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About a god existing....or not

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Wouldn't it be clear after waiting thousands and thousands of years, that if there was actually a god or gods, a god would be by now well known already throughout the course of time? Living in the real world outside the imagination?
Only if that God wanted to be known to everyone. If God does not want to be known to everyone, God will not be known to everyone, only to those He chooses to be known to. God is known to some of us.

It's pretty straightforward. God does not exist in the material world so God cannot be seen in the material world.
God exists in the spiritual world, which is the real world. This material world is just a shadow stretching out.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Yet there isn't save for active imaginations. I would say the shelf life for proving a god is well past its expiration date.
Nobody can prove God exists, God is the only one who can prove it, but obviously God has chosen not to do so.

The reason God does not prove He exists is because God wants our faith. If God proved He exists then we would no longer need faith.

Hebrews 11:6 And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who approaches Him must believe that He exists and that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him.

We must first believe that it is possible for God to exist, and that requires faith since no man has ever seen God.
I believe that God will reward those who earnestly seek Him with the evidence they need to believe, but God will not force anyone to accept the evidence. That is a choice.
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
Joe Bob believes in a god, goes to church regularly, says his prayers, lives his own life as if heaven and hell exist and wants to go to heaven.

Jim Bob doesn't believe in a god, doesn't go to church, takes life day by day, and lives his own life as when I die its all over because there is no heaven or hell.

Who's right? Do we even know?
Why does either of them living their own life bother anyone?
Joe Bob is bothered by Jim Bob's life because he cares about Jim and doesn't want to see him go to the tortures of hell so he feels an obligation to prevent him from going there by doing everything he can to convert Jim to his way of thinking.
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
Nobody can prove God exists, God is the only one who can prove it, but obviously God has chosen not to do so.

The reason God does not prove He exists is because God wants our faith. If God proved He exists then we would no longer need faith.
I see faith as believing where there is no proof, or empirical evidence. From my experience; the biggest difference I’ve noticed between the truth and a lie, is the truth never asks to be believed; that’s what lies do. Lies ask to believe without question because that’s all they have; if you think about what they say, you might see them for what they really are. But the truth never asks to be believed, the truth asks to be tested. The truth wants to be questioned, studied, analyzed, picked apart; the truth asks to be verified! Because once you’ve done all of that, belief comes natural.

Assuming God does exist and knows me, he will know the idea that I should trust without question, without verification is everything I know to be a lie and the antithesis of everything I know to be true. So knowing my experiences, why would God demand faith from someone like me?
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Nobody can prove God exists, God is the only one who can prove it, but obviously God has chosen not to do so.

The reason God does not prove He exists is because God wants our faith. If God proved He exists then we would no longer need faith.

Hebrews 11:6 And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who approaches Him must believe that He exists and that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him.

We must first believe that it is possible for God to exist, and that requires faith since no man has ever seen God.
I believe that God will reward those who earnestly seek Him with the evidence they need to believe, but God will not force anyone to accept the evidence. That is a choice.

Your right about one thing. It takes a god to prove a god.

Believing alone no. Nothing will come of it but hope and frustration each and every time in the real world someone trys to establish the existence of something that is hopelessly cerebral in nature.

Every Bible character had tactile proof of God according to the Bible stories that were written which of course eliminated any need for belief because all the characters had expressed such encounters in the mythology.

Of course, belief does wonders inside one's mind and imagination making it undeniably come alive and real to the person, but the failure to produce any type of God in the real world outside the imagination is pretty damming. Especially after the course of thousands of years that predictably yealded completely nothing.

It's pretty obvious there is no god after all that time, for which thousands of years passed with absolutely nothing happening outside one's imagination indicates and effectively establishes pretty solid proof that nothing was ever really there in the first place.
 
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Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Only if that God wanted to be known to everyone. If God does not want to be known to everyone, God will not be known to everyone, only to those He chooses to be known to. God is known to some of us.

It's pretty straightforward. God does not exist in the material world so God cannot be seen in the material world.
God exists in the spiritual world, which is the real world. This material world is just a shadow stretching out.
That would however be strictly limited to one's mind and imagination.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Your right about one thing. It takes a god to prove a god.
If God exists and chooses NOT to provide proof we are not going to get proof.
the failure to produce any type of God in the real world outside the imagination is pretty damming. Especially after the course of thousands of years that predictably yealded completely nothing.
The course of thousands of years has not yielded nothing, it has yielded various Scriptures from various religions, which are not imaginary and which are evidence of God to most people.
It's pretty obvious there is no god after all that time, for which thousands of years passed with absolutely nothing happening outside one's imagination indicates and effectively establishes pretty solid proof that nothing was ever really there in the first place.
Scriptures and the Messengers of God who revealed them are the evidence that God exists. There will never be absolute proof because God chooses not to provide it, since God wants our faith.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
That would however be strictly limited to one's mind and imagination.
and what is in the mind and imagination might be true.....
Proof does not make anything true, proof is just what people want to believe something is true, but we don't always get what we want.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
If God exists and chooses NOT to provide proof we are not going to get proof.

The course of thousands of years has not yielded nothing, it has yielded various Scriptures from various religions, which are not imaginary and which are evidence of God to most people.

Scriptures and the Messengers of God who revealed them are the evidence that God exists. There will never be absolute proof because God chooses not to provide it, since God wants our faith.
Scriptures and the like is only writing down what one wants to write.

Dosent really do much other than that.
 

Sgt. Pepper

All you need is love.
Joe Bob believes in a god, goes to church regularly, says his prayers, lives his own life as if heaven and hell exist and wants to go to heaven.

Jim Bob doesn't believe in a god, doesn't go to church, takes life day by day, and lives his own life as when I die its all over because there is no heaven or hell.

Who's right? Do we even know?
Why does either of them living their own life bother anyone?

I don't think we can know, to be honest. It's why I call myself an agnostic, and not an atheist. I was like Joe Bob for thirty-one years of my life, but the more I contemplate and confront my horrific past of abuse, the more I become like Jim Bob.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Scriptures and the like is only writing down what one wants to write.

Dosent really do much other than that.
That might be true for some Scriptures but not for all Scriptures, but I choose not to argue about that.

Please let me know when you think of another way God could communicate everything that is contained in Scriptures such that everyone would have access to that information.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
That might be true for some Scriptures but not for all Scriptures, but I choose not to argue about that.

Please let me know when you think of another way God could communicate everything that is contained in Scriptures such that everyone would have access to that information.
I don't acknowledge any God as I view it as a product of imagination. Essentially its a mental puppet.

It's not possible for any type of communication to reflect the reality that pervades throughout the universe. Particularly that indifference between one's thoughts and wishes, and how the universe actually works and operates.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I don't acknowledge any God as I view it as a product of imagination. Essentially its a mental puppet.
I do not agree with that since I believe a God exists, but......
It's not possible for any type of communication to reflect the reality that pervades throughout the universe. Particularly that indifference between one's thoughts and wishes, and how the universe actually works and operates.
I do agree with that.
 

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
Joe Bob believes in a god, goes to church regularly, says his prayers, lives his own life as if heaven and hell exist and wants to go to heaven.

Jim Bob doesn't believe in a god, doesn't go to church, takes life day by day, and lives his own life as when I die its all over because there is no heaven or hell.

Who's right? Do we even know?
Why does either of them living their own life bother anyone?

The black and white (or right or wrong) binary choice that you offer is not complete.

There are many religions around the world. They believe in a variety of Gods. Some of their Gods might be the same as the Gods of other religions (that is hard to determine).

The Christian and Muslim religions are spin-offs of the Jewish religion. So, all Christians and Muslims are "sort of" Jewish, religiously (not ethnically). Arabs and Jews are Semites, so they were ethnically almost identical. Since ancient times, Jews were forced to live in distant lands, and their DNA proves that they interbred with native populations. So, Jews are no longer all that close to Arabs, ethnically.

Ancient Jews were polytheists (not parrots....many Gods). They chose one, that they felt was the most powerful and jealous of the other Gods, so one must not worship the other Gods of one would feel the wrath of the most powerful God.

If one worships the wrong God, the most powerful God would be wrathful. But how do we know that we worship the most powerful God?

God doesn't answer prayers or allow anyone to prove His existence. So, it is very difficult to tell if we worship the right God or the wrong God.

It is said that Jesus died for our sins. But, dying for our sins was not Jesus's idea. After all, Jesus asked God "why hath thou forsaken me?" In other words, it was God, not Jesus, that was responsible for the death of Jesus.

It could be argued that a Roman (Pontius Pilate), acting under the authority of Caesar, murdered Jesus. But wasn't the all-powerful and all-knowing God capable of stopping any army of men? Surely, then, it was God who was responsible for the horrible death of Jesus, and responsible of depriving humans of the love and compassion of Jesus on earth.

Why did God have to have a sacrifice in order to forgive mankind for a sin that presumably their kinfolk did? Why couldn't God simply forgive mankind? Isn't an all-powerful God able to do anything that he wants?

What kind of loving God would allow Satan and hell?

Do we worship the right God? If not, the right God's wrath might be horrible.

Is our God loving, and dif so, why did Jesus have to suffer so? Why do cancer patients have to suffer and die? Why is there killing and hatred in the world if God is all-powerful and good? Does it make sense to spend time at God's side in heaven if God is not loving?

There are too many choices of Gods and no God has been proven to exist.

Many choose a God by their own feelings, intuition, or psychic ability.
 
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