Rational Agnostic
Well-Known Member
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both."
-Benjamin Franklin
-Benjamin Franklin
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
A Quote for the Times
- Thread starter Rational Agnostic
- Start date
mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
mikkel_the_dane
My own religion
Father Heathen
Veteran Member
This really poses an interesting question for a condition like a global pandemic...is liberty at all costs better--and for whom--than taking steps to control the spread of the disease?
I have no answer, just see the question there...
pingpongpal
New Member
I agree there is something wrong with society. We see a beautiful sunset or a waterfall but we also have people murdering people and mothers aborting their babies. The reason is that God created a beautiful world and then cursed it in order to punish sin. The good news is God is mitigating the curse. The curse of Genesis 3 was Eve would have pain in childbirth, Adam would have weeds and thistles, and hard labor for food and both would die. Today we have epidurals to relieve pain in childbirth, herbicides to kill weeds, and John Deere tractors to reduce work in farming. The mitigation comes through technology. Samual Morse realized this when he invented the telegraph. The first sentence he transmitted was "What hath God wrought" (Numbers 23: 23). Samuel Morse knew that he was thinking thoughts after God when he invented the telegraph. This the God of the Bible who cursed the world because of sin but gives man the technology to overcome the curse.
Rational Agnostic
Well-Known Member
I don't have an answer either, but I can speak for myself. If I were in the highest risk of death from coronavirus, I would much rather risk death and see family and friends than stay on lockdown in a nursing-home-turned-prison when I'm going to die soon anyway. But, of course I can't speak for everyone. Maybe some elderly people enjoy being legally confined to never leave their retirement facilities with no visitors allowed. But, I would bet that the majority of them despise it. But they were never asked first. Why? Because, as we are seeing, the idea that America is still a "free" country is a baldfaced LIE.
Some people choose to live in retirement homes because they can afford to and its better than having to maintain everything themselves.
Some are there of medical necessity while recovering from illness or injury. They may or may not like it, but they may not be able to afford any other choices...like are at home...
Some are there because all their other economic and social resources have run out.
To be caught in such a place during a disaster of any sort is bad. As it's also bad to be caught on a cruise ship. Or in a hotel. Or anyplace else where there's a disaster unfolding.
It's one of the many, many problems of our self-centered modern society.
Do your family and friends agree that you should freely come see them, even though it may mean THEIR illness or death? (If you happen to be a carrier.)
Rational Agnostic
Well-Known Member
I'm not visiting elderly extended family members at this time, and if I do, I'll wear a mask and take precautions and of course respect their wishes. I was simply stating what my preference would be if I were in a high risk group. I recognize not everyone would share that preference, though I think that many more would than you might imagine. The unfortunate thing is that residents of retirement facilities have no choice in the matter. They are forced to never leave the facility or have visitors, even if the majority of the residents would prefer it not to be that way.
I get you. There should be other ways to get people the care they need. But the resources needed to do alternatives simply are not available.
People don't always know enough to make the decisions for their best own interest, and unfortunately individual choices do not necessarily make the best choices for society as a whole.
I wonder what Franklin and the other Founders would have thought about a pandemic. Certainly at the time there was little understanding of disease and how it was transmitted.
syo
Well-Known Member
You and I will eat from the same fridge, brother.
pingpongpal
New Member
I believe we are free to do what God wants us to do not whatever we want to do. I believe it is right for the government to put us on lockdown because of the pandemic. I believe that quarantined laws come from applying the leprosy laws of Leviticus 14 and 15.
The woman I talked to in the nursing home did not despise the lockdown for she understood the gravity of the situation: people's lives are at stake.
I lived in China from 2005 to 2009. I realized the freedoms in the US compared to China. In China, people cannot own land only lease it, families, when I was there could only have one child. I lived near the Olympic venue so the government needed to check out my apartment. A policewoman came to my door and walked right into my apartment and started looking around, no search warrant no nothing. We did not have the freedom of assembly or press. Missionaries had their cell phones monitored or taken away because they were accused of proselytizing. Now there are video cameras everywhere and people get and lose social points based on their behavior. I think we should be thankful for the freedoms we have in the US.