A tv debate about evolution v creation

[Youtellme]

This programme may not be available in your country but give it a go! The debate is at around the 43 minute mark. It won't be online for much longer either so hurry up.

I'd like your thoughts on the points raised by the creationists and the evolutionists.
BBC iPlayer - Sunday Morning Live: Episode 18

Enjoy and fire away!

 

[evolved yet?]

"Not available in your area" crap, mind giving a summary?

 

[Youtellme]

"Not available in your area" crap, mind giving a summary?

Ha, that sucks! Well, it started with a clip by a young earth creationist who claimed that the Genesis account is literally true and all that goes along with that belief. He was then in a studio with a panel of other guests who agreed on some points of the creation account but not all points and then there were "evolutionists" who said that it's a load of rubbish.

They had a scientist join via webcam who used a feather to show an example of design and said where ever you look in nature there seems to be order, structure and design and this can only mean one thing. There must be a desginer.

Then another scientist joind via webcam who said the opposite, just because something looks designed, doesn't mean it is and he claimed that it can be proven how every living thing evolved and then annoyingly they ran out of time cos the show was live and they ended the debate.

Anyway, I thought people on this forum would like to watch it.

 

[Renji]

Interesting.... I remember a tv show where a scientist explains the concept of evolution... Nice one.

 

[Youtellme]

Interesting.... I remember a tv show where a scientist explains the concept of evolution... Nice one.

Yeah, there are many. Right now the BBC is running a show with David Attenborough that traces early life. Really well made. Having said that, in the UK in particular there is very little on mainstream TV about religious subjects.

We have like two programmes that discuss religion, one is that debate show and the other is Called Songs of Praise but that has mostly people singing in church and is very boring.
I think it's unbalanced to have loads about evolution and hardly anything on religion.
(I actually work in TV and my producer and I were thinking of pitching an idea for a series of shows that looks into the history of religious celebrations in christendom and shows the roots of those holidays.)

What's it like in your country?

 

[HonestJoe]

We have like two programmes that discuss religion, one is that debate show and the other is Called Songs of Praise but that has mostly people singing in church and is very boring.

I think it's unbalanced to have loads about evolution and hardly anything on religion.

Two thoughts. You point out two weekly programmes related to religion (though not the various one-off programmes or series). How many weekly shows are there dedicated to evolution?

More significantly, why should there be a balance between the amount of programming about two entirely different and largely unrelated things? Do you object to the lack of balance between programmes about fishing compared to those about astrophysics?

 

[Renji]

We have like two programmes that discuss religion, one is that debate show and the other is Called Songs of Praise but that has mostly people singing in church and is very boring.

Hmm, is it something like the Sister's act?:angel2:

What's it like in your country?

Not actually produced by a local tv station in my country. It's a US channel.

Well, I can remember that the scientist is holding a lot of bones, resembling those of 'ancient humans', as well as dinosaur bones and bones of presently existing animals like dogs. He is actually, well, sort of comparing them and then he explains about the DNA's and stuff...

 

[Krok]

A tv debate about evolution v creation

What a waste of time. Evolution won the scientific debate more than 150 years ago. That’s where the real debate between knowledgable scientists ended. There's no scientific debate about evolution anymore. All done.

This programme may not be available in your country but give it a go! The debate is at around the 43 minute mark. It won't be online for much longer either so hurry up.

Hopefully not available in my country. I see enough of Joyce Myer screaming at me. Don’t want to be married to that weirdo! Evolution should be discussed in scientific biological papers. Any “debate” between laymen is a waste of valuable time.

I'd like your thoughts on the points raised by the creationists and the evolutionists.

BBC iPlayer - Sunday Morning Live: Episode 18

Waste of time to even watch it. Evolution won the scientific debate a long time ago. So much so that nearly all religious scientists also accept evolution as fact.

Enjoy and fire away!

I don’t waste my time watching people who should be in some mental institution “debating” sane people. They won’t teach me anything.

Yeah, there are many. Right now the BBC is running a show with David Attenborough that traces early life. Really well made. Having said that, in the UK in particular there is very little on mainstream TV about religious subjects.

Religion on TV is boring. Don’t want to see these weirdo’s.

We have like two programmes that discuss religion, one is that debate show and the other is Called Songs of Praise but that has mostly people singing in church and is very boring.

Two too many. They should cut.

I think it's unbalanced to have loads about evolution and hardly anything on religion.

Why? As I said, more than 99% of all Biologists looked at the evidence for evolution and accepted it as the only good explanation for the variety of life we have at the moment. Biologists are the people that matter discussing the Theory of Evolution. Laymen don't.

(I actually work in TV and my producer and I were thinking of pitching an idea for a series of shows that looks into the history of religious celebrations in christendom and shows the roots of those holidays.)

You should also produce a few programs on some other religions. The Zulu creation myth and culture is fascinating.

What's it like in your country?

We’re trying to rid the country of YEC nuts. You find a lot of them in mental institutions. They should stay there!

 

[Youtellme]

What a waste of time. Evolution won the scientific debate more than 150 years ago. That’s where the real debate between knowledgable scientists ended. There's no scientific debate about evolution anymore. All done. Hopefully not available in my country. I see enough of Joyce Myer screaming at me. Don’t want to be married to that weirdo! Evolution should be discussed in scientific biological papers. Any “debate” between laymen is a waste of valuable time. Waste of time to even watch it. Evolution won the scientific debate a long time ago. So much so that nearly all religious scientists also accept evolution as fact. I don’t waste my time watching people who should be in some mental institution “debating” sane people. They won’t teach me anything. Religion on TV is boring. Don’t want to see these weirdo’s. Two too many. They should cut. Why? As I said, more than 99% of all Biologists looked at the evidence for evolution and accepted it as the only good explanation for the variety of life we have at the moment. Biologists are the people that matter discussing the Theory of Evolution. Laymen don't. You should also produce a few programs on some other religions. The Zulu creation myth and culture is fascinating. We’re trying to rid the country of YEC nuts. You find a lot of them in mental institutions. They should stay there!

Someone's a bitter little twerp....:sad4:

 

[painted wolf]

Feathers are a really poor example of design...
For most of the feathers history it wasn't good for flying at all. Most feathers today still aren't.

wa:do

 

[Krok]

Someone's a bitter little twerp....:sad4:

Just realistic. The debate is over. It finished more than 150 years ago. Some crazy people don't want to accept this little inconvenient fact. They're not worth listening to. Rather go :surf:

 

[Youtellme]

Just realistic. The debate is over. It finished more than 150 years ago. Some crazy people don't want to accept this little inconvenient fact. They're not worth listening to. Rather go :surf:

It obviously isn't over as it's still debated, even amongst the scientific community. Saying it's over and not even worth debating is like sticking your fingers in your ears like a little kid who doesn't want to hear what others have to say. In their own eyes they are right and that's it.

Anyway, back to the point I mentioned earlier, perhaps programmes on 'religion' isn't what I mean when I say there should be more of them; as someone pointed out, evolution and religion are such different subjects. So I say there should be more programmes that discuss creation and ID on TV. But then again, those subjects are sort of related to religion as they imply a creator...

(As a side note, on mainstream TV in the uk, there are shows like 'Life' and 'How earth made us'. All very good programmes but no programme that discusses biology ever mentions the possiblity of creation. And there certainly are no programmes that only discuss biology from the creationist point of view. In the UK it is actually law for programme makers to produce balanced programmes that don't just present one side of an argument or have comments from only one-sided contributors. But when it comes to such programmes, this seems to be ignored.)

So when people say that the theory of evolution says nothing on the subject of God, I disagree. Otherwise why would those who believe in evolution mock those who don't believe in it and say that to believe in a creator is crazy? It's quite clear that the theory of evolution or at least it's adherants say a lot about God and a belief therein.

 

[Father Heathen]

It obviously isn't over as it's still debated, even amongst the scientific community. Saying it's over and not even worth debating is like sticking your fingers in your ears like a little kid who doesn't want to hear what others have to say. In their own eyes they are right and that's it.

Anyway, back to the point I mentioned earlier, perhaps programmes on 'religion' isn't what I mean when I say there should be more of them; as someone pointed out, evolution and religion are such different subjects. So I say there should be more programmes that discuss creation and ID on TV. But then again, those subjects are sort of related to religion as they imply a creator...

(As a side note, on mainstream TV in the uk, there are shows like 'Life' and 'How earth made us'. All very good programmes but no programme that discusses biology ever mentions the possiblity of creation. And there certainly are no programmes that only discuss biology from the creationist point of view. In the UK it is actually law for programme makers to produce balanced programmes that don't just present one side of an argument or have comments from only one-sided contributors. But when it comes to such programmes, this seems to be ignored.)

So when people say that the theory of evolution says nothing on the subject of God, I disagree. Otherwise why would those who believe in evolution mock those who don't believe in it and say that to believe in a creator is crazy? It's quite clear that the theory of evolution or at least it's adherants say a lot about God and a belief therein.

One, evolution and the concept of god are not mutually exclusive. Evolution only conflicts with literal interpretations of ancient creation myths (which do not hold a monopoly on the concept of god). Two, science only deals with the observable and testable, so of course science shows aren't going to waste their time with things that don't meet the rigid criteria to be considered an actual science. There is no evidence or logic to substantiate ID/creationism or lend it any credibility. It requires willful ignorance and intellectual dishonesty to suggest that there's any sort of real controversy or dispute.

 

[Autodidact]

It obviously isn't over as it's still debated, even amongst the scientific community.

I'm sorry, you're simply mistaken. Within Biology, which of course is all that matters, this debate was completely settled over a century ago. There is no debate within Biology about whether the Theory of Evolution is true.

So when people say that the theory of evolution says nothing on the subject of God, I disagree. Otherwise why would those who believe in evolution mock those who don't believe in it and say that to believe in a creator is crazy? It's quite clear that the theory of evolution or at least it's adherants say a lot about God and a belief therein.

They don't, at least, not in a discussion of evolution. Evolution is a scientific theory, and those who accept science, whether Christian, Muslim, Atheist, Buddhist, whatever, accept it. The Theory of Evolution (ToE) says nothing about the existence of God. If you believe that God exists and created the world, then ToE explains how He created the variety of species on earth.

I am so tired of explaining this to ignorant creationists I could scream. It's so basic, so elementary, that anyone who knows what science is and isn't knows this.

 

[Youtellme]

I am so tired of explaining this to ignorant creationists I could scream. It's so basic, so elementary, that anyone who knows what science is and isn't knows this.

Then why is it that evolutionists often mock those who believe in a creator God?

 

[Father Heathen]

Then why is it that evolutionists often mock those who believe in a creator God?

Is an "evolutionist" anything like a "gravitationist"? Also, critique and scrutiny of irrational and unsubstantiated beliefs isn't necessarily deriding, although it would probably appear that way if you think it's entitled to undue reverence.

 

[Renji]

I think, stuff like exorcisms would be a bit interesting on tv

 

[Autodidact]

Then why is it that evolutionists often mock those who believe in a creator God?

It doesn't look like you read my post. Like many creationists, you're so confused that it's hard to communicate with you. Let's start with the word, "evolutionist." There is no such thing, or to the extent there is, it doesn't mean what you think. Evolution is a scientific theory in the field of Biology. The people who study it are called "Biologists," not "evolutionists." Anyone who accept science, Christian or not, accepts this theory. Many people who accept this theory are religious.

You are confusing a scientific thory, evolution, with a philosophical position, Atheism. They are completely different.

The people who sometimes mock or at least disagree with religionists are called Atheists.

The confusion really comes in with the term "creationist." This sounds like it means anyone who believes in God. It does not. It means someone who rejects science, including Biology, Geology and many other fields, in favor of a literal application of their particular religious myth, usually from Genesis, though not always. Millions of people believe in God, but are not creationists in this sense. People who accept science, whom you are calling "evolutionists" mock these people because their beliefs are anti-science, anti-evidence, anti-logic, anti-reality and just plain silly.

Does that help?

 

[Autodidact]

Let me ask you this, Youtellme. Do you know what the ToE actually says? What it is?

 

[LuisDantas]

It obviously isn't over as it's still debated, even amongst the scientific community. Saying it's over and not even worth debating is like sticking your fingers in your ears like a little kid who doesn't want to hear what others have to say. In their own eyes they are right and that's it.

You know, you have a point here. In a way it is misleading to have this forum. It makes the controversy appear real and grounded, when in fact it is not.

On the other hand, it is hardly like RF created this false impression... we are hardly that influential.