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Anyone know of Nazarene Judaism?

Discussion in 'Interfaith Discussion' started by Nazarene National, Apr 27, 2016.

?
  1. Yes I do.

    66.7%
  2. No I do not.

    33.3%
  1. Nazarene National

    Nazarene National Nazarene Jew

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  2. George-ananda

    George-ananda Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
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    Nazarene Judaism is the ancient and original
    Jewish sect of the original

    Jewish followers of Yeshua as the Jewish Messiah of Judaism.
    We believe Yeshua came to be the Messiah of Judaism,
    not to create a new non-Jewish religion.

    I cheated and looked it up. What does Messiah mean in this context?
     
  3. Zardoz

    Zardoz Wonderful Wizard
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    I'm an Ebionite, similar. The term Nazarene is often hijacked by various church movements.
     
  4. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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  5. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    Personally think the Essenes, who had made a dedication to be separated to God, are Nazar and Essenes... Which is where the term came from in the Bible Nazarenes.

    The early followers of Yeshua were called, "Followers of the Way" or "the Poor ones (Ebionites)".

    Using the definition of Christian to refer to these movements in anyway, intermingles numerous religious beliefs, that most of these groups would be shocked at....Specifically:
    • jesus coming as a human sacrifice.
    • jesus being the 'I Am' statements.
    • That you have to drink alcohol, and swear an oath it is a sacrifice.
    • Believing in jesus to gain salvation.
    • That, "there is atonement from the death of the righteous..."
    • etc....
    Basically most of Christianity, from the gospel of John, the teachings of Paul, and Simon the stone (petros).

    Curious if people make this distinction when questioning these sects of Judaism, as at their origins, these writings weren't the basis for belief as they are now, and it is interesting to compare the differences, to see what was the original idea of Yeshua.. :innocent:
     
  6. Nazarene National

    Nazarene National Nazarene Jew

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    An anointed one to redeem his people. (Mashiach) One who deserves a kingdom or a right. (Shiloh)
     
  7. Nazarene National

    Nazarene National Nazarene Jew

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    That is true. The original Nazarene were Torah-observant Jews.
     
  8. Nazarene National

    Nazarene National Nazarene Jew

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    Well it depends on context. The Nazarene did use the mainstream cannons of Scripture for quite a while. If you read those statements in a Jewish context, it would make sense to a 1st century Nazarene Jew. For example, in Judaism, a righteous human can atone for his people, that belief has existed before the B'rit Chadasha was even written. In Judaism, the Word (Memra or Dabar) is like the "hand of Hashem". It acts a a mediator between the divine and the mortal. So when Yeshua said "I Am" he is refering to himself as the Memra which is a power of Hashem. The premise of Nazarene Judaism is the belief that belief in Yeshua saves. In the Tanakh, you had to believe in "messiahs" and prophets just as we believe in Yeshua. Once seen in a Jewish context, it seems more pliable. :)
     
  9. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    What does it mean to "believe in" - for example - Saul or Micah, and where in the Tanakh am I instructed to do so?
     
  10. George-ananda

    George-ananda Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
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    What could that possibly look like in the modern world of 2016?
     
  11. Zardoz

    Zardoz Wonderful Wizard
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    Yes, but I think they would more likely call themselves Ebionites (Poor ones, as in humble - poor in spirit). Nazarene would probably be a label that others would use to refer to them. They would not all be in or from the region of Nazareth anyways, even if the etymology of the name is from place name.
     
  12. Zardoz

    Zardoz Wonderful Wizard
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    Pretty accurate, clearly shows that we don't know very much truth about the early Jewish followers of Yeshua, as almost all info comes from the early Roman church. The church labeled them heretics and worked to destroy them, which it accomplished by the fourth century. Nothing drew the ire of the early church as much as those who promoted Torah, and it labeled all who did so as 'Judaisers'.
     
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  13. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
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    There wasn't a place called Nazareth... Nazar means to be separated to God, like within Nazarite.

    Matthew 2:23 and came and lived in a city called Nazareth; that it might be fulfilled which was spoken through the prophets: "He will be called a Nazarene."

    We've even now created a place called Nazareth to make it fit; yet as saying previously it is more likely that Nazar Essene became one term, and people got confused. ;)
     
  14. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    Thank you.

    I found the following to be somewhat confusing ...


    I find the reference to virgin birth confusing. How does one "believe that Christ, the son of God, was born of the Virgin Mary, ... who suffered under Pontius Pilate and ascended to heaven" while exalting Jesus as "a just man" And how can one maintain Jesus to be "the one who suffered under Pontius Pilate" while embracing the Gospel of Peter when:


    Any thoughts?
     
  15. Zardoz

    Zardoz Wonderful Wizard
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    Yes, that's why I said "...even if the etymology of the name is from place name" because the existence of it is in dispute; and no debate is permitted in comparative religion forum, so I wanted to keep it open.
     
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  16. Zardoz

    Zardoz Wonderful Wizard
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    Well, as we all know the victors write the history books; so it's not a surprise to me that the roman church would turn Pontius Pilate into a victim almost.and lay the blame with the Jews.
     
  17. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    So, are you among those who believe that Theodoret erred when he said ...

    ‘The Nazaraeans are Jews who know Christ as a righteous man, and use the Gospel called “according to Peter”.’
    ... and was confusing the Gospel of Peter with Hebrews?

    I guess that my second question would be: Do you accept Peter as authoritative scripture?
     
  18. Zardoz

    Zardoz Wonderful Wizard
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    I'm afraid I'm not going to be able to give a meaningful answer right now. I'm moving, and all my books are packed. All I have is a Chumash with Rashi and a Siddur.

    As a general principal, I do not accept anything from this period as 'authoritative scripture' without reservation.

    Everything is translated, compiled, and repackaged from earlier sources. Anything in those sources not fitting accepted dogma is modified or discarded.

    Without access to these sources, I try to recompile them from the available corrupted texts. Separate the 'wheat from the chaff' as it were, to find what I think was the original teachings.
     
  19. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    Thanks, @Zardoz. Good luck with the move.
     
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