Animal Rights

[michel]

Wow this subject is not an easy one......

 

[huajiro]

I believe the only difference between animals and ourselves is that we can reason more. We were given the ability to help ourselves, each other, and the other living beings, but we used this power for personal gain, and do nothing but hurt each other.

 

[DreamQuickBook]

Wow this subject is not an easy one......

It's only complicated when you forget that you too are animal.

 

[almifkhar]

i think it is a damn shame that humans feel the need to feel superior towards other beings. this is my feeling towards this poll
1. i am fine with hunting so long as the hunter is eating the meat and using as much as possible of the animal.
2. i am fine with hunting so long as it is controled. if they are endangered or a preditor they should not be hunted for any reason.
3. any testing on animals is down right wrong and inmoral in my opinion.
4. anyone who abuses and or out right murders an animal for no aparent reason (you know sick and twisted folks) should be held acountable for their actions. and i feel the pentalities should be way stiffer than they already are.
5. i think if you are going to invite an animal to live in your household, one should remember that this animal is not garbage and should not be gotten rid of simply because it no longer fits into your lifestyle.

speaking about mamals in paticular, they think, feel, react, love, hate, and remember just like us humans. it is a scientific proven fact! now with this said, how could we as humans do such horrific things to them? it just angers me to no end when i hear of or see bad things happen to my fellow beings.

 

[huajiro]

i think it is a damn shame that humans feel the need to feel superior towards other beings. this is my feeling towards this poll
1. i am fine with hunting so long as the hunter is eating the meat and using as much as possible of the animal.
2. i am fine with hunting so long as it is controled. if they are endangered or a preditor they should not be hunted for any reason.
3. any testing on animals is down right wrong and inmoral in my opinion.
4. anyone who abuses and or out right murders an animal for no aparent reason (you know sick and twisted folks) should be held acountable for their actions. and i feel the pentalities should be way stiffer than they already are.
5. i think if you are going to invite an animal to live in your household, one should remember that this animal is not garbage and should not be gotten rid of simply because it no longer fits into your lifestyle.

speaking about mamals in paticular, they think, feel, react, love, hate, and remember just like us humans. it is a scientific proven fact! now with this said, how could we as humans do such horrific things to them? it just angers me to no end when i hear of or see bad things happen to my fellow beings.

What if another animal were allowed to hunt humans?
Would hunting season be "ok" with you still?

 

[Ryan2065]

speaking about mamals in paticular, they think, feel, react, love, hate, and remember just like us humans. it is a scientific proven fact! now with this said, how could we as humans do such horrific things to them? it just angers me to no end when i hear of or see bad things happen to my fellow beings.

Ahh, you said the magic words! And your proof is... Wait, no proof? I'll give you think, feel, and react. Love and hate? That is a stretch. Note you said that mamals love and hate. Please do show me where it says these mamal love and hate. What science journal has said such things? Also, as far as memory goes, I have been searching but can not find any studies on how long dogs remember, but I remember reading at one time that it was about 5 minutes dogs remember specific events.

 

[Scuba Pete]

What if another animal were allowed to hunt humans?

Come diving with me my friend.

 

[michel]

Come diving with me my friend.

Well, you do choose to go and 'hunt' fish the way you do; I don't know if you go armed with a spear gun.so I can't 'Judge'. I do have a problem with the way fish - especially shellfish are treated; the way they are caught, starved of air, or hooked by a massive hook through what would be a cheek in us - it may be irrational - because I know that fish are not supposed to feel pain- but how can we honestly be sure ?

 

[Ryan2065]

What if another animal were allowed to hunt humans?

I was not aware that they were not allowed to hunt humans? Is there some universal law that makes it so a hungry bear won't eat me?

 

[Scuba Pete]

Michel,

Underwater I almost always hunt with my bare hands. It gives them spiney lobster a sporting chance. However, my meaning was that IN the ocean, we are NOT the apex predator anymore. We are ourselves often hunted. Bum-buuuuuuump! (Theme to Jaws plays tensely in the background).

 

[DreamQuickBook]

Michel,

Underwater I almost always hunt with my bare hands. It gives them spiney lobster a sporting chance. However, my meaning was that IN the ocean, we are NOT the apex predator anymore. We are ourselves often hunted. Bum-buuuuuuump! (Theme to Jaws plays tensely in the background).

Is hunting more moral wen we are less advantaged?

 

[almifkhar]

i don't remember which nature pbs program i saw it on but i encourage you to check the site on it. the program was about this lady who was raising and teaching gorillas sign language. anyways, she had this male gorilla who she taught how to communicate in sign language and also through art. this gorilla told her of how his mother was shot and killed and cut up in front of his eyes. this is the honest to god truth, i sware it! now it seems to me that this gorilla single handedly proved that mamals other than humans can remember past events of their lives especially tramatic ones, and show emotion about them.
as far as hunting goes, i never said once that i was against it. i am only against trophy hunting, killing just to kill, and killing endangered and preditory animals. if you want to hunt for the meat, well knock your self out. nothing is wrong with that in my opinion.

 

[Ryan2065]

i don't remember which nature pbs program i saw it on but i encourage you to check the site on it. the program was about this lady who was raising and teaching gorillas sign language. anyways, she had this male gorilla who she taught how to communicate in sign language and also through art. this gorilla told her of how his mother was shot and killed and cut up in front of his eyes.

I searched all over the pbs site and can not find what you were talking about. I also searched google and can not find this. Maybe someone else can? Either way a gorilla showing that it can remember does not prove that all mamals everywhere can remember. It only proves that that particular kind of gorilla can remember past events.

 

[BUDDY]

Umm, just curious, but how exactly do you kill the animal humanely?

 

[Ryan2065]

Umm, just curious, but how exactly do you kill the animal humanely?

Well a quick death would be considered more humane than torturing an animal to death... For example...

 

[BUDDY]

Well a quick death would be considered more humane than torturing an animal to death... For example...

So, then in the case of purchasing or selling animal products, why is it important to specifically mention the need for humanely killing an animal, if the practice of torturing and slowly killing animals does not exist? I guess I am intrigued why someone would say, "you can eat meat, but the animal has to have died quickly and not suffered a lot." Why the designation? Is you conscience bruised if you buy a product from the store that was from an animal that took a little longer to die than normal? Just curious, I don't mean to be difficult. In fact, you all could ignore my questions and I won't be upset.

 

[Ryan2065]

So, then in the case of purchasing or selling animal products, why is it important to specifically mention the need for humanely killing an animal, if the practice of torturing and slowly killing animals does not exist? I guess I am intrigued why someone would say, "you can eat meat, but the animal has to have died quickly and not suffered a lot." Why the designation? Is you conscience bruised if you buy a product from the store that was from an animal that took a little longer to die than normal? Just curious, I don't mean to be difficult. In fact, you all could ignore my questions and I won't be upset.

This is quite alright, and good question. I would be sad if I knew that the animals in the products I used were first given to a sadistic little 3rd grader to do what he liked with the animal. There is no need for that. I don't mind an animals death, but causing them more pain than is necessary is wrong.

 

[kreeden]

I also have more sympathy for those in developed societies who hunt than those who utilize "farmed" animals. At least a deer has a chance to lead a proper deer life before he is humanely shot. Most chickens, pigs &c lead only short, miserable, painful lives before they are often inhumanely killed.

That is pretty much the way I see it also . However , I eat meat , and I grew up hunting . And as Michel says , this is a difficult topic . A hunter is never sure of a clean kill . I was taught , as a child , that if the animal is wounded , then you make every possibile effort to finish it . You do not leave the animal to suffer . Not all hunters follow that rule though . And even for those who do , some wounded animals do get away . But they do usually live , and learn from their experience .

 

[Quoth The Raven]

If there ever was a form of totally man made food, I would opt for that, in a flash - even if it was in the form of a pill; to me, that is the only way out of the 'food' cruelty...........

I've got some lovely Soylent Green in the cupboard if you'd like it .

 

[kreeden]

Is you conscience bruised if you buy a product from the store that was from an animal that took a little longer to die than normal?

In my case , no . However , allowing any creature to suffer longer then it has to is cruel in my opinion . Now , you will likely say that the creature doesn't have to suffer , and in some fantasy world , that may be the case . But in this world , everything suffers , and everything dies . So I just think that it is best to get it over with .


And if you think that man can be cruel and heartless , watch Nature in action . Yes , man can be cruel . As can Nature .