An increasing number of trans women seem to be ditching their T-blockers

[PoetPhilosopher]

I found these articles. More information is coming available on the subject of trans women taking estradiol to transition without T-blockers, as more are doing it:

https://diytrans.wiki/Estradiol_monotherapy

https://transicarus.com/can-estradiol-monotherapy-work-for-you-will-you-need-antiandrogens/ (blog, I think, but interesting material)

https://transfemscience.org/articles/high-dose-transdermal-e2/

In posting this, I'm not saying this is the "correct" way, or that there necessarily is a correct one-size-fits-all approach, just that the subject of Estradiol monotherapy - taking estradiol without a T-blocker - is coming up a lot more lately in the trans community. Some trans women are ditching their Spironolactone.

I have my personal experiences and opinions on this subject, but won't be posting them in this thread so as to not influence the discussion too much, especially with there being additional nuances involved in my personal experiences, that other trans women may not necessarily always encounter.

 

[Spirit of Light]

I found these articles. More information is coming available on the subject of trans women taking estradiol to transition without T-blockers, as more are doing it:

https://diytrans.wiki/Estradiol_monotherapy

https://transicarus.com/can-estradiol-monotherapy-work-for-you-will-you-need-antiandrogens/ (blog, I think, but interesting material)

https://transfemscience.org/articles/high-dose-transdermal-e2/

In posting this, I'm not saying this is the "correct" way, or that there necessarily is a correct one-size-fits-all approach, just that the subject of Estradiol monotherapy - taking estradiol without a T-blocker - is coming up a lot more lately in the trans community. Some trans women are ditching their Spironolactone.

I have my personal experiences and opinions on this subject, but won't be posting them in this thread so as to not influence the discussion too much, especially with there being additional nuances involved in my personal experiences, that other trans women may not necessarily always encounter.

Not sure I understand exactly what happens if someone stop using T-blockers, but does it mean a trans person who was born man and transformed into a woman, will become more masculine again?

This was poorly written by me, sorry for that.

 

[Estro Felino]

It depends on the objective.
If the MtF in question intends to have surgery that implies the removal of gonads, it is necessary to get the body used to the absence of the gonads.
So T-blocker is absolutely necessary because it lowers the T level to this value
From 0.20 pg/ml to 0.05 pg/ml
Which are the levels that women have.

If the MtF has a sex life that includes the use of the penis, I do not think T blocker is essential

 

[PoetPhilosopher]

Not sure I understand exactly what happens if someone stop using T-blockers, but does it mean a trans person who was born man and transformed into a woman, will become more masculine again?

This was poorly written by me, sorry for that.

It means that their testosterone level could end up higher, yes, which in some cases, could require a higher dose of estrogen than if they used a T-blocker. I don't see it really as ideal, but the push in the trans community lately to get away from T-blockers, seems to be rooted in the fact that T-blockers sometimes have some bad side effects, sometimes even worse side effects than if they took a mildly higher dose of estrogen.

If someone is considering Hormone Replacement Therapy though, it's best to ask their doctor what is best. I'm only providing talking points - things for people to research themselves and, if it interests them, ask their hormone prescribing doctor about it.

 

[PoetPhilosopher]

Also, @Conscious thoughts - I'd say that a trans woman starting on hormones and starting to look like a female, isn't the result of having her hormones right alone - rather, it's the result of having her hormones right or close to right, for feminization, for many months.

So if a trans woman does achieve the hormone level of a cis female, it doesn't mean they look very feminine -quite- yet. Usually a couple of months have passed by this time, but it takes additional time taking the hormones, sometimes, to see a big difference.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Not sure I understand exactly what happens if someone stop using T-blockers, but does it mean a trans person who was born man and transformed into a woman, will become more masculine again?

Conventional thought holds the body won't as effectively feminize or reduce things like body hair and muscle mass as well without.
Spironolactone doesn't actually repress testosterone to begin with, it just prevents it from being having an effect on the neurotransmitters.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Conventional thought holds the body won't as effectively feminize or reduce things like body hair and muscle mass as well without.
Spironolactone doesn't actually repress testosterone to begin with, it just prevents it from being having an effect on the neurotransmitters.

This OP and your answer have given me a new understanding of this

 

[PoetPhilosopher]

Conventional thought holds the body won't as effectively feminize or reduce things like body hair and muscle mass as well without.
Spironolactone doesn't actually repress testosterone to begin with, it just prevents it from being having an effect on the neurotransmitters.

Hmm, I'm either not positive on that, or you're talking at a higher level than I've gotten to, since I'm just studying androgen receptors right now:

Estrogen down-regulation of androgen receptors in cultured human mammary cancer cells (MCF-7) - PubMed

Got any links?

I was also under the impression that neurotransmitters have to do with the brain and nervous system. Are you thinking of androgen receptors?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Hmm, I'm either not positive on that, or you're talking at a higher level than I've gotten to, since I'm just studying androgen receptors right now:

Estrogen down-regulation of androgen receptors in cultured human mammary cancer cells (MCF-7) - PubMed

Got any links?

I was also under the impression that neurotransmitters have to do with the brain and nervous system. Are you thinking of androgen receptors?

I was.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Conventional thought holds the body won't as effectively feminize or reduce things like body hair and muscle mass as well without.
Spironolactone doesn't actually repress testosterone to begin with, it just prevents it from being having an effect on the neurotransmitters.

As a CIS woman who has taken Spironolactone as treatment for PCOS I can confirm this. Didn't stop facial hair growth or muscle gain for me. Just helped me not retain as much water and helped with some other digestive problems.

 

[Estro Felino]

Hmm, I'm either not positive on that, or you're talking at a higher level than I've gotten to, since I'm just studying androgen receptors right now:

Estrogen down-regulation of androgen receptors in cultured human mammary cancer cells (MCF-7) - PubMed

Got any links?

I was also under the impression that neurotransmitters have to do with the brain and nervous system. Are you thinking of androgen receptors?

The right term is T blockers. Because their purpose is to block Testosterone. From going to the cells.

 

[Estro Felino]

Btw in Europe cyproterone acetate is used. Not spiro.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

As a CIS woman who has taken Spironolactone as treatment for PCOS I can confirm this. Didn't stop facial hair growth or muscle gain for me. Just helped me not retain as much water and helped with some other digestive problems.

I lost a lot of muscle mass from treatment, but my facial hair softened up somewhat but didn't change much. For that waxing has been cheap, less painful than electrolysis, and still permanently thinning it and forever doing away with what was once a permanent beard shadow.