered.

Satyrs are demons or demon possessed people. I don't see Lilith in that verse. I believe Lilith is just some made up character invented to make Eve look inadequate and the Genesis account look inaccurate.
 

DavidFirth

Well-Known Member
'Demon' denotes that they were 'fallen angels'. Such a being does not exist in European polytheism. Satyrs are wild nature spirits.

What is a wild nature spirit? Do you think they exist? What about nymphs?

Sorry to be asking so many questions but I am curious.
 

Maponos

Welcome to the Opera
What is a wild nature spirit? Do you think they exist? What about nymphs?

Sorry to be asking so many questions but I am curious.
A spirit that is part of the more wild and unforgiving side of nature. Just as nature is kind, it can also be cruel. They are both, really.

Yes and yes.
 

DavidFirth

Well-Known Member
So what about the thousands of years before moses, assuming of course he actually existed.

Here is a wiki showing a brief timeline of religion dating back to 38/40 thousand yours ago.

If wikipedia is not to your liking, here is a site showing the 8 oldest religions, Christianity doesn't get a mention.

Christianity wasn't born until Christ was.

However, Judaism has existed ever since the creation. I know you don't think so but I do think so, I'm sure of it.
 

Kapalika

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Hold on everyone is arguing about the wrong thing back up. Also please no more debating in my interfaith topic. I've made this post to just show the Hebrew for others interested in knowing what the verse actually says.

The verse in Hebrew: Isaiah 34 / Hebrew - English Bible / Mechon-Mamre

You are all arguing about Satyrs when that isn't even the word referring to Lilith and "Satyr" isn't something mythical here.

The King James Version translates "Lilith" (לִּילִית) to "the screech owl", the "Satyr" translation is in reference to שָׂעִיר

Satyrs are demons or demon possessed people. I don't see Lilith in that verse. I believe Lilith is just some made up character invented to make Eve look inadequate and the Genesis account look inaccurate.

Er, the idea that Lilith was the first wife of Adam came a lot later than the portion of mythology that the verse pointed to. We are getting many many centuries ahead of ourselves.

Edit: The word translated as Satyr can either mean "hairy", "sacrificial goat" or "demon possessed goat" according to the Bible study source I mention later.

No mention of it being a person or demon.

Poppycock. Judaism came from God the Creator. I'm not interested in hearing anything to the contrary.

Then you might be interested in what the actual Hebrew of the verse has to say which is what I was going to use anyway.

Lilith in Hebrew: לִּילִית

Strong's Number 3917 Hebrew Dictionary of the Old Testament Online Bible with Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, Brown Driver Briggs Lexicon, Etymology, Translations Definitions Meanings & Key Word Studies - Lexiconcordance.com

Isaiah 34:14: (emphasis added for Lilith)

יד וּפָגְשׁוּ צִיִּים אֶת-אִיִּים, וְשָׂעִיר עַל-רֵעֵהוּ יִקְרָא; אַךְ-שָׁם הִרְגִּיעָה לִּילִית, וּמָצְאָה לָהּ מָנוֹחַ.

So ya, it's there.

Besides that, I don't see why you choose my interfaith topic to seemingly debate on. In either case I thought I would offer what I do happen to know on the subject. I don't think any of this information challenges your faith. It's more like an interesting bit of history.

"Satyr" is here:

יד וּפָגְשׁוּ צִיִּים אֶת-אִיִּים, וְשָׂעִיר עַל-רֵעֵהוּ יִקְרָא; אַךְ-שָׁם הִרְגִּיעָה לִּילִית, וּמָצְאָה לָהּ מָנוֹחַ.

Satyr isn't some mythical animal in the actual Hebrew: Strong's Number 8163 Hebrew Dictionary of the Old Testament Online Bible with Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, Brown Driver Briggs Lexicon, Etymology, Translations Definitions Meanings & Key Word Studies - Lexiconcordance.com

That source indicates it actually means a goat.
 
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Quintessence

Consults with Trees
Staff member
Premium Member
*** REMINDER ***

This is Interfaith Discussion. Please do not debate in this thread. Thanks!
 

delilahr3ss

Lilith knows my sadness and rage
I've been curious a while about those who worship Lilith and the source materials and/or scriptures they draw on. I wanted to ask so I could figure out maybe where to go from there.

To explain a little... when I first got into Satanism 6 or 7 years ago Lilith was really important to my practice. But overtime I drifted away from that. However lately I've had some insights and dreams and other mystical experiences telling me that I need to return to her at some point here and add her into my practice. The reasons for that are rather personal so I won't get into explaining that. She never technically left my pantheon, I just kind of forgot about her even when working with her children.

It's just that when I worshiped her... I didn't really know much about her mythology wise. The basics okay and some other stuff of some sources I read I've long forgotten the names of and then my own direct experiences. I never had much of an intellectual or scholarly knowledge of her. Where I am now, I need that, some kind of scriptural foundation or other authority. I can't just add things willy nilly. Just the way I am.
Lilith comes to those women who sought after love and despite intense efforts are rejected and thrown away but also who share her view of nature and it's relation to femininity and sexuality. To her men are hopeless viruses. A plague on all life forms. Even so she requires their sexual virility to gain her strength. For those of us who look to her we see her pain and anguish as it mirrors our own giving rise to a bond. We offer up men to her who have wasted our love and affection in exchange for her gifts of beauty and pleasure from her. Through us the men she chooses for us are enslaved and drained. They age quicker and we gain some her life force in exchange. She is hidden from common knowledge and the programming of this world because it is a world ruled by the virus of men. The "creator" of this reality and the ruler of this world would see her as a threat.So throughout centuries she stays cloaked in mystery like all more minor witches of the druidic strain. She was once one of us a more advanced version of our race many eons ago but she has survived connecting with the despair of the female curse. She connects with the few who see her and let go of the illusion of romantic love. She is a reminder of the truth which sets women free of patriarchy.This is my experience with her.
 
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