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A serious question for the religious types about gay and trans people

C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
shava said:
Why don't you go to a atheist site?
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I do.
At least I used to. I am still a member of several, if they are still online.
But my beliefs generally survive arguments from people I disagree with, I find that more stimulating, and there is not a member here I can't find something to argue about.
So this is pretty much the only forum I bother with.
Tom
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Besides, who else is going to advocate for the rights of the unborn without using the Scriptures?
Which don't actually express a clear opinion on the subject. RF needs me.
Tom
 
SkepticThinker

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
Wirey said:
Has anyone ever mentioned that maybe, just maybe, God loves all the people He created, even the gay ones? And that He made them that way for a reason?
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Especially if that god is a loving one, as I've been told the Christian god is supposed to be.
 
SkepticThinker

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
shava said:
Paul wrote 13 of the New Testament books, and yes he and the other writers were divinely inspired to write ONLY what God had instructed them to. Do you honestly believe that God doesn't have the ability to make sure we, his creation, get what he wants us to read and know?
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I'm not so sure. If that were the case, you'd think he would have saved some original copies of the New Testament. :shrug:
 
SkepticThinker

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
shava said:
The word gay has more than one meaning and more than one slang, do you not realize that many people use the word gay as being a ***, queer, queer is a word that the gay community has bought. Do you not realize LGBTQT, will soon be changed to include pedophiliaes and beastiality which will be LGBTQPB. They to want there so called rights to be happy like the lesbians, homosexuals and transsexuals demanded and got, so when will the spiral of moral decay end?
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What on earth are you basing that on??
 
SkepticThinker

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
shava said:
The Steps of Salvation
The Bible teaches that sin is a transgression of God’s law (1 John 3:4). All people who know the difference between right and wrong have sinned (Romans 3:23). Our sins separate us from God (Isaiah 59:1-2). The punishment for sin is death (Romans 6:23). This is the second death which is the lake that burneth with fire (Revelation 21:8).

God loves us. He does not want us to be punished for our sins. Therefore, He has provided a way for us to be forgiven (John 3:16). God sent His only begotten Son, Jesus Christ, to die for our sins (1 John 4:10). Jesus suffered the punishment which we should have received for our sins (Isaiah 53:4-6). He did not die for His own sins, for He had none (2 Corinthians 5:21). He suffered for our sins on the cross so that we can be forgiven (Romans 5:6-8; 1 Peter 2:24). In order for us to be forgiven of our sins, and therefore receive eternal life, we must accept the salvation which Christ has made possible. There are five steps which we must take to receive this salvation.

Hear
First, we must hear the Gospel of Jesus Christ. The Bible teaches that faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God (Romans 10:17, KJV). One is not a Christian because his parents are. Faith cannot be inherited (Ezekiel 18:20). Each person must believe in Jesus Christ for himself. Christianity is a religion of teaching (Matthew 28:19-20). Unless one has heard the Gospel and learned that Jesus Christ died for his sins, was buried, and arose from the dead, he cannot be saved (1 Corinthians 15:1-4). The apostle Paul wrote: How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? (Romans 10:14) One must first hear the Gospel before he can believe it.

Believe
Second, one must believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God (Matthew 16:16). Jesus said: ...except ye believe that I am he, ye shall die in your sins (John 8:24). The jailor at Philippi asked Paul and Silas, Sirs, what must I do to be saved? They told him to Believe on the Lord Jesus, and thou shalt be saved, thou and thy house (Acts 16:30-31). Jesus also said: He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned (Mark 16:16). One comes to believe in Jesus Christ when he hears the Gospel taught. Faith comes only by hearing the Word of God (Romans 10:17). This is the reason it is so important that the Gospel be preached to the whole world (Mark 16:15).

Repent
Third, one must repent of his sins in order to be saved (Acts 17:30-31). Jesus commanded that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name unto all the nations, beginning from Jerusalem (Luke 24:47). Repentance is a result of being sorry for one’s sins (2 Corinthians 7:10). When the Jews on Pentecost Day learned from Peter that they had crucified the Son of God, they were cut to the heart (Acts 2:37). They wanted to be forgiven of their sins, so they asked, What shall we do? They were told Repent ye, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ unto the remission of your sins... (Acts 2:37-38). When one repents, he turns away from his sins (1 Thessalonians 1:9). He shows he has repented by doing good works (Matthew 3:8).

Confess
Fourth, one must confess that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God (Matthew 16:16). This great truth is the very foundation upon which the church of Christ is built (Matthew 16:18; Acts 4:11-12; 1 Corinthians 3:11). Jesus said that we must be willing to confess Him before men if we want Him to confess us before the Father (Matthew 10:32-33). The apostle Paul wrote: But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach: because if thou shalt confess with thy mouth Jesus as Lord, and shalt believe in thy heart that God raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved: for with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. (Romans 10:8-10). When Philip preached Jesus to the Ethiopian eunuch, the eunuch asked, what doth hinder me to be baptized? Philip told him he could be baptized if he believed. The eunuch then confessed, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God (Acts 8:35-38). We must make this important, yet simple confession also in order to be saved.

Be Baptized
Fifth, one must be baptized in order to be saved. Jesus said: He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved (Mark 16:16). Please note that baptism follows belief. One who does not believe the Gospel cannot be truly baptized. Therefore, babies cannot be baptized for they are too young to (1) have sin, (2) hear the Gospel, (3) repent of sins, and (4) confess that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. Baptism also follows repentance. On Pentecost Day, Peter told those who asked what to do to be saved to Repent ye, and be baptized every one of you... (Acts 2:38). One cannot be truly baptized who has not truly repented.

Baptism is a burial in water (Romans 6:3-4; Colossians 2:12). Therefore, sprinkling and pouring are not proper baptism. Baptism is in order to be saved (Mark 16:16; 1 Peter 3:21). One is not saved before he is baptized! Baptism is unto the remission [forgiveness] of sins (Acts 2:38). Just as Jesus shed His blood for the remission of sins (Matthew 26:28), so we are baptized in order to receive the remission of sins. In baptism, the sinner’s sins are washed away by the blood of Jesus (Acts 22:16).

What does one have to do in order to be forgiven of his sins? He must

  1. Hear the Gospel of Christ;
  2. Believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God;
  3. Repent of all his past sins;
  4. Confess that Christ is God’s Son;
  5. Be baptized for the remission of sins.
When he does this, he is added by the Lord to His church (Acts 2:41, 47). He is born again (John 3:3-5; 2 Corinthians 5:17). He is in Christ where all spiritual blessings are to be found. (Ephesians 1:3; Galatians 3:26-27). In short, he is a Christian (Acts 11:26; 26:28; 1 Peter 4:16).

Are you saved from your sins? Have you taken these simple steps to salvation? If not, why not do so today?
L
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What reason do we have to take this seriously?
 
SkepticThinker

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
shava said:
You know what God is Jesus incarnate in human form, who came into this world and was called Jesus , and you have demonstrated total lack of biblical knowledge or the willingness to learn anything of the bible.
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What reason do we have to believe the Bible is an authority on this subject?
 
S

shava

Active Member
SkepticThinker said:
I'm not so sure. If that were the case, you'd think he would have saved some original copies of the New Testament. :shrug:
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Why, we already have what he wrote, it's in the bible. Do you realize there were 15,000 copies that were organized by scholars who reviewed each one and put all of those that were identical and this process is just one of the processes that they used, but besides that, do you honestly think God needed any of this to make sure we had what he wanted us to know, Not in the least.
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
SkepticThinker said:
That breaks my heart. I'm so sorry.
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I appreciate that. It was nearly thirty years ago in a world far more dominated by "Christians" like @shava.
I was lucky. My family was relatively supportive and didn't keep guns in the house.
My best friend Kenny was not so lucky. He committed suicide with his dad's .38 when we were sophomores in high school.
Tom
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
shava said:
Who else but the author would you want to prove his own book?
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Something I can't help but notice is the complete lack of "The Gospel According to Jesus".

The whole Bible is people claiming to speak for God while often saying things that are demonstrably wrong.
Tom
 
SkepticThinker

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
shava said:
Why, we already have what he wrote, it's in the bible. Do you realize there were 15,000 copies that were organized by scholars who reviewed each one and put all of those that were identical and this process is just one of the processes that they used, but besides that, do you honestly think God needed any of this to make sure we had what he wanted us to know, Not in the least.
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I'm aware of the existence of textual criticism. I'm also aware that the Bible has been copied, re-copied, translated and re-translated many times over. That the Bible was written during a time period that is far removed from our own, and it shows. To me, it's obvious that humans wrote the Bible. I cannot see how it could be the infallible word of God.

Anyway, we still have no original copies of the New Testament. Odd that God didn't think to save those, no? Maybe they were inspired by Him. But if they were, He apparently doesn't want us to see them.
 
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