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An underlying mental world out there

Discussion in 'Science and Technology' started by atanu, May 24, 2019.

  1. atanu

    atanu Member
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    Bernardo Kastrup suggests:

    For as long as we insist that the world, as it is in itself, must have the forms and contours of the images on the screen of perception, quantum mechanics will continue to be paradoxical. For as long as we believe that physical theory models the shared environment underlying our perceptions—as opposed to the perceptions themselves—quantum mechanics will continue to be puzzling.

    The Universe as Cosmic Dashboard



    Comments welcome.
     
  2. It Aint Necessarily So

    It Aint Necessarily So Well-Known Member
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    It doesn't matter what's really out there. We are confined to our conscious experience, whatever its source, and that mental experience is more important to us than whatever underlies it because that experience is all we have.

    Descartes toyed with the idea of a demon controlling our experiences as if out minds were computer graphics corresponding to no external referent.

    And we have seen other variations of this - hologram, last Thursdayism, brain-in-a-vat, Matrix, etc.. They're interesting ideas, and we must confess that since we have no way to crawl out of the theater of our consciousness, we have no way to test for or against any of them.

    But we also needn't concern ourselves with such ideas as ultimate truth, absolute truth, or objective truth, since subjective truth assumes primacy. If there is such a thing as objective reality, and we get a strong intuition that there is, it's importance is secondary to the subjective reality derived from it.

    These are the rules of conscious existence: We have a parade of conscious content wandering through our minds when awake, some of which is pleasant and desirable to experience, and others unpleasant and undesirable, that is both good and bad feelings and emotions, We also experience conscious content that is neither, such as a bare facts and emotion -free memories. We use the ideas to try to control experience such that we maximize pleasant experience and minimize the unpleasant.

    If we can do that to our satisfaction, it doesn't matter what external reality actually is. It's not that we aren't curious. It's just that we can't know and don't need to know. It's enough that if belief B reliably informs action A such that desired result D is the outcome more consistently than other competing beliefs, then belief B can be called whatever you call useful ideas - true, correct, factual, knowledge - whatever, without fretting over ultimate truth.

    Is that what you were interested in discussing? I had to look to the article since I wasn't sure what point the excerpt was making. Quantum mechanics is paradoxical, and that's never been a problem.
     
  3. atanu

    atanu Member
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    I feel that the blue contradicts the red. I need to know that whether there is a snake or is it a rope appearing as a snake out there?
     
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