• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

African Churches Launch Dirty Attack On Science of Evolution!

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
From:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/08/12/wleakey12.xml

Powerful evangelical churches are pressing Kenya's national museum to sideline its world-famous collection of hominid bones pointing to man's evolution from ape to human.


Leaders of the country's six-million-strong Pentecostal congregation want Dr Richard Leakey's ground-breaking finds relegated to a back room instead of being given their usual prime billing.



The collection includes the most complete skeleton yet found of Homo erectus, the 1.7 million-year-old Turkana Boy unearthed by Dr Leakey's team in 1984 at Nariokotome, near Lake Turkana in northern Kenya.


The museum also holds bones from several specimens of Australopithecus anamensis, believed to be the first hominid to walk upright, four million years ago. Together the artefacts amount to the clearest record yet discovered of the origins of Homo sapiens.


They have cemented the global reputation of Kenya's Great Rift Valley as the cradle of mankind, and draw in tourists and locals to the museum's sprawling compound on a hill above Nairobi.


Permanent exhibitions cover Kenya's cultural and scientific history from pre-history to independence. A snake park was added in the early 1960s.


As part of an ongoing expansion funded by the EU, the National Museums of Kenya, which manages the country's cultural sites, is conducting a survey to determine what visitors to its Nairobi headquarters most want to see.


Church leaders aim to hijack that process. "The Christian community here is very uncomfortable that Leakey and his group want their theories presented as fact," said Bishop Bonifes Adoyo, the head of Christ is the Answer Ministries, the largest Pentecostal church in Kenya.


"Our doctrine is not that we evolved from apes, and we have grave concerns that the museum wants to enhance the prominence of something presented as fact which is just one theory."


Bishop Adoyo said all the country's churches would unite to force the museum to change its focus when it reopens after 18 months of renovations in June next year.


So, let's get this straight: Since they can't refute evolution scientifically, these churches want to pressure the government to hide the truth from the public. What arrogance!
 

robtex

Veteran Member
That makes me really nervous. . I have fear that vandalization will be a nature reaction to the proposed war on faith.
 

Random

Well-Known Member
Sunstone said:
From:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/08/12/wleakey12.xml

Since they can't refute evolution scientifically, these churches want to pressure the government to hide the truth from the public. What arrogance!

Sigh, will this ever end?

Atheists cannot refute God scientifically, yet that doesn't stop them being absurdly certain there is no God and bashing believers over their heads with the big bad stick of rationality they claim belongs to them and them alone. What arrogance, eh?

I believe in theistic evolution, but until people see clear examples of natural selection and random mutation in action evolution has to taken on faith as having occurred. Yet even if we did witness this type of irrefutable evidence, which is not very likely anytime soon I might add, people could still reasonably turn around and say "God did it", no matter how exasperating so-called "naturalists" might find this.

Until then, one is perfectly entitled to accept the theory tacitly, or design, or even to believe we all came from the ocean originally. Whatever!

I do not, of course, agree with vandalizing museams, but as Robtex rightly said this is because believers have woken up to the anti-faith agenda extant in the materialist West. When the threat is real, in any situation, the reation will be doubly so...even unto violence if necessary.

I'm a fan of science and have no problem with well-supported findings like any other reasonable man, but Scientism, which is to treat of science as epistemologically infallible, goes to far and mars the endevour of true discovery. If science gets too big for it's cold intellectual boots, Religion will simply assimilate it in the end.

It would be in the best interests of science and religion to engage their respective quests in a spirit of mutual co-operation, rather than hostility and distrust.
 

fantome profane

Anti-Woke = Anti-Justice
Premium Member
Wow, talk about “skeletons in the closet”. I don’t think this will work. Clearly this is a fear based reaction on the part of Bishop Adoyo, he is afraid people will be able to educate themselves. He is trying to protect ignorance at any cost, and he thinks the best way to do this is with an “out of sight out of mind”. But I doubt that any museum curator will bow to this kind of political pressure to suppress the truth. All they are doing is taking a survey, and they are certainly not going to be bound by it even if this Bishop does manage to get people to write letters, which I don’t think he has yet.

This is from an article on Wired.com

The museum is currently closed for renovations, and museum officials said they have not yet received any official complaints by local evangelical churches. But they plan to prominently house the collection as "scientific evidence" of evolution when it re-opens in 2007, a representative said.
 

Ryan2065

Well-Known Member
until people see clear examples of natural selection and random mutation in action evolution has to taken on faith as having occurred.
Wait... you are saying we haven't seen natural selection and random mutations in action? Er, we have... And yes, evolution has been proven scientifically.

Evolution doesn't say we came from apes... We say we came from apes through evolution... there is a HUGE difference.
 

Random

Well-Known Member
Ryan2065 said:
Wait... you are saying we haven't seen natural selection and random mutations in action? Er, we have... And yes, evolution has been proven scientifically.

Untrue. :tsk: Random mutation: can't be tested in a lab emprically as it has to be a naturally occurring random process, and that can't be evident in nature because of the timescale involved. Same goes for natural selection: no artificial environment has yet been created to simulate it, and no-one can tell which traits we either lost or acquired during the alleged evolutionary stages.
 

Willamena

Just me
Premium Member
Sunstone said:
Church leaders aim to hijack that process. "The Christian community here is very uncomfortable that Leakey and his group want their theories presented as fact," said Bishop Bonifes Adoyo, the head of Christ is the Answer Ministries, the largest Pentecostal church in Kenya.


"Our doctrine is not that we evolved from apes, and we have grave concerns that the museum wants to enhance the prominence of something presented as fact which is just one theory."
I don't see why they're so upset about it. They present their opinions as fact; why shouldn't the others?
 

Willamena

Just me
Premium Member
Godlike said:
Untrue. :tsk: Random mutation: can't be tested in a lab emprically as it has to be a naturally occurring random process, and that can't be evident in nature because of the timescale involved. Same goes for natural selection: no artificial environment has yet been created to simulate it, and no-one can tell which traits we either lost or acquired during the alleged evolutionary stages.
The "time scale" to see a mutation need only be a few generations. That's why fruit flies are so popular.
 

Yerda

Veteran Member
Godlike said:
Untrue. :tsk: Random mutation: can't be tested in a lab emprically as it has to be a naturally occurring random process, and that can't be evident in nature because of the timescale involved.
Random mutation happens as reliably as radioactive decay.

Godlike said:
Same goes for natural selection: no artificial environment has yet been created to simulate it...
Selection is routinely performed biolabs around the world. Recombinant DNA technology would be almost impossible without it. It's also witnessed frequently in nature.

Godlike said:
...and no-one can tell which traits we either lost or acquired during the alleged evolutionary stages.
Like antibiotic resistance?
 

lamplighter

Almighty Tallest
I like how they try to present the theory of evolution as some shot in the dark like creationism is, about the origins of man.
 

revjackie

New Member
Darwin as a biologist made sharp observations about how various species adapted in the natural world. Someone very wise said: "The creation account in Genesis elaborates on how God created man and Darwin explains how God did so."
 

Yerda

Veteran Member
revjackie said:
Someone very wise said: "The creation account in Genesis elaborates on how God created man and Darwin explains how God did so."
Unless you've miss-quoted, the otherwise very wise person made a rather daft statement.
 
Top