A political history of Europe in a short video

[sun rise]

The claims about which country should have what land should be matched against the history of Europe's nations and ethnic groups from 400 BCE to a few years ago. It's possible that this was posted on RF before but if so it did not stay in my memory banks and maybe yours.

 

[John53]

I made it about half way through before the over dramatic music drove me away. I still don't get the point.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The Gauls, Britons and Insular Celts (Ireland and Scotland) were all Celtic, as well as many Iberians (Celtiberian). And, of course, the Celtic tribes were dominate throughout Europe before the time of that video, and then the Germanic tribes came to dominate. And even then, such as with the Germanic tribes the Teutons and Jutes and Danes would not have considered themselves the same even though today we lump them together.
And then, of course, it is strictly by what some, such as Rome, claimed. Lots of European tribes had a very different idea of that.
And you can't really settle anything territory debates with it with just showing such things, such as the history of Poland. Or how the Saxons really don't appear to have invaded Briton but where rather invited as mercenaries.

 

[sun rise]

I made it about half way through before the over dramatic music drove me away. I still don't get the point.

There's a marvelous device called a volume control.

But outside of a visual history lesson, the point is that any country in Europe which claims territory for historical reasons is utterly and completely full of crap given the changes that have occurred over the centuries.

 

[exchemist]

I made it about half way through before the over dramatic music drove me away. I still don't get the point.

Holst's Planets suite, Mars, the god of war.

I suppose the point of the video is to show the transitory nature of states and empires. The modern concept of the nation state has only really existed for about 400 years. Germany and Italy only became nation states a little over a century ago.

 

[Viker]

I made it about half way through before the over dramatic music drove me away. I still don't get the point.

It's the most metal they could use without seeming edgy. That was probably the first heavy metal song.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

But outside of a visual history lesson, the point is that any country in Europe which claims territory for historical reasons is utterly and completely full of crap given the changes that have occurred over the centuries.

Without context, I think you're overcooking things. In context, this is sometimes true, and helps maintain perspective.

 

[Heyo]

The Gauls, Britons and Insular Celts (Ireland and Scotland) were all Celtic, as well as many Iberians (Celtiberian). And, of course, the Celtic tribes were dominate throughout Europe before the time of that video, and then the Germanic tribes came to dominate.

Before the arrival of the Latins, Europe outside the Mediterranean Sea was quite peaceful with Celtic and Germanic tribes co-existing, the Germanic tribes in the north and centre, the Celts in the west and south. There was no military dominance.

 

[Heyo]

And even then, such as with the Germanic tribes the Teutons and Jutes and Danes would not have considered themselves the same even though today we lump them together.

We lump them together (and differentiate them from the Celts) by the style of the archaeological findings. The Germans were of one culture, the Celts of another. We also assume both groups had common languages.

 

[Heyo]

Holst's Planets suite, Mars, the god of war.

Only now do I realize how much Hans Zimmer plagiarized that suit.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Before the arrival of the Latins, Europe outside the Mediterranean Sea was quite peaceful with Celtic and Germanic tribes co-existing, the Germanic tribes in the north and centre, the Celts in the west and south. There was no military dominance.

By dominate I was thinking more the larger group, found more throughout. Not necessarily through conquest.
At least in America it's basically unspoken in our school's history that Rome had many Celtic and Germanic tribes socially militarizing as a result of the military presence of Rome.
Where just told there were barbarians causing problems for Rome at the boarder. But Rome was pretty brutal and it makes sense why others basically had to learn to fight.

 

[Estro Felino]

By dominate I was thinking more the larger group, found more throughout. Not necessarily through conquest.
At least in America it's basically unspoken in our school's history that Rome had many Celtic and Germanic tribes socially militarizing as a result of the military presence of Rome.
Where just told there were barbarians causing problems for Rome at the boarder. But Rome was pretty brutal and it makes sense why others basically had to learn to fight.

Tacitus's historical book Germania is considered very useful to understand the relations between Romans and Germanic populations in the imperial age.
It's very interesting how Tacitus is very unbiased because he praises so many virtues of these populations. Especially marital fidelity and sobriety. Light years away from the Rome of that period: orgies, swinging, promiscuity....lust for unbridled luxury.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Tacitus's historical book Germania is considered very useful to understand the relations between Romans and Germanic populations in the imperial age.
It's very interesting how Tacitus is very unbiased because he praises so many virtues of these populations. Especially marital fidelity and sobriety. Light years away from the Rome of that period.
Orgies, swinging, promiscuity....lust for unbridled luxury.

The relationship varied from tribe to tribe. Some were at war, some where friendly trade partners, some were in total submission. Some leaders were in open rebellion against Rome while some were cooperative puppets installed by Rome.

 

[Estro Felino]

The relationship varied from tribe to tribe. Some were at war, some where friendly trade partners, some were in total submission. Some leaders were in open rebellion against Rome while some were cooperative puppets installed by Rome.

The Rhine and Danube were the natural borders of the Empire. Unfortunately Romans always wanted to cross these two big rivers, and so wars started.
Not to mention the war at the beginning of the movie The Gladiator. That was one of the worst.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The Rhine and Danube were the natural borders of the Empire. Unfortunately Romans always wanted to cross these two big rivers, and so wars started.
Not to mention the war at the beginning of the movie The Gladiator. That was one of the worst.

Its been so many years since I've seen that I remember Russel Crowe is in it and that's pretty much it.

 

[Heyo]

The Rhine and Danube were the natural borders of the Empire. Unfortunately Romans always wanted to cross these two big rivers, and so wars started.

Given the length of the border and the time Romans and Germans were neighbours, there were very few wars, most of these "wars" were mere skirmishes and not all were started by the Romans. After establishing the Limes the Romans were mostly content with their territory and with the trading posts they had within Germania, reaching as far as Hamburg and the Harz.

 

[JIMMY12345]

The claims about which country should have what land should be matched against the history of Europe's nations and ethnic groups from 400 BCE to a few years ago. It's possible that this was posted on RF before but if so it did not stay in my memory banks and maybe yours.

Vet informative keep them coming

 

[Estro Felino]

Given the length of the border and the time Romans and Germans were neighbours, there were very few wars, most of these "wars" were mere skirmishes and not all were started by the Romans. After establishing the Limes the Romans were mostly content with their territory and with the trading posts they had within Germania, reaching as far as Hamburg and the Harz.

When the capital of the Roman Empire was moved to Constantinople, the Western Roman Empire started decaying. Because the treasury was managed by Byzantium; it wasn't the Germanic populations. On the contrary, they helped Romans against the Huns thanks to their pacts of alliance: foedera, hence foederati.
The pronunciation of Medieval Latin (now called Ecclesiastical Latin) was greatly influenced by Germanic populations such as Goths. So the term natio (nation) was pronounced like na-tsee-oh, because the Germans introduced the /ts/ and the /z/ sound. Like rosa, which was pronounced /roza/. In Italy we still pronounce Latin that way. Whereas the English pronounce it differently, like ancient Romans used to.
Liste italienischer Wörter deutscher Herkunft – Wikipedia

 

[Twilight Hue]

I made it about half way through before the over dramatic music drove me away. I still don't get the point.

It means the argument is weak.

 

[JIMMY12345]

The claims about which country should have what land should be matched against the history of Europe's nations and ethnic groups from 400 BCE to a few years ago. It's possible that this was posted on RF before but if so it did not stay in my memory banks and maybe yours.

Dear Sunrise - very useful will watch