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Featured A scientific defense of spiritual & religious faith | Tony Jack | TEDxCLE

Discussion in 'Seekers Circle' started by Mark Dohle, Jul 28, 2019.

  1. Mark Dohle

    Mark Dohle Active Member

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    I believe this is an important talk, not sure if this is the right forum for it.


    A scientific defense of spiritual & religious faith | Tony Jack | TEDxCLE
     
  2. etong

    etong Member

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    The Bible denies basic science like how it says that the Universe and Earth began in 4004 BC, or how pi equals 3, or how It claims that the Earth is a "circle",
     
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  3. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
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    If you’re not a seeker after anything other than what you where born into it probably belongs in religious debates
     
  4. John muir

    John muir Member

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    Did mark say bible?
     
  5. etong

    etong Member

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    o_O
     
  6. etong

    etong Member

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  7. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Where does the bible say the Earth began in 4004 BC? I'll save you the trouble, it don't. You are wrong.

    Pi most commonly know as 3.14xxxxxxxxx

    Pi rounded to the nearest integer is 3. So the bible is correct.

    Well globes are round....

    Do you think the Earth is square?
     
  8. etong

    etong Member

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    Genesis 1

    "The Bible Says pi = 3"

    It said circle

    No, it's a sphere, how do you sit o9n the circle of a Earth, read your Bible and Isiah 40
     
  9. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    You have no idea what you are talking about. Just another troll spouting nonsensical hate.

    Gen 1 does not state the Earth was created in 4004 BC.

    Pi is 3 rounded to the nearest integer.

    Ancient peoples did not have precise enough equipment to measure or machine down to .1 or smaller. :facepalm:
     
  10. etong

    etong Member

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    Really, I joined this website thinking it was going to be active, I'm not a troll

    Yes it does, The Genealogies match up, what are you playing, why are you blaspheming against your god


    1.Tell that to the Egyptians
    2.With God, precise measurements should be easy, right?
     
  11. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    I am not. You are.

    Irrelevant, ancient peoples especially commoners didn't have access to technology that could measure down to .1 or smaller. Measurements was diverse depending on the occupation, for instance sailors had different units of measurement than farmers etc.

    Precision measuring didn't start until the 18th century.

    History of measurement - Wikipedia

    "Starting in the 18th century, modernized, simplified and uniform systems of weights and measures were developed, with the fundamental units defined by ever more precise methods in the science of metrology."
     
  12. etong

    etong Member

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    Do you have evidence, what does the Bible teach instead then?

    Yes they did, Egyptians had precise measurements and The Pyramids are compared to modern mathematics, and as I said, a 1 trillion iq God would supply the Israelite's with basic mathematical knowledge like that, wouldn't he?

    The Bible flunks any math test after 5th Grade
     
  13. Enoch07

    Enoch07 It's all a sick freaking joke.
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    Sure, Matthew 25 34-45.

    34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

    35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:

    36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.

    37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?

    38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?

    39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?

    40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

    41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

    42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:

    43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.

    44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

    45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

    Don't see anything about hurting black folk there.

    Not that precise.

    It wouldn't have mattered if he had.

    God gave us a anti-bacterial recipe a couple thousand years ago. It is in the Bible. We didn't even realize what it was until we figured it out for ourselves in 1984 for crying out loud.
     
  14. etong

    etong Member

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    :facepalm:, I was talking about what age of the Earth does the Bible teach

    But he couldn't give basic math??
     
  15. ratiocinator

    ratiocinator Strange Loop

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    Just to buck the trend here and respond the the actual OP...

    It is an interesting talk but it isn't a defence of the truth of any religious claims, what is says is that religious faith tends to have a positive affect on people's mental health. It also says that religion isn't the only way to achieve these results.

    It talks about two systems of thought, one to do with logical reasoning and one to do with social narratives and religion tends to stimulate the latter.

    If you actually want to know the truth of whether there is a god or not, I'd say you need the logical part of your brain - and that tends to get suppressed by religious practices. If you don't really care about the truth and just want the benefits, then you could believe whatever you want...
     
  16. HonestJoe

    HonestJoe Well-Known Member

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    I’d be curious to know why you think this is especially important.

    He isn’t really saying anything new and he isn’t presenting it in a particularly good (or bad) manner. I agree with the underlying point, though not with the extent of his implied conclusions. Some of his starting points invoked a bit of straw men and I think he was a little unfair with the presentation of some of his statistics, presenting a one-sided image of what is much more complex research about the sociological differences between people of different beliefs or religious positions. I also find it a little ironic that in his talk about balancing logic and faith, he falls back entirely on scientific logic for all of his evidence. :cool:
     
  17. Mark Dohle

    Mark Dohle Active Member

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    That can go both ways. Atheist can also be illogical in their atheism. Bellief in 'God', or some intelligent agent that is infinite is not irrational, neither is atheism. We really don't know on the level that science deimands, but again, many things we believe can't be proven.

    Peace
    Mark
     
  18. Mark Dohle

    Mark Dohle Active Member

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    Bible says nothing about how old the earth is. Now, some fundamentalists may, but hey, not many Christians are fundamentalists.
     
  19. ratiocinator

    ratiocinator Strange Loop

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    True.

    I would argue that it is unless you can provide some rational reason to take the idea seriously. It is not that rationality demands that it is necessarily false but it is not rational to believe something (about objective reality) without good reason.
     
  20. Mark Dohle

    Mark Dohle Active Member

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    There are good reasons to believe in God. For instance, Anthony Flew came to believe in God, he was a diest, becasue of DNA.....for lhim it pointed to an intelligence that was infinite. Agree, or don't, he followed the evidence, as he stated.


    At the most recent debate in 2004, at New York University, Anthony Flew declared that he ‘now accepted the existence of a God’ (p. 74). In that debate, he said that he believed that the origin of life points to a creative Intelligence,‘almost entirely because of the DNA investigations. What I think the DNA material has done is that it has shown, by the almost unbelievable complexity of the arrangements which are needed to produce (life), that intelligence must have been involved in getting these extraordinarily diverse elements to work together. It’s the enormous complexity of the number of elements and the enormous subtlety of the ways they work together. The meeting of these two parts at the right time by chance is simply minute. It is all a matter of the enormous complexity by which the results were achieved, which looked to me like the work of intelligence.


    Here is a web site wriltling about his change of mind if you wish.

    A Change of Mind for Antony Flew

    'Does God Exist?' Bill Craig Debates Peter Atkins

    'Does God Exist?' Bill Craig Debates Peter Atkins
     
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