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Allah talks about caste?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by K.Venugopal, May 2, 2012.

  1. K.Venugopal

    K.Venugopal Immobile Wanderer

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    I find the following Quranic verse strikingly similar to the verse in Bhagwad Gita. Were Allah and Krishna claiming credit for the same thing?

    "It is we who divide among them their livelihood in the life of this world, and We exalt some of them above others in rank, so that some of them may command work from the others." (Qur'an, 43:32).

    "The fourfold caste has been created by Me according to the differentiation of Guna (attributes) and Karma." (Bhagavad Gita, Ch. 18, V.41).
     
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  2. Satyamavejayanti

    Satyamavejayanti Well-Known Member

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    To me the koran does not give a clear reason for the divide of people as per that verse, as for the Gita verse its based on attributes or skill and Karma or deeds.

    And i don't see birth being a reason for the divide in the Gita.

    as for the koran verse its not so clear, maybe our Muslim friends can answer on that one.
     
  3. Me Myself

    Me Myself Back to my username

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    Gita does read as being more specific, at least talking about the specific texts provided by both.
     
  4. Vrindavana Das

    Vrindavana Das Active Member

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    Krishna & Allah are both the same ONE Supreme Lord.

    Therefore, it is only fair He says the same thing in the Quoran & Bhagavad Gita. Wordings may be different according to the time, place & circumstance. Spirit is the same. :)
     
  5. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    i agree with you,the same message the same god,but distorted by people through history.

    if i were god,i will feel sorry for creating human,but god seems the most patient.:)
     
  6. Vrindavana Das

    Vrindavana Das Active Member

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    If I were God, I would make the humans sorry for messing around with my words. ;)
     
  7. CynthiaCypher

    CynthiaCypher Well-Known Member

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    Maybe we should make God sorry for not creating everyone equal.
     
  8. Vrindavana Das

    Vrindavana Das Active Member

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    Maybe God has not created everyone equal to make everyone, but Himself, sorry.
     
  9. CynthiaCypher

    CynthiaCypher Well-Known Member

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    And would you call a God who not only justifies a caste system but is responsible for it...good?
     
  10. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    What do you mean all to be equal,how the factories then will work,how restaurants will
    work,how teachers will work,all are reach,and no one had to serve any one.

    That can never happen except if you have a better idea,do you have a better idea
    to make them all rich,no workers,all are boss.
     
    #10 FearGod, May 3, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: May 3, 2012
  11. Vrindavana Das

    Vrindavana Das Active Member

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    Most certainly! Hand has four fingers and a thumb. Each is unique. All are not equal. Yet indispensable.
     
  12. CynthiaCypher

    CynthiaCypher Well-Known Member

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    The caste system is the exclusion from power and self-determination based on an accident of birth. You don't see anything wrong with that?
     
  13. no-body

    no-body Well-Known Member

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    Is there a hierarchy to humanity then? Does ones abilities in being able to do a job make them inherently better than someone else?
     
  14. Vrindavana Das

    Vrindavana Das Active Member

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    It is not based on 'birth'. It is based on 'qualities'. Someone who tells you that it is based on 'birth' is misleading you.
     
  15. Vrindavana Das

    Vrindavana Das Active Member

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    Everyone has a particular set of qualities. It is just recognizing the strong points and award a particular job basis the same. We too do it all the time.

    If you were the Principal of a school. Would you hire a teacher who has the necessary qualification or you would hire one to give equality a chance?
     
  16. no-body

    no-body Well-Known Member

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    How do you determine these qualities however, are they set in stone genetically? spiritually? can they be earned and learned?

    What does being able to do a job have to do with your status as a human being. Should we start classing people based on what they can do? Does a doctor have more self worth than a CEO?
     
  17. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    There is a purpose from hierarchy,otherwise life will stop,if no body is in need
    for anybody,then life will stop,no farmers,no workers,no butchers...etc.

    But god asked us to pay well for workers and to support the poor,that is the best way
    for life to go on.So in Islam if someone is rich,he should thank god for such givings and
    he should pay some money for the poor and he should know that such money went for the poor byhimself and he should help the less lucky people.

    But that is not happening so much nowadays because many people are away from god.
     
  18. no-body

    no-body Well-Known Member

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    Is the hierarchy set for life? Can a person who has been at the bottom for many years learn to rise above their station by hard work and learning?
     
  19. FearGod

    FearGod Freedom Of Mind

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    No of course not set for life,you can see many who were rich dropped down and many
    who where down went up.

    "He causes to suffer whomever He wills, and bestows His mercy on whomever He wills; and unto Him you shall be made to return: (29:21)

    Such is God's bounty: He grants it to anyone who is willing [to receive it]: for God is limitless in His great bounty. (62:4)

    singling out for His grace whom He wills. And God is limitless in His great bounty." (3:74)

    GOD is most kind unto His creatures: He provides sustenance for whomever He wills – for He alone is powerful, almighty! (42:19)

    Behold, thy Sustainer grants abundant sustenance, or gives it in scant measure, unto whomever He wills: verily, fully aware is He of [the needs of] His creatures, and sees them all. (17:30)

    Say: "Behold, my Sustainer grants abundant sustenance, or gives it in scant measure, unto whomever He wills: but most men do not understand [God's ways]." (34:36)

    [and who only hope] that God may reward them in accordance with the best that they ever did, and give them, out of His bounty, more [than they deserve]: for God grants sustenance unto whom He wills, beyond all reckoning. (24:38)

    GOD GRANTS abundant sustenance, or gives it in scant measure, unto whomever He wills; and they [who are given abundance] rejoice in the life of this world – even though, as compared with the life to come, the life of this world is nought but a fleeting pleasure. (13:26)

    For if God were to grant [in this world] abundant sustenance to [all of] His servants, they would behave on earth with wanton insolence: but as it is, He bestows [His grace] from on high in due measure, as He wills: for, verily, He is fully aware of [the needs of] His creatures, and sees them all. (42:27)

    SAY: "O God, Lord of all dominion! Thou grantest dominion unto whom Thou willest, and takest away dominion from whom Thou willest; and Thou exaltest whom Thou willest, and abasest whom Thou willest. In Thy hand is all good. Verily, Thou hast the power to will anything. (3:26)
     
  20. Rational_Mind

    Rational_Mind Ahmadi Muslim

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    There is no Caste System in Islam. Even though members of society will hold different positions on a material level this will not effect judgement of Allah (swt) or in an Islamic Court. Allah (swt) points out that different levels in society is needed to function. I do not intend to cause offence but Islam absolutely rejects the Caste System and gives everyone equivalent right and allows them to rise to whichever post they make themselves capable of. I believe the Caste System is only found in Hinduism. Islam says to judge equivalently, from my understanding that judgement is not equivalent across castes in Hinduism.

    I believe the Caste System is only found in Hinduism. From my understanding, in the Caste System people are born into a Caste and are now limited in society by birth. They are also judged differently because of their Caste. I do not intend to cause offence but Islam absolutely rejects the Caste System and gives everyone equivalent right and allows them to rise to whichever post they make themselves capable of. It also reject racism.

    Also, the completely verse was not posted. Below is some commentary explaining it. If you aslo read verses above and below you will understand the point. The purport is to explain that material wealth has no value in the sight of Allah (swt).

    [​IMG]
     
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