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Featured A More Compassionate Response to Abortion

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Fool, May 18, 2022.

  1. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    if a person was pro-life, would it be a better response to offer someone who is considering abortion, financial and/or physical support? Then at the end of the pregnancy ask the person to release the newborn to either themselves, an adoption agency, or the state protective services?

    how is forcing someone to have an unwanted and probably unplanned pregnancy going to ensure the longevity and well being of a potential person, a fetus?

    when did controlling your neighbor, or trespassing against your neighbor become ok with the biblical commandment not to trespass?

    is it OK to steal from peter to pay Paul, who may/may not be a fully formed and born individual?
     
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  2. Estro Felino

    Estro Felino Believer in free will
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    A woman can decide to have an abortion out of very different reasons.
    She can be afraid of the pregnancy, labor and delivery. Both physically and psychologically.

    If the reason is exclusively economic, if we speak of first world countries, it is the State who takes care of the children that a mother cannot take care of.
     
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  3. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    unfortunately, most of the right to lifers don't care how this affects the individual. they only care about parts of the individual
     
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  4. pearl

    pearl Well-Known Member

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    There are no one answer fits all here, except protecting the life of the unborn. Having done that, assuming Court will, then what? Consider the woman of an unplanned pregnancy, whether married or single, now faced with the birth of a life she has carried full term, and without a safety net, must give up for adoption. By now maybe she is in love with this miracle of life and wants to keep it. Thinking that adoption is an immediate answer for both baby and mother does not take into account the child who wonders who the birth mother is and why she gave him/her up. I still think the only answer for the best of both mother and baby is that government safety net. It remains a question of whether the same persons who celebrate the end of abortion will step up.
     
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  5. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    the unborn aren't individuals and can never be understood as such. individuals are something separate from something else.

    and i agree, there is no one answer to fit all. this shouldn't be a black and white knee jerk response.
     
    #5 Fool, May 18, 2022
    Last edited: May 18, 2022
  6. pearl

    pearl Well-Known Member

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    It would seem that the unborn are soon to become individuals and as such are protected by the Constitution. It is what it is, denying it or putting on blinders doesn't change the reality, or possible reality to come.
     
  7. Watchmen

    Watchmen Well-Known Member
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    By that reasoning, the mother is no longer an individual because she is not separate from the fetus (the “something else”).
     
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  8. Wildswanderer

    Wildswanderer Well-Known Member

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    Many pregnancy crisis centers do just that... and are run by pro lifers.
     
  9. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    No. A potential is not protected by the Constitution. And bodily autonomy does give the mother the right to abort. This is a concept that has been supported by one right to lifer after another.
     
  10. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    you can pass all kinds of laws. doesn't make it anything but a law. slavery was once seen as constitutional because it didn't specifically mention blacks.

    there can be all kinds of laws pass to try and regulate human beings. but trying to change the definition isn't that easy; even if some want to claim fetus' are individuals. they aren't. they have to be separate to qualify
     
  11. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    we don't refer to a pregnant woman in the plural for a reason. there isn't two people there.

    the mother isn't inside and dependent upon the fetus. also the mother is obviously conscious. the fetus isn't. it can't recognize something separate and autonomous from itself.

    people who try to control another's autonomous behavior have bigger psychological issues.


    they are commiting trespass and coveting what isn't theirs. you can't serve god and your own need to control another individual/person
     
  12. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    good so leave other's free will and autonomy to be alone.

    you are aware that most people who seek abortion are christians in the USA?
     
  13. Watchmen

    Watchmen Well-Known Member
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    I used your own language. Now you’re moving the goal posts. And you’re invoking god. Once you rely on fairy tales to support you’re argument you’ve lost me.
     
  14. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    no i didn't you just don't understand language and trying to twist words, means something it doesn't. a fetus is not a human being. it can't be counted as separate/individual/person being. a person carrying a fetus can. you obviously don't understand the original post. i used the term "potential" person or the term individual on purpose.
     
  15. SomeRandom

    SomeRandom Still learning to be wise
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    I would be inclined to agree.

    Though I do consider abortion immoral (except in cases of rape, incest and medical emergencies) I am staunchly pro choice.
    Though I’ve no doubt there are some who call themselves pro life that do try to help pregnant people in bad situations.
    I simply don’t see that side, if you will, fight for any practical solutions.

    Then again I’m neither Christian nor American. So I suppose my answer doesn’t mean much lol
     
  16. Wildswanderer

    Wildswanderer Well-Known Member

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    How would you know that? Do you fill out a card with your religion on it at the clinic? I doubt it.
     
  17. Left Coast

    Left Coast Still Gay
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    It makes more sense, I think, to speak in terms of independence and viability. A woman can survive without the fetus in her womb. The fetus can't survive outside the mother's womb until they've reached a certain stage of development. A is dependent on B, B isn't dependent on A. The question is whether the state should be able to force B to keep A alive inside her own body against her will.
     
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  18. Watchmen

    Watchmen Well-Known Member
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    That’s not what I said or was responding to. I responded to post #5. And there is no twisting of words. I used the plain language you provided and applied logic.

    And I understand language just fine. I was an English major, my university gave me a special award for being among the top 5% of writers in my graduating class, and now I primarily read and write while applying logic and reasoning for a living.
     
  19. Watchmen

    Watchmen Well-Known Member
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    Sure, but that’s not what the Fool said in post #5. I also note that the US is one of only two major countries who measure abortion laws in terms of viability.
     
  20. Left Coast

    Left Coast Still Gay
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    What would you like the abortion laws in the US to be?
     
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