A request for a Sanatana Dharma DIR- Dharmic and Staff members Only

[Stormcry]

So HLK correctly points out "Arya Dharma" as the right word. Add to it SF's suggestion that the same Hinduism DIR needs renaming, that's all.

Thanks, Kalicharan..

She's not going to take that issue. She has already cleared that while discussing with me.

Now we ourselves, adherents of Arya dharma should take this issue. We should post this request in Site feedback. I think Hinduism is not the proper term to define it. There should be something more to define it properly. I think It should be renamed to something like hinduism (arya) or Hinduism (Sanatana). We can not neglect hinduism bcuz this term is the official name of Hinduism & is very well known across the globe.

I think there'll be a good competition between whether we should choose Arya or Sanatana but this would be decided in a poll.

I think most of the hindus will support us to rename hinduism Dir. I think Ravi500 has already supported us.

To make this happen first we should post our request in Site feedback and with permission of administrators we would then post a poll in Hinduism DIR.

What do you say, Kalicharan ? I think you will nicely explain our request to our masters, admins.

If someone wanna support they can comment...

Thank you....

 

[Ravi500]

Namaste HLK,

I think Ravi500 has already supported us.

I back your proposal to name Hinduism as Arya Dharma too, as long as the term Aryan is used in the proper sense of the term as it is depicted in Hinduism and Buddhism i.e noble and wise, and not from any other perspective.

I stand by what I have said. I am not interested in creating a foundation for a discriminatory subculture and begetting negative karma in the process. I back your proposal only if it is presented in the proper and right perspective.

Regards,

Ravi

 

[Kalicharan Tuvij]

Namaste HLK, Ravi,

Thank you for your responses.
No doubt, Hinduism has been the "owner" of Arya (Sanatana?) Dharma. Even then, the time seems to have arrived when this Dharma now needs to "breath on its own", as a VisvaDharma in truest sense.

As we know there are plenty of Hindus (JNU types, Atheists, plain immorals, and so on) who don't belong to this Dharma anymore. And I agree that Jainism, Buddhism, Indian Abrahism, Sikhism, all have traditionally belonged to Hinduism only (in fact on HDF we have such subDIRs), and only in recent decades have come to be known of as individual religions.

If we retain Hinduism (safe option) as in "Hinduism (Arya) DIR" we will still have to deal with unwanted people claiming to be Hindus, having some agenda of their own. For example, some time back on this forum I had to perforce reply to someone attacking the DIR for "casteism in Hinduism". The person in question had anti-India propaganda in mind. I only say, this shouldn't be the place for such things and any other non-dharmic stuff.

It will be better if we can resolve Sanatana vs. Arya issue here and now. Personally I was more biased for "Vedic" like Atanu and MV suggested but reading HLK post left me in no doubt that Arya is the correct one.

Because, unlike Sanatana which is more of a common noun meaning just "eternal", Arya is both a common noun (noble) and also a proper noun capable of being an address of someone or something.

Ravi's apprehension regarding misuse of Arya word (in racial terms) IMO will be obviated once we have set the precondition that the "carrier of this AryaDharma" will be Sanskrit, and Sanskrit, alone.

 

[Stormcry]

Namaste HLK,
I stand by what I have said. I am not interested in creating a foundation for a discriminatory subculture and begetting negative karma in the process. I back your proposal only if it is presented in the proper and right perspective.

Regards,

Ravi

No, it wouldn't be a discrimination. Because we're going to put Arya or Sanatana Dir as a main Dir not as subdir. All are Aryas or noble who follow Hinduism. That's the theme of Hinduism (Arya) dir. And as we know we get many references of arya dharma words in our Veda and puranas to denote the dharma which is based on Veda. Obviously Arya dharma is the most ancient name of Hinduism. So if scriptures mebtion arya word, what is the problem? Forget about those racist ideas of Europeans.

Thank you.

 

[Stormcry]

Namaste HLK, Ravi,

Thank you for your responses.

As we know there are plenty of Hindus (JNU types, Atheists, plain immorals, and so on) who don't belong to this Dharma anymore. And I agree that Jainism, Buddhism, Indian Abrahism, Sikhism, all have traditionally belonged to Hinduism only (in fact on HDF we have such subDIRs), and only in recent decades have come to be known of as individual religions.

And Arya word would not ask them to come in Hinduism DIR. The definition is already cleared - Arya are those who believe in Vedic Scriptures like Veda and Puranas. There would be already hinduism word standing before Arya word.

It will be better if we can resolve Sanatana vs. Arya issue here and now. Personally I was more biased for "Vedic" like Atanu and MV suggested but reading HLK post left me in no doubt that Arya is the correct one.

All Sanatana/arya/vaidik are valid. It doesn't matter which we use. However I think Arya is more valid than Sanatana as it is many times used in Puranas and veda. In Bhagavata purana & Bhavishya Purana, sages have made a very clear distinction between dharma based on veda & non-vedic religions. While distinguishing with other religions puranas has a special word which is Arya dharma. Puranas classify two religions in the world - 1) Arya dharma 2) mleccha Dharma. As Puranas uses this arya word while distinguishing, it has much possibility that arya is used here to denote name of the religion... While Sanatana dharma could have many meanings like it can be used to mention everyday duty or duty according to varna I mean this could be just an adjective which is describing eternality of Dharma.

Ravi's apprehension regarding misuse of Arya word (in racial terms) IMO will be obviated once we have set the precondition that the "carrier of this AryaDharma" will be Sanskrit, and Sanskrit, alone.

Its ok to use Arya than sanatana. Ravi is considering racist ideas. We should see arya word through our vedapurana. That's the thing that natters to us. They have stolen our arya word and mqde racist ideas. And still we are thinking according to them. This is not good. Hinduism (arya) will have nothing to do with them.

There's nothing wrong in using Sanatana or vaidika or arya. We are renaming hindu dir to make it more proper. Nothing else other than this.

So I Request Kalicharan to post a request of this in Site feedback.

Thanks

 

[Madhuri]

I thought Arya Dharma referred to all Indian religions including Buddhism and Jainism?

 

[Stormcry]

I thought Arya Dharma referred to all Indian religions including Buddhism and Jainism?

Pranam Madhuri..

I'll explain...

I think the answer is big no.. First we know that this arya word is not the recent term. It's as old as Veda. And as per veda & Puranas, Arya Dharma means the Dharma based on Veda, having complete authority of Veda & Puranas. The second thing, Buddhism or Jainism are not ancient religions as Arya dharma is.. They are created religions. As per scriptures references, Buddhism & jainism are created in first phase of Kali-yuga. Buddhism is about 2000 years old. Before such religions, arya dharma term was already in use. Arya dharma was known as the dharma based on veda. Another solid reference is that in Vedic Scriptures there's no any indication of multiple religions before Kali-yuga. In ancient Bharatavarsha or Aryavarta, there was only one religion. It was Arya dharma or simply dharma. Another point is that we don't get even a single reference of Buddhism or Jainism having described as Arya Dharma or dharma based on veda. Instead we get many references indicating Buddhism or Jainism as non-vedic religion. I have already mentioned what scriptures say about Buddhism in my previous post. Please do read.


Thus these are my points answering your question. Thank you..

 

[Ravi500]

The Lord Himself, in His avatar as Rama, was described by the following epithet in the Ramayana, " Arya sarva samascaiva sadaiva priyadarsanah ", meaning, "Arya, who worked for the equality of all and was dear to everyone."

Thus a sense of equality and fraternity with all, charecterises the true Aryan.

Vasudeiva Kudumbakam -- The whole world is one family. ( Mahaupanishad )


:namaste

 

[Stormcry]

The Lord Himself, in His avatar as Rama, was described by the following epithet in the Ramayana, " Arya sarva samascaiva sadaiva priyadarsanah ", meaning, "Arya, who worked for the equality of all and was dear to everyone."

Thus a sense of equality and fraternity with all, charecterises the true Aryan.

Vasudeiva Kudumbakam -- The whole world is one family. ( Mahaupanishad )


:namaste

Yes, sense of equality is always there wherever there is Arya word.

Don't use Aryan. Use Arya. When you say Aryan it becomes racist & when you say arya it becomes sanskrit - noble.

Hare Krishna....

 

[ratikala]

namaskaram ravi ji :namaste

Namaste Kalicharan,

Thank you for your comments.


I agree with you that Arya Dharma can be a name for Hinduism. Arya here means noble, cultured person in Hinduism.

similarly I agree Arya Dharma would mean Dharma of the noble ones .....but as there is so much dispute as to who were the Arya Personaly I would avoid it for exactly the same reasons you give .....

However , I have seen that this term Aryan is used in an exclusivist sense in the forum, i.e racially related quite diametrically opposite to the sense with which it is meant in Hinduism.

it is exactly this that concerns me ....

As per the cultural , religious sense of the word, Aryan means noble, the one of ideal character, conduct and wisdom. Anyone can be an Arya in this world provided he has the given qualifications of character.

but it will undoubtably cause endless arguments about the origin of a people ....

where as Sanatana Dharma refers to the eternal Dharma which pre dates any peoples of this earth planet ...

However I am surprised to find this distorted into a race-related exclusivist sense in the forum, and had to get into clarification mode in the process. I find my views echoed substantially in all the other Hindu forums too in the net.

I am so saddened by this constant distortion , this is however Kail Yuga the age of hypocracy and lies where the poor Dharma bull stands only on one leg and soon he will fall ....
all is now confusion and every one argues over the meaning of scriptures ..distorting them to their own ends ...

This is very disturbing, considering what has happened in the last century, and I am not very comfortable being in the forum when corresponding race-related topics are discussed.

I am of the same mind it was for this and similar reasons that I wished to open this request for a simple Sub section of Hinfuism DIR ... now all hell has broken loose and the Dharma is being fought over as who who can claim to be its rightfull owner ...

no one can own what one of my favorite Buddhist masters wrote

From the Great cosmic mirrors without begining , without end .....

from the great cosmic mirror

the last verse reads .....

Of those who were dedicated to the primordial confidence,
The many hosts of warriors,
Some went to highland mountains
And erected beautiful castles of crystal.
Some went to the lands of beautiful lakes ans islands
And erected lovely palaces.
And sowed fields of barley, rice and wheat.
They were without quarrel,
Ever loving and very generous.
Without encouragement, through their self-existing
inscrutability,

I love the use of Primordial confidence ....
​

and that those who were devoted to that Primordial confidence , are called warriors , but those warriors are ever loving and without Quarrel ....through their self existing inscrutability ...(what more beautifull discription can be found for Dharma)
​

Let us not forget that many jews, gypsies, blacks too have embraced Hinduism and are entitled to the term Aryan if they are of ideal character, conduct and wisdom and especially if they are enlightened.

jai jai , after all this human body is simply a vheicle for realisation no caste , colour or ethnicity bars one from realisation :namaste

I back your proposal to name Hinduism as Arya Dharma too, as long as the term Aryan is used in the proper sense of the term as it is depicted in Hinduism and Buddhism i.e noble and wise, and not from any other perspective.

Arya Dharma is indeed correct as it is noble and true .... but my fear is that there will be claim after claim as to who has right to the title Aryan ....

I can only support Sanatana ....as it belongs to no one and to all ..it is that primprdial confidence which pre exists our creation .....


the ironic thing is I posted that poem as a thread hoping it would give some respite from the constant sectarian fueding ... but it did not even get one reply which shows the sorry state of this and simmilar sites ....you can easily see that arguing is by far prefered , infact it is delighted in .


but to return to the poem , ....

Of those who were dedicated to the primordial confidence,
The many hosts of warriors,
Some went to highland mountains
And erected beautiful castles of crystal.
Some went to the lands of beautiful lakes ans islands
And erected lovely palaces.
And sowed fields of barley, rice and wheat.
They were without quarrel,
Ever loving and very generous.
Without encouragement, through their self-existing
inscrutability,
​

those ''many hosts of warriors'' are the Arya , ... the noble ...
these ''many hosts'' are the Aryan Hindu , the Buddhists , the Jains and any other defender of peace and Rightiousness
these ''Beautifull castles'' and ''loverly palaces'' are the citys and the temples of every tradition which upholds the Dharma
and these ''feilds of barly and rice'' are our sustainance which the rightious share as the fields like the Dharma belong to no one but are for the benifit all .

only the evil and deluded argue over ownership of that which is primordialy free .

 

[Treks]

Side question to HLK:

They have stolen our arya word and mqde racist ideas. And still we are thinking according to them. This is not good. Hinduism (arya) will have nothing to do with them.

Who is the "they" who have stolen your word, and the "them" that Hinduism will have nothing to do with?

Just curious. Don't mean to derail the conversation.

Much obliged.

 

[Stormcry]

Side question to HLK:



Who is the "they" who have stolen your word, and the "them" that Hinduism will have nothing to do with?

Just curious. Don't mean to derail the conversation.

Much obliged.

I'm talking about those who have used this word to promote racism across the world . But that's not my point here to reply on this thread. I am just here feedbacking about Hinduism dir, which will make it more traditional.

Thank you....

 

[ratikala]

namaskaram Madhuri ji :namaste

I thought Arya Dharma referred to all Indian religions including Buddhism and Jainism?

to many it does there seems to be some forgeting that Mahavira is the twenty fourth Jain Tirtankar , just as Lord Buddha is equaly only the Buddha of this age both Mahavira and Buddha follow a sucesion of incarnations of the same enlighened beings ...

Rishabha the first Jain Tirtankar belonged to the Iksvaku dynasty , ....although this is being refuted here , simmilarly lord Buddha ia the Buddha of this age (Kali yuga) ....there have been countless Buddhas before .

 

[Stormcry]

Thus I have two requests to religious Forums and I'm going to post them in Site feedback... :

1) To rename Hinduism Dir to Hinduism(Sanatana) or Hinduism (arya) Dir. Arya Dharma is used as a name of religion. Yes, Sanatana Dharma is also used sometimes. But people will decide which they want. Both are valid for Hinduism. My experience through scriptures says that arya is much appropriate name than sanatana. Many puranas frequently talks about arya dharma rather than sanatana dharma. In bhavishya Purana also, the dharma is mentioned as Arya dharma not the Sanatana dharma.

2) To add philosophical subdir in hinduism dir like advaita, vishishtadvaia, dvaita, bhedabheda and shudhadvaita. I think creating such philosophical dir will greatly reduce conflicts anong various hindu philosophies. The peaceful discussion could be made by creating such separate dir according to philosophy.

Support is needed or share what do you think ?

Thank you...

 

[ratikala]

namaskaram Hinduism♥Krishna :namaste

I'm talking about those who have used this word to promote racism across the world . But that's not my point here to reply on this thread. I am just here feedbacking about Hinduism dir, which will make it more traditional.

Thank you....

I think you have missunderstood the whole intention behind this thread ....

my intention to ask for a seperate sub section for Sanatana Dharma is to allow us to discuss Dharma with out the constricts of tradition .....

traditional sounds good but on closer examination it is the cause of all the strife here on Hindism Dir ....

You your self are willing to take issue with another vaisnava (namely me) and any other Vaisnava's of Iskcon ... so this is what so called tradition is doing , it is dividing us ...

you know the expression ... Divided we fall !

you accuse me of attacking you simply because I stand up for vaisnavas as a whole ?
there is no one more than any other ....so whos tradition should be promoted ?

this again is typical of the hyjacking of a thread so comon here ...

I ask for a Simple sub section , .....you want to change it into a plea to revise Hinduism DIR .

 

[Poeticus]

I believe practicality is the best approach.
There really is no need to rename anything.
It would be more reasonable to have a few
sub-DIRs, like Vaishnava, Shaiva, Shakta,
and related paths. For those with a slight
or even ardent syncretic touch, RF has def.
been kind enough to provide a syncretic/
universalist DIR, a point that has been
repeatedly and consistently expressed
by numerous mods and RF admins.​

 

[Nyingjé Tso]

I believe practicality is the best approach.
There really is no need to rename anything.
It would be more reasonable to have a few
sub-DIRs, like Vaishnava, Shaiva, Shakta,
and related paths. For those with a slight
or even ardent syncretic touch, RF has def.
been kind enough to provide a syncretic/
universalist DIR, a point that has been
repeatedly and consistently expressed
by numerous mods and RF admins.
​

YES
YES
YES
YES AAAAALL THE WAY

Thank you bro.

On a side note, nothing personal, but I wouldn't trust the word Aryan coming from someone who have been restrictef and banned numerous times from this and another forum because of very misuse of this term for racial discrimination. Just facts.

 

[Treks]

Rati ji I'm out of frubals for you. But.. +1 anyway.

 

[Stormcry]

Thank you bro.

On a side note, nothing personal, but I wouldn't trust the word Aryan coming from someone who have been restrictef and banned numerous times from this and another forum because of very misuse of this term for racial discrimination. Just facts.

It's not Aryan. It's Arya.

I'm talking about Arya-dharma, the most ancient name of Hinduism. Arya has nothing to do with a race. Someone should not attempt to think arya word in western/European perceptive. We're here to talk about Dir issues.

I think I have to mention AryaDharma term from puranas. Wait.. Extracting....

And Thank you for abusing me. May God shiva give you peace Hare Krishna....

 

[ratikala]

namaskaram poeticus ji :namaste

I believe practicality is the best approach.
There really is no need to rename anything.
It would be more reasonable to have a few
sub-DIRs, like Vaishnava, Shaiva, Shakta,
and related paths. For those with a slight
or even ardent syncretic touch, RF has def.
been kind enough to provide a syncretic/
universalist DIR,
​

jai jai , this is all I ever suggested .....a Sub Section .....

sadly if there were a sub section for Vaisnavas I would have to share it with a viasnava that thinks he is the only vaisnava on RF and thinks he can insult other vaisnava sampradayas so I would have to boycot it for my own sanity and to prevent further offences being commited ...

I suggested sanatana dharma as a title as it belongs to no one particular tradition and embraces only the principles ....

as jayabolenath ji said earlier to alter Hinduism Dir would cause much confusion why not leave it as it is ....

Sanatana Dharma please just a small gren sub section ....just for me , so I can post beautifull poems that no one will even read because they are all too busy arguing

the only time my threads ever get past the first couple of pages anyway is when some one missunderstands what I am saying and turns it into a dispute ...

quote jayabolenath ....
YES AAAAALL THE WAY

Thank you bro.

On a side note, nothing personal, but I wouldn't trust the word Aryan coming from someone who have been restricted and banned numerous times from this and another forum because of very misuse of this term for racial discrimination. Just facts.

simmilarly I hope the mods here will realise ....that all though we try to raise above the insults and abuse and provocation dished out by a certain young man , I for one will not stand by and listen to him insult others and twist things to suit his own argument ....this is what is disrupting Hinduism DIR