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Answering Questions on my Posts and Complements

Discussion in 'Interfaith Discussion' started by God is love, Feb 2, 2006.

  1. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    This regards my post
    "Guru Nanak quote, Make a boat of the sacred name then with the oars of faith cross the..." in Sikhism

    "Sikhism" as in the username

    Your comment "Humility is an important part of Sikhism"

    Two Sikh scriptures you quoted in the post, I wanted to quote here because I particularly like them.

    "When egotism departs then the state of supreme dignity is obtained."

    "Peace is obtained through devotional worship of the Lord"

    Being humble is an important part to being able to worship a supreme being because in order to worship a supreme being, you would have to recognize that supreme being is
    supreme, better than self.

    Thank you for sharing your Sikh scriptures with me.

    Here's mine that apply to humility, that you brought up.

    verse 8
    "When thou art bidden {invited} of any man to a wedding, sit not down in the highest room..."
    verse 9
    "And he that bade {invited} thee ...come and say to thee, Give this man {another person} place and thou begin with shame to take the lowest room."
    verse 10
    "But when thou art bidden {invited}, go and sit in the lowest room that when he that bade thee cometh , he may say unto thee, Friend go up higher then shalt thou have worship {respect or honor} in the presence of them that sit with thee."
    verse 11
    "For whosoever exalteth {haughtiness} himself shall be abased {humbled} and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted."

    Luke 14:8-11

    "And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your servant."
    Matthew 20.27

    Fallen Goddess to follow
    I'm connecting with you with just one sentence
     
  2. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    Fallen Goddess

    Thank you, Fallen Goddess
    You really make me feel good!

    First
    You appreciate my posts, whatever may be benefitting you.
    Any benefit is good.

    Second and more importantly to me
    You recognize {unlike others} that I do it with love.
    You feel that, you feel the love.
    You must be a sensitive person to sense that love.

    :hug:

    Let me say, your name is "Fallen Goddess" but you haven't fallen that far.

    If you love love, you are on the way up!

    :dan:

    I love the boomerang effect of love. I've sent it and this time it cam back to me.
    You are the only person other than Moses the Archtype that has returned it. Thankyou.

    I hope you see this.
    Sending love again.
     
  3. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    This is the response to my post'"Embracing Good...." in Unitarian Universalist

    Soma

    Your comment "Attain Christ consciousness"
    I love the sound of that.

    Another of your comments "it is perfect consciousness"

    Another comment "in it all potential is actualized"

    Another "The diversity in different world faiths diminishes as one approaches Christ consciousness"

    I think these are worth repeating here to view and reflect to see what potential it has to enlighten.

    When I think of the comment "The diversity in different world faiths diminishes as one approaches Christ consciousness."

    I think og the "Golden rule" that is found in most religeons, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

    I have mentioned this before but it bears repeating again as it applies to this post as well. There is a websire called "Global Oneness". On it it lists religeons that share this "Golden Rule". I list them earlier in this thread. The list is found within my response to comments made in my Taoism post. I also list the religeons with all the quotes from the individual religeons' religious texts that promote this "Golden Rule".

    Davidium

    Your comment
    "to not take the bible on faith but to really seek to understand it, set in it's context and learn from it."
    I'm guessing, you are saying, to not believe untill you know what you are believing or why you should believe it..

    Another comment
    "To me, the lessons and truths I take away from the bible due to such critical study are so much more profound than if I simply believed."

    You mention studying the writings of the students of Confucius. Confucius has so many similar principles to Christianity that although it isn't a religeon, I made a post in Eastern Religeons {since the reorganization, I don't know where it is now} about the great principles he taught. I think the title is "Confucius taught great principles"
    There are compatible with all Eastern Religeons as well as Christianity.

    Nozem

    One of your comments
    "I view the Sermon on the Mount as one of the greatest texts known to humanity but also view the Tao Te Ching in the same manner"

    I call the Beatitudes, the Be Attitudes {a play on words}

    Another of you comments
    "To accept superficially what one reads in any text without truly believing what is being said just causes inner friction and disharmony. One type of behavior Jesus would not tolerate were people who could only give an outward display of religious piety without real understanding."

    Another comment
    "It is hard to imagine any other time besides the 21 century where literate people has so much information at thier fingertips to read if they choose to do so."
    They should avail themselves

    More to come
    Next Jamaesi
     
  4. ChrisP

    ChrisP Veteran Member

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    Ummm G is L, I'm not sure anyone's reading this...................
     
  5. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    I'll start with your quote of a quote from UUA.Org

    "Classically Unitarian Universalist Christians have understood Jesus as a savior because he was a God filled human being..." continuing with the rest of it "He was and still is for many Unitarian Universalists, an example, one who has shown the way of redemptive love, in whose spirit anyone may live generously and abundantly. Among us, Jesus' human life and
    teaching have been understand as products of and in line with, the great Jewish tradition of prophets and teachers..."

    I'm answering your question, "Are you trying to show similarities?"
    Yes
    I'm just sharing similarities. Sharing isn't converting.
    Converting is a process of study, reflection and prayer
    {ask God who He is and what He wants you to believe and live and do for Him and others} It is a process of investigating the doctrines, testing the principles and having a testimony through prayer, a witness of the Holy Spirit or witness through your own observation. "By their fruits ye shall know them" You know a doctrine or principle if good when it produces good fruit, produces good.

    Some people who are baptized aren't converted if they are just going through the motions. There is a conversion of the mind that is knowing that your know the the doctrine are true and a conversion of the heart, that is, wanting to live the principles.

    So to answer your question, I am not attempting to convert you, that is entirely up to you and it is between you and God. I am just sharing principles, truths.

    I didn't say that Unitarian Universalists believe that Jesus is the son of God.
    I said, quoting my comment in the post, "Unitarian Universalists don't have a definite concept of God, however they think Jesus as a Jewish prophet {quoting the article on Religious Tolerance.Org}, that was divinely inspired and a supreme example of goodness. That is what I read on the website I discovered that website before this.
    I also read that Unitarian Universalists believe that Jesus shows our supreme potential.

    I thought the "Unity Church" maybe a brance of the Unitarian Universalists as I thought Unitarian was. The "Unity Church" believes that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

    I thought that Unitarian Universalists believe in embracing everything good or anything good. So I'm sharing some good I have to share.

    I'm also sharing what we agree upon and there are examples of those in the post and what is similar or relevant. At least in sharing what we agree upon we have a portion of UNITY as regarding that principle or principles or that particular doctrine. Unity is what
    the "Global Oneness" project that I found on the website of that name, is trying to achieve for world peace and to solve global issues that effect us. So I'm thinking that this is a time of {cohesion, not the best speller} not doctrines dividing. I shared the websire with Maize and wonder if she likes it. I thought of her somehow when I saw it.

    More to come, Jazzalta
     
  6. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    I didn't say that the "Unity Church", their only book is the bible. I said, because I read, that "it is their text book" so I was puzzeled as to why they thought there were other paths when the bible was their text book. It sounded like it was their instruction manual and the other books were to supplement. When I say this, I'm not disputing, I'm explaining.

    I think, in the beginning of every person's search for truth , those who seek to find truth must search everwhere because truth, whole truth, has been splintered into pieces and scattered everywhere. There are pieces of truth in various religeons, some more than others. I've been collecting them along the way. I've been putting them together as I find them, unifying truths that are compatible.

    Knowing truth doesn't contradict itself, those that contradict, you have to study, compare and make a judgement call. I avail myself of the Holy Spirit to guide me. Like a magnifying glass the Holy Spirit magnifies the truth to you so you can discern which of two conflicting doctrines is true.

    I heard a cute humorous saying
    "When there's a disagreement between members of a church, how do you know whose side God is on?"
    Ask God {pray} The Holy Spirit will reveal, if your prayer is humble, sincere and you haven't already formed a biased view.

    The Holy Spirit can direct a person to where there is the most truth.

    I'll finish with one of your comments that I like
    "On my desk I have a Qur'an, a copy of the Tao and a Bible. They seem to reside in peace together. I wish all their followers could do the same." Good comment!
     
  7. jewscout

    jewscout Religious Zionist

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    i find your understanding of the laws regarding sacrifice lacking, your insistense on Jesus as a kosher sacrifice as appauling and your attempt to state that one can be christian and jewish decieving.:mad:

    to see Jesus or anyone else a source of salvation, the only path to heaven and connection to Hashem is, halachically, IDOLITRY!!

    and to state otherwise is to pretend that John 14:6 and almost anything attributed to Paul doesn't exist.
     
  8. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    Response to was written on my post
    "Servant Candle of Chanukah, how we can light others until he who is the light comes"

    I agree that the servant candle is at a higher height to identify it as such.

    The light of the Minorah {candle stick} that is placed by the window for all to see is symbolic of the Lord and spiritual light {TRUTH}.

    How it is symbolic of the Lord

    Psalms 27:1
    "The Lord is my Light and my Salvation,
    whom shall I fear, The Lord is the strength of my life, of whom shall I be afraid."

    Isaiah 2:5
    "O, house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the Lord."

    Micah 7:8
    "Rejoice not against me, O mine enemy, when I fall, I shall arise, when I sit in darkness, the Lord shall be a light unto me."


    Psalms 36:9
    "...In thy light we shall see light"

    2 Samuel 23:4 "And he shall be as the light of morning..."

    How it is symbolic of truth

    Psalms 43:3 " O, send out thy light and thy truth, let them lead me, let them bring me unto thy holy hill..." Light is Truth. Holy Hill in this passage sound like the Temple Mount, where there Temple used to be and will be again. Minorahs {excuse any spelling errors as
    I am not the best speller} have been placed on tops of hills and lit up. Whether intentionally or not, they are symbolically, in a spiritual sense, lighting the way.

    Psalms 119.105 "Thy word is a lamp unto my feet."
    The word is what is written that G-D said.
    Therefore the Word {Word of G-D} is Light

    This then is the equation: The Truth is Light, The Word of G-D is Light
    The Word of G-D is Truth and Truth is Light

    So the statement, "Let your light so shine before men that they may see your good works.", although it's not in the Old Testement {history of the Old Covenant},
    it is in harmony with Psalms 43:3 and 119:105 in that if we have the truth, the knowledge of G-D within us through reading His word, the word of G-D, the scriptures
    then we have the light within us {in a spiritual sense}.

    When the truth shines within us it is a light to others. When we live the truth, G-D's principles, we are a lamp of His word and they will see our good works, living examples of G-D's principles.

    "Neither do men light a candle and put it under a bushel but on a candle stick and it giveth light unto all that are in the house." This light of truth is a spiritual light and should be interpreted as such. Although, it is true, that a physical light would also provide a physical light to those that are in the house. However, in terms of what I was saying, about the symbolism of the Minorah, it is the light of truth within us {not a physical light} that shines forth and lights others with the truth.

    So I agree that the light of the candles are not to be used for the productive purpose of providing a physical light. I never said that it was to provide a physical light. It provides a spiritual representation of spiritual light as described above.

    I never said that Chanukah was mentioned in the scriptures, however a part of Chanukah, the candles that are light and that being a representation of spiritual light, is alluded to in the scriptures I have posted here. They have a spiritual significance as illustrated.

    More to come
     
  9. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    In response to Jewscout's comment

    Galations 3:10
    "For as many are of the works of the law are under a curse, for it is written, "cursed is everrone that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them."

    This is saying that it is written in the Torah that "Cursed is everyone that continueth not in all things whaich are written in the book of the law.

    Deut 11:28
    "And a curse, if you will not obey the commandments"

    Deut 27:15-26
    These vereses are a list of curses...

    Deut 27:26
    "Cursed be he that confirmeth not all the words of this law to do them."

    Deut 28:15
    "But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the Lord, thy God, to observe to do all His commendments and His statutes which I command thee this day, that all these curses shall upon thee and overtake thee."

    Deut 29:20
    "...and all the curses that are written in this book shall lie upon him..."

    2 Chronicles 34:24
    "...and upon the inhabitants thereof , even all the curses that are written in the book which they have read before the king of Judah."

    Jeremiah 11:3
    "...cursed be the man that obeyeth not the words of this covenant."

    Daniel 9:11
    "Yea, all Israel have transgressed thy law, evene by departing, that they might not obey thy voice, therefore the curse is poured out upon us, and the oath that is written in the law of Moses, the servant of God because we have sinned against Him."

    Malachi 2:2
    "If ye will not hear and if ye will not lay it to heart, to give glory unto my name, saith the Lord of hosts, I will even send a curse upon you and I will curse your blessings, yea I have cursed them already because ye do not lay it to heart."

    Galatians was saying that many are "of the law" {because of} the law {Moses} under a curse that Moses' law imposed upon the Children of Israel. It was a form of negative reinforcement. Quoting Deut 27:26 again "cursed be he that confirmeth not all the words of this law to do them."

    The New Testement {history of the New Covenant} wouldn't be cursing because the atonement of Jesus Christ removed the curses of the Torah with a New Covenant of repentence and forgiveness.

    Galatians was just quoting a verse of Deuteronomy.

    More to come
     
  10. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    Quoting you "The Jewish concept of Messiah isn't God in the flesh who dies for sins."

    Isaiah 7:14 "Therefore the Lord Himself shall give you a sign.......and shall cal His name Immanuel {G-D with us}." That sound like G-D in the flesh, amonst us. When the Lord was in a cloud by day and a fire by night leading the children of Israel, He was amongst them but not in the flesh. However in the Isaiah verse, a child is conceived, and that would be a person in the flesh that would be G-D amongst us.

    Now to address the "dies for sins", part of your sentence.

    I understand that most of the time, when a prophet of G-D is talking about G-D saving that the prophet is talking about deliverence from enemies, protection from harm, physical safety. However Isaiah 43:25 speak of the Lord "blotting out thy transgressions."
    Isaiah 43:25
    "I, even I, am He that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, and will not remember thy sins." G-D in this verse is redeeming transgressors. This is what Kind David longed for in his Psalm 39:8 "Deliver me from my transgressions."

    You also comment that "G-D states only one G-D." I understand why you would think that because of Isaiah 43:10 "I am He , before Me there was no other G-D formed."

    Genesis 1:26 mentions two being that created the earth and us.
    Genesis 1:26
    "Let US make man in OUR own image"

    They said they would make man in their image so they were males. One must have been Heavenly Father, the Father of our spirits. Number 16:22 "...the G-D of the spirits of all flesh..." Daniel reveals the other in Daniel 3:25 "Lo, I see four men walking in the midst of the fire and they wern't harmed and the form of the fourth was like the Son of G-D."
    Three of the four men were Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego, who were cast into the fiery furnace. Nebuchadnezzar was astonished when he saw four because because only three were thrown in. Daniel 3:24 " Then Nebuchadnezzar the king was astonished and rose up in haste, and spake and said unto his counsellors, Did we not cast three men bound into the midst of the fire? They answered and said unto the king, Trus, O, king."The king said in verse 25 "...the form of fourth is like the Son of G-D"

    If there is a Son Of G-D as mentioned in Daniel then by reason of the fact there would have to be a Father G-D. Those are the two G-Ds, Father and Son that were in
    Genesis 1:26 One of them spoke and said "Let us make man in our own image"

    Also in Genesis 3:22 "And the Lord said, Behold, the man Adam has become as one of US

    Isaiah 45:17 says "Israel shall be saved in the Lord."
    So one of these Heavenly Beings is a Savior.

    Isaiah 41:14 "The Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel."

    Now to the Isaiah verse 43:10 again. "...before me there was no other G-D formed."
    There was obviously a G-D before the Son of G-D because that G-D was His Father.
    There was no other form of G-D before Heavenly Father. Form as in kind of G-D.
    Putting it all together. There is only one kind of G-D and He is a supreme being, the most intelligent, omniscient. He is the Father of our spirits. He made our spirits before we came to earth.

    One of them was the most rightious spirit of us, His spirit children. He was chosen to cocreate this earth with Heavenly Father, He was also chosen to be the messenger, to deliver the truths and principles to Abraham, Jacob and Moses on earth. In addition to speak to the children of Israel then through His chosen prophets and to reveal the future through them to us in our generation. Being the most rightious, He was a perfect example of G-D's principles. Therefore He was chosen to be conceived and made flesh to be a living example to us of how we should live the principles. He was also chosen to be the Savior, Redeemer that is mentioned in Isaiah 43:25

    In the same chapter
    Isaiah 43:11 "I, even I, am the Lord and beside me there is no Savior." The Lord, the chosen messenger, is speaking to Isaiah and He is saying that beside Him,
    {who in verse 25 is saying He will blot out thy trangressions, redeem them"
    there is no other Savior. He is the one and only Savior, who will redeem them from transgressions.

    more to come
    "The Servant" in response to Deut's question
     
  11. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    Isaiah scriptures;

    Isaiah 41.8-9
    "But thou, Israel, art my servant {in this verse} Jacob, whom I have chosen."

    Just because Israel is a servant in this scripture, that does not mean that G-D doesn't have other servants. Moses was called a servant.

    44:1-2
    "Yet now hear, O, Jacob, my servant and Israel, whom I have chosen"
    Jacob = Servant and Israel=Chosen {In this verse}

    However in 41.8
    Israel=Servant and Jacob=Chosen

    "Thou art my servant, I have chosen thee"
    This is saying "chosen servant" G-D has other chosen servants.

    45:4
    "For Jacob my servant and Israel mine elect."
    Jacob=servant and Israel=elect

    I have called thee, Israel, by thy name. I have surnamed thee, thou hast not known Me."
    G-D has chosen {elected} and called, Israel
    "...though thou has not known Me"
    Israel departed from the faith, abandoned laws and scattered. They didn't pass on the laws and principles to their children so the children did not know them, G-D's ways, they didn't know G-D.

    48:20
    "The Lord hath redeemed His servant Jacob"
    The Lord redeemed Jacob, Jacob {the tribe}
    didn't redeem or justify themselves.

    So when justify is next to the word servant, neither Jacob or Israel is the servant.

    More to come
     
  12. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    Isaiah 49:3
    "Thou art my servant, O Israel, in whom, I will be glorified."
    Verse 1 "the Lord hath called me from the womb..."
    If this were Israel the word would be "us"
    Called {chosen} is with the word "me"
    If me=Isaiah then Isaiah has been called or chosen.
    This shows that an individual {not just a nation} has been called to be a servant.

    How these, the servant Jacob and the servant Israel and the servant Isaiah, conform
    is that G-D has called Jacob {renamed Israel} either as an individual or as the nation of Israel. Isaiah has also been called to be a servant. If G-D is calling the nation of Israel to be a servant, then individuals of the House of Israel, would by virtue of that, be servants themselves.

    That being said, any person that is of the House of Israel is a servant.
    Jesus of Nazareth was of the House of Israel throught the tribe of Judah. He is qualified to be called a servant too.
     
  13. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    If the servant is Israel plural {House of Israel} and not Jacob=Israel individual then of those called to be servants of the House of Israel, there are a precious few that answer the call. G-D chooses amongst those precious few, the very righteous to be special servants like Moses and Isaiah. Those that are special servants are called "Chosen".

    As mentioned before, Jesus, having been born into the House of Israel, has been called to be a servant as well on earth and He has been chosen by Heavenly Father, to be the example and the atonement, a special servant.

    Genesis 1:26
    " G-D said, "Let US make man in OUR image, after OUR likeness..."

    Genesis 3:22
    "The Lord G-D said , Behold the man is become as one of US ..."
    Jesus Christ was with G-D as co creator of this earth. He was the most righteous of all the spirt children of Heavenly Father. Heavenly Father choose Him to be a special servant.

    Verse 2 of Isaiah 49
    "He { G-D} hath made my mouth like a sharp sword in the shadow of His hand."
    The "MY" again, not "our" and "MOUTH" not "mouths"
    "made my mouth like a sharp sword" sounds like what a prophet would do, specifically. He speaks to inform, reprove, warn. That is like a mouth with a sharp tongue or "sword".

    Verse 3
    "And said unto me {not us}, Thou art my servant, O, Israel."
    I see agin that G-D is speaking to an individual "me" about Israel being a servant, that the children of israel should serve Him.
    "...in whom I will be glorified." Good works glorify G-D. In serving Him they glorify G-D.

    If you don't believe that all children of Israel are servants then how could Israel be a servant if all Isarelites weren't servants? All Israelites have to be servants in order for Israel as a nation to be a servant. that qualifies Jesus of Nazareth to be a servant either way you look at it.

    More to come
     
  14. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    Isaiah 42:19-20
    "Who is blind but my servant that I sent?" The servant is blind and the messenger is deaf.
    A perfect servant isn't blind. A messenger doesn't have to hear to deliver a message but a blind servant would not be able to serve well. This is a spiritual blindness. A servant that is spiritually blind would not be able to serve G-D because he wouldn't know how. Blindness is darkness, the opposite of light and truth.

    Light is truth, spiritually, like the Chanakah candles which represent light as truth or truth as light. That is probably the reason the candles are not used for physical light in the house. So they are viewed as spiritual light. That is what I was trying to say in the original post in Messianic Judaism. I thought it was a beautiful analogy. One of my favorite posts.

    A spiritually blind person wouldn't have truth because he wouldn't know it, understand it, {see it}. A person who doesn't know truth would not be able to be perfect, a perfect example of G-D's principles. A person has to know how to be perfect, know the principles and live them perfectly, to be perfect.

    Dead Sea Scrolls version is
    "Who is as blind as the self confident and as blind as Yhwh's servant?"
    In other words, "who is blind as the servant?"
    "Who is blind as the self confident"
    This sounds like the servant is blind because of over self confidence. He thinks he knows all he needs to know and therefore does not seek truth or he thinks he knows better than the prophets. This is a false confidence because he is not confident in the truth. He is confident in spiritual darkness, confident that he is right. Those who seek the truth through study of G-D's word, scriptures, and prayer, seeking the Spirit of G-D that reveals truth to you become confident in the truth revealed.

    So how can the children of Israel be able to serve if they are spiritually blind? How can the children of Israel serve G-D? They wouldn't know how if they didn't know the truth.

    You say the servant is the children of Israel. If the children of Israel are the servant then they are called to serve but in this scripture they are spiritually blind. They don't understand, at least some, truth. You said it yourself in saying that. They were called to serve but most of them did not accept the call.

    By Torah standard either physical or spiritual blindness would be imperfect. By Torah rules those who were physically damaged did not serve in the temple.

    More to come
     
  15. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    The only way to make reasonable sense of this part of the sentence, "who is blind, that is perfect?", is that maybe Isaiah is posing a question. The answer would be that nobody that is perfect is blind or nobody blind is perfect.

    Verse 20
    "Seeing many things but thou observest not, opening the ears but he heareth not."
    This sounds like Isaiah 6:10
    "Go and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not and see ye indeed but perceive not." Isaiah 5:21 seems relatable to Isaiah 42:19 {The Dead Sea Scrolls} "Woe, unto them that are wise in their own eyes and prudent in their own sight." "wise in their own eyes" sounds like the other Dead sea scroll Isaiah verse "Who is blind as the self confident?"
    Some self confident people are wise in their own eyes.

    Isaiah 43:10-11
    "Ye Israel, are my witness, saith the Lord and my servant."
    Israel is a servant and a witness.
    "...whom I have chosen that ye may know and believe me {faith} ..."
    The children of Israel were chosen to know G-D first. He revealed His laws and truths to them through Moses and the prophets. They were to be a LIGHT to the Gentiles with the truths that were revealed to them. Now the Gentiles are a LIGHT.

    More to come
     
  16. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    "Before Me there was no G-D formed {other form of G-D} neither shall there be after Me {another form of G-D}."

    Verse 11
    "I, even I, am the Lord and beside me there is no Savior."
    I'll explain this scripture with Exodus 6:2
    "And G-D spake unto Moses and said unto him, I am the Lord and I appeared unto Abraham, unto Jacob, by the name of G-D Almighty but by my name Jehovah was I not known unto them."
    G-D is saying that He is Lord therefore Lord is another name for G-D. He is also saying that He appeared unto Abraham and Jacob by the name Amighty G-D. So Almighty G-D is another name for Lord. Therefore G-D, Almighty G-D = Lord.

    ".......I was not known unto them."
    This is saying that there was a time that The LORD was not known as the Almighty G-D.

    Isaiah 41:14
    "Fear not, thou worm Jacob and ye men of Israel, I will help thee saith the LORD thy REDEEMER.
    Now we see the word REDEEMER with LORD
    Therefore REDEEMER = LORD and LORD = ALMIGHTY G-D Therefore
    REDEEMER equals ALMIGHTY G-D

    Exodus 3:14
    "And G-D said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM {it is written in capitals in scripture}

    Verese 15
    "And G-D said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel. The Lord G-D of your fathers, the G-D of Abraham, the G-D of Isaac and the G-D of Jacob, hath sent me unto you, this is My name forever and this is my memorial."

    Hosea 12:5

    "Even the Lord of hosts, the Lord is His memorial."

    Psalms 135:13
    "Thy name, O Lord, endureth forever and thy memorial, O lord, throughout all generations."

    The G-D of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is My name forever.
    Thy name Lord endureth forever.

    The Lord = the G-D of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob {these names endure forever}
    Lord = Redeemer therefore Redeemer= the G-D of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob

    Isaiah 45:17
    "But ISRAEL shall be SAVED IN THE LORD with an EVERLASTING SALVATION."

    Israel shall be saved IN THE LORD and LORD = REDEEMER.
    as already established in Isaiah 41:14
    Therefore Israel shall be saved in the redeemer, a redeemer that is Lord, G-D Almighty.

    Other scriptures:

    Isaiah 47:4
    "As for our Redeemer, the Lord of hosts is His name, the Holy One of Israel."

    Isaiah 48:17
    "Thus saith thy Lord, thy Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel..."

    Isaiah 63.9
    "In all their affliction He was afflicted...in His love and in His pity He redeemed them..."

    More to come
     
  17. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    Now to verse 11 again "I, even, I, am the Lord and beside me there is no Savior."
    We have already established that Lord = Redeemer and now "In all their affliction He was afflicted and In His love and His pity He redeemed them."
    Therefore Redeeming = afflicted.
    The equation then is The Lord = Redeemer and Redeeming = Afflicted

    Therefore The Lord, G-D Almighty, the G-D of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the Redeemer was afflicted, He redeemed being afflicted.

    The definition of a Savior {in the dictionary} is to recue in the physical sense from danger, from enemies. The definition of a Redeemer is to save from sin. Redeem is to make amends, to save from sin. {quoting Websters Pocket Dictionary}

    Why would He need to redeem, save from sin.
    Isaiah 59:1-8 {I'll just quote verse 2}
    "But your iniquities have separated between you and your G-D."
    Iniquity seperates man from the Lord

    Exodus 6:6
    "I will redeem you with out stretched arm..."
    This is about bringing you out "from under the burdens of the Egyptians"

    Exodus 14:13
    "See the servant of the Lord which He will show to you today for the Egyptians whom ye have seen today, ye shall see them again no more, forever."

    These are examples of saving physically, a physical deliverence. But Isaiah 44:22 speaks of the Lord redeeming in another way.
    Isaiah 44:22
    "I have blotted out as a thick cloud thy transgressions and as a cloud thy sins. Return unto me for I have redeemed thee"
    This redemption is not a physical redemption such as the Lord "bring out of Egyptian bondage. This is a spiritual redemption.

    David in his Psalms desired this kind of redemption when he said,
    "deliver me from all my transgressions."

    The Redeemer is Jesus Christ, He was afflicted. He redeemed being afflicted and there has been no other Savior that has been afflicted in order to redeem nor will there be as He said "Beside me, there is no Savior"

    The Lord was both and "Beside me there is no other." That is because the Lord is the Savior and Redeemer.

    More to come
     
  18. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    Jesus Christ made the atonement and only an atonement redeems as that is the law of Moses. He offered Himself as an atonement fulfilling scripture already mentioned and discussed before. The ever familiar Isaiah 53.
    In verse 5 "He was wounded for our transgressions"
    verse 6 "The Lord hath laid on Him {self} the iniquity of us all."
    verse 7 "When thou shall make thy soul an offering {self sacrifice}."

    Isaiah 59:1-8 explains the reason for the necessity of the atonement as mentioned before "But your iniquities have seperated between you and your G-D."

    As mentioned before in Genesis 1:26 and 3:22, there was more than one creator of this world and they were as revealed before, Father and Son. Just to reiterate Genesis 1:26
    "And G-D said, Let US make man in OUR image, after OUR likeness..." There had to have been two beings as G-D. They had the same knowledge and power to create and authority to do so.

    Genesis 3:22 "And the Lord, G-D said, Behold the man {Adam} has become as one of US, to know good from evil."
    That is to say that Adam was not ignorant anymore. He knew he had sinned, he knew then what sin was. So Adam was able to recognize sin as G-D was able to recognize sin.
    So Adam had that knowledge of what sin is as G-D already had.

    More to come
     
  19. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    We know that there is a Father of our spirits from the scripture,
    Numbers 16:22
    "G-D of our spirits of all flesh."
    and Malachi 2:10
    "Have we not all one father? Hath not one G-D created us?"

    The answer to the first question is yes, He is our Heavenly Father.

    The answer to the second question is yes, Heavenly Father created our spirits from refined matter. That is how He is our Father and He co created with another, His Son,
    {mentioned before in Daniel} to make the earth, the plants, trees, animals and humans. This other that co created with Heavenly Father is His Son, Jesus Christ.

    Isaiah 43:1
    "Thus saith the Lord that CREATED THEE, Jacob and He that Formed thee Israel, Fear not, for I have REDEEMED THEE."
    Therefore the CREATOR = REDEEMER, Jesus Christ, {who redeemed in being afflicted.}

    more to come
    "Definitions of Messianic Judaism"
     
  20. God is love

    God is love Active Member

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    This is why I thought posting a comparison of the servant candle on the Minorah to the righteous servant Jesus Christ, was appropriate to post in Messianic Judaism.

    First I posted on the general Judaism Forum. Messianic Judaism is one of the sub forums.
    If something relates to Judaism in general such as the feasts which {I thought} most Jews of most forms of Judaism keep, and ifI thought it was appropriate. However, Jesus as the Messiah would only has acceptance in Messianic Judaism within Judaism. Therefore I posted there.

    You {Deut} have said that Chanakuh {a feast} or specically a Messiah's relationship to it {literally or figuratively} means nothing to the Jews who believe in a Messiah and celebrate the feasts. That is absolutely not true. Some Jews who are Messainic Jews accept Yeshua, Jesus, as the Moshiach. You "Deut" said that "Nobody cares about Jesus, whatever he said." Members on this website that are Messianic Jews that accept Jesus Christ as their Messiah would care what Jesus taught, very much. Therefore I should have a right to include Him there, in Messianic Judaism.

    "JewScout"
    replied to my post with this statement that was above yours so I'm surprised you didn't read it before commenting.

    Quoting JewScout's statement
    "The other way of defining {a Messianic Jew} is a person who believes that Jesus fulfilled that role. Therefore a Messianic Jew may be a person who

    1. Believes in a Messianic Age

    2. Believes in a Messiah

    3. Believes Jesus Christ is the Messiah

    End of quote. I descided to number them for easier reference.
    I agree with Jewscout, my defintion is all the above constitutes Messianic Judaism.
    Therefore I would have a right to mention Jesus christ as the Moshiach because some within Messianic Judaism would believe Him to be.

    Therefore "Jews for Jesus " as you "Deut" call them is not an oxymoron. I have already given my reason as to why Jesus is for the Jews in another post within Messianic Judaism. What I have said will suffice as a defense. I am not into debate.

    If there are Messianic Jews that choose option 3 on list and accept Jesus Christ as the Moshiach, that come to this website and to the Messianic Judaism forum, who want to become members and post, maybe they want to support this website financially, They should feel welcome and at peace amongst us. They should have the opportunity within Messianic Judaism, to see a post that mentions jesus christ as the Moshiach, if they so choose.

    If all Jews accept a Moshiach then why was there a sub forum. it must be that not all Jews accept a Moshiach. It is also true that not all Messianic Jews do not accept Jesus Christ as the Moshiach.

    All grass is green but not all things that are green are grass.
    This was not my lesson to learn, it was yours.
    To be more accurate some grass isn't green.

    I was shocked how you worded things on this post but I said in an earlier part of this thread that I would answer your questions and I am being true to my word as regarding past posts. The future is in question.
     
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