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(Almost) Noahide

Discussion in 'Seekers Circle' started by Mauricius Modestus, Feb 29, 2020.

  1. Mauricius Modestus

    Mauricius Modestus God-Fearer
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    Shalom, everyone!

    Recently, after a verse from the book of Joshua came into my mind [24:15], and seeing myself (metaphorically, of course) in the Israelites through that, I’ve become drawn back to a relationship with the G-d of Israel and am seeking out His Will for me.

    Now, while I have given thoughts in the past to a full conversion to, yes, Orthodox Judaism, I do recognize that as a non-Jew, I don’t necessarily have to pursue this course. Rather, I can observe the Sheva Mitzvot b’nei Noach (The Seven Laws of Noah). So, I’m exploring their observance as my path towards G-d.
    I think I could do well in this!

    However, with this, there’s just one disconnect from my end: I’m not exactly a monotheist proper, but actually, a monolater (which is to say that while I believe in many gods, I choose to exclusively worship one). When it comes to the prohibition of idolatry, I’ve read and been told that not only the worship of, but even the belief in other deities besides HaShem is idolatrous for me. That’s where the almost comes in. I guess by HaShem’s Standards, maybe I could never be fully pious. I don’t know. :(
     
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  2. Terry Sampson

    Terry Sampson ζει

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    None of my business, but ...

    Best advice that my father ever gave me was: "Don't give advice." I do it anyway, but I still think it was good advice.

    You're what? 23 or so? You've got a long life ahead of you. Nothing's "fixed in stone", ... yet; and no doubt there are plenty of distractions to give you reasons for pausing and not making hasty decisions, right? Full, radical "turns" (i.e. conversions) don't come easy.

    I say: Go for the smooth curve, now. Don't scare yourself trying to make a potentially traumatic, radical, sharp life-changing turn now. Ease into it. There's no law that says you can't turn a little more later.

    That said, however, I should add, ... I'm 71, ... going on 90. There's a good chance that someday, you'll live to be my age and be in better health, God willing. From where I sit today, looking back over a lifetime of slow turns, and not all in the same direction, I see the end of the tunnel up ahead, ... an end to the roller-coaster ride of my life in this world, and I sez to myself: "Self, .. you'd have saved yourself a lot of grief and regret if you had just made that sharp turn that you had several chances to make way back when. If you had, you wouldn't be sitting here wanting a "do-over."

    I'm far from the top of HaShem's list of references and I make a lousy character-witness for Him, but there is no other, IMO.
     
    #2 Terry Sampson, Feb 29, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 29, 2020
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  3. Mock Turtle

    Mock Turtle Compassion, understanding, and tolerance.
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    @Rival - fancy a trip to Maryland?
     
  4. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    Shema Israel Adonai Eloheinu Adonai echad.
     
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  5. Mock Turtle

    Mock Turtle Compassion, understanding, and tolerance.
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    Google Translate failed with that - get stuffed?
     
  6. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    The Shema affirms the Oneness of G-d.

    So yeah...
     
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  7. Harel13

    Harel13 Well-Known Member

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    Is there any particular reason that made you believe in the existence of multiple gods?
     
  8. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    @Mauricius Modestus Look, with honesty and respect, in my view there is no such thing as an almost Noachide. No-one would try to designate himself an almost-Muslim or an almost-Christian, since if he said he believes in other gods he will not be accepted. According to Abrahamic religion generally, you are or you aren't. If you believe in other gods alongside G-d, Heaven forbid, you are a henotheist and worse, committing schituf/shirk, according to the doctrine.

    There's nothing really admirable in this; no-one will commend you for being 'nearly there' since what you're doing is, and I'm sorry, arguably worse than outright paganism. You're putting other gods alongside G-d even if you're not worshipping them and this is unlikely to be accepted by mainstream Jews and Noachides. The Torah tells Jews not even to mention their [other gods'] names (in light of this and to many folks' annoyance, I always write weekday names without capital letters).

    What you're doing will be seen as schituf/shirk, as has been explained to you. There's no way around this because our religion is founded upon the idea that there is one G-d.
     
    #8 Rival, Feb 29, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 29, 2020
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  9. columbus

    columbus Conservative Catholic from Hell

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    In my experience, this happens all the time.

    People who identify as some religious community or another get walled out by people who think that they aren't "pure" enough.

    You might think that anybody who identifies as Noahide, but who doesn't meet your standards, isn't Noahide. But I see no reason to consider you an authority on the subject.
    Tom
     
  10. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    Religions come with dogmas and standards. You are going to be pushed out if you violate them. If you don't stick to them the whole idea of the religion is meaningless if you make it whatever you want it to be. There is an authority on this subject and the authority is the Torah. If you don't like that, choose another religion. The core of the Abrahamic faiths is monotheism; if you break that what's the point? We're going to kick you out, no question.
     
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  11. columbus

    columbus Conservative Catholic from Hell

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    Yeah, I've noticed that.

    Especially amongst the hardcore religionists.
    Tom
     
  12. Mauricius Modestus

    Mauricius Modestus God-Fearer
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    It originates from my own personal experience and studying of the matter.
     
  13. Mauricius Modestus

    Mauricius Modestus God-Fearer
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    All of this is certainly understandable, @Rival. I appreciate the bluntness.
     
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