3 dead, 6 injured in Michigan high school shooting; 15-year-old suspect in custody, authorities say

[Dan From Smithville]

"Better" rather than "more" is my regulatory focus.
But it would mean some new ones regarding
storage & training.

I doubt most anybody legitimately needs to have a firearm loaded with more than six bullets. I'd like the private ownership of large capacity magazines, specifically those that could be loaded with more than 6 rounds of ammo, be effectively banned by there being a hefty tax and national registry imposed on the private owners of large capacity magazines. I'm confident this common sense gun control measure will result in fewer mass shootings.

Better and more relevant regulations and not just more regulations seems the most logical path to minimize the problems from the sourcing end. I am not sure how to deal with the mental issues of those that decide shooting up vulnerable groups is the best choice for them.

 

[Revoltingest]

Better and more relevant regulations and not just more regulations seems the most logical path to minimize the problems from the sourcing end. I am not sure how to deal with the mental issues of those that decide shooting up vulnerable groups is the best choice for them.

Gun control is just one aspect of improving safety,
eg, training requirements, storage standards.
Mental health services need to be pro-active in
detecting problems & serving people's needs.
Example...
In this case, at least one student didn't attend
cuz they anticipated trouble. This could've been
acted upon.

 

[Suave]

Gun control is just one aspect of improving safety,
eg, training requirements, storage standards.
Mental health services need to be pro-active in
detecting problems & serving people's needs.
Example...
In this case, at least one student didn't attend
cuz they anticipated trouble. This could've been
acted upon.

Mental Illness Not a Factor in Most Mass Shootings

"THURSDAY, Feb. 25, 2021 (HealthDay News) -- Contrary to what many believe, a new study finds that mental illness isn't a factor in most mass shootings or other types of mass murder.

"The findings from this potentially definitive study suggest that emphasis on serious mental illness, such as schizophrenia or psychotic mood disorders, as a risk factor for mass shootings is given undue emphasis, leading to public fear and stigmatization," study co-leader Gary Brucato said in a Columbia University news release. He's an associate research scientist in the university's Department of Psychiatry in New York City.

Brucato and his colleagues analyzed 1,315 mass murders of all types that occurred worldwide and found that only 11% of all mass murderers (including shooters) and only 8% of mass shooters had serious mental illness.

The rate was 18% among people who committed mass murder through non-firearm means such fire, explosives, poison, stabbing, bludgeoning or driving vehicles into crowds.

While guns were used in nearly two-thirds of all mass murders, non-firearm means resulted in significantly more casualties per event.

The researchers also found that mass shooters in the United States were more likely to have legal histories, use recreational drugs, abuse alcohol, and have histories of non-psychotic psychiatric or neurologic symptoms."

Mental Illness Not a Factor in Most Mass Shootings

Kyle Rittenhouse is reportedly going to destroy the AR-15 he used to fend off angry rioters from attacking him. I'm confident this will inspire other people to realize they too don't need a semi-auto rifle loaded with 30 bullets in order to defend themselves. If Kyle Rittenhouse was able to fend off an angry mob with just 8 shots, then most nobody needs to have a high capacity magazine loaded with 30 rounds of ammo.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

What does gun control have to do with this case? He took his dad's gun, which was a handgun. Maybe we should pass laws against stupid and inept parents.

 

[Suave]

What does gun control have to do with this case? He took his dad's gun, which was a handgun. Maybe we should pass laws against stupid and inept parents.

Really? You honestly believe legislating responsible parenting is going to magically get rid of stupid and inept parents?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Really? You honestly believe legislating responsible parenting is going to magically get rid of stupid and inept parents?

Really? You honestly believe legislating responsible gun ownership is going to magically get rid of gun crimes?

 

[Revoltingest]

Mental Illness Not a Factor in Most Mass Shootings

That doesn't address my post. One can have mental
issues that lead to violence, even if one isn't diagnosed
with a specific "mental illness". Troubled kids can be
helped with mental health services.

But even if "most" aren't "mentally ill" as you'd define
it, that would mean that some are. And those could
be helped. There's no single solution to this complex
problem. But each solution could improve things.
Don't let perfection become a reason to ditch good.

 

[Suave]

What does gun control have to do with this case? He took his dad's gun, which was a handgun. Maybe we should pass laws against stupid and inept parents.

Really? You honestly believe legislating responsible gun ownership is going to magically get rid of gun crimes?

Well maybe if dad's gun wasn't loaded with a magazine capable of holding 15 rounds of ammo, then this would not have enabled a 15 year old to massacre 3 people in less than a few minutes. If dad's gun were limited to having only six rounds, this might have bought time for the gunman's would be targets to escape due to the gunman having to reload his weapon.

 

[Suave]

That doesn't address my post. One can have mental
issues that lead to violence, even if one isn't diagnosed
with a specific "mental illness". Troubled kids can be
helped with mental health services.

But even if "most" aren't "mentally ill" as you'd define
it, that would mean that some are. And those could
be helped. There's no single solution to this complex
problem. But each solution could improve things.
Don't let perfection become a reason to ditch good.

I agree addressing mental health issues might help prevent some mass shootings , but I'm doubtful this approach only would be as effective as also getting rid of high capacity magazines. Stephen Paddock, the Vegas mass shooter, had no indications or signs of being mentally unstable. As far as anyone knew, he was mentally stable.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Well maybe if dad's gun wasn't loaded with a magazine capable of holding 15 rounds of ammo, then this would not have enabled a 15 year old to massacre 3 people in less than a few minutes. If dad's gun were limited to having only six rounds, this might have bought time for the gunman's would be targets to escape due to the gunman having to reload his weapon.

Maybe if the dad kept the weapon away from his disturbed teenaged son and actually paid attention to him, this wouldn't have happened.

No, I don't think more useless laws are going to help. Even when we do have laws that are supposed to keep guns out of the hands of disturbed individuals, the systems often don't "talk" to each other and people fall through the cracks, like Cho, the Virginia Tech mass murderer. Others acquire their weapons illegally, like the Columbine killers. Or steal them from others in the household, like Adam Lanza, who was terribly failed by society and his family when it was quite clear that he was extremely disturbed and needed institutionalization. Nothing will change because people don't care and don't pay attention to even members of their own household.

 

[Revoltingest]

I agree addressing mental health issues might help prevent some mass shootings , but I'm doubtful this approach only would be as effective as also getting rid of high capacity magazines. Stephen Paddock, the Vegas mass shooter, had no indications or signs of being mentally unstable. As far as anyone knew, he was mentally stable.

Banning hi cap mags has constitutional problems.
I prefer practical legal useful solutions. We'll never
eliminate violence. But it should be reduced & minimized.

 

[Suave]

Maybe if the dad kept the weapon away from his disturbed teenaged son and actually paid attention to him, this wouldn't have happened.

No, I don't think more useless laws are going to help. Even when we do have laws that are supposed to keep guns out of the hands of disturbed individuals, the systems often don't "talk" to each other and people fall through the cracks, like Cho, the Virginia Tech mass murderer. Others acquire their weapons illegally, like the Columbine killers. Or steal them from others in the household, like Adam Lanza, who was terribly failed by society and his family when it was quite clear that he was extremely disturbed and needed institutionalization. Nothing will change because people don't care and don't pay attention to even members of their own household.

The National Firearms Act 0f 1934 effectively banned fully automatic guns, I have good reason then this approach might also work to effectively ban high capacity magazines. Please let us agree there should be a hefty tax and national registry database imposed on the private owners of high capacity magazines This sensible gun control measure has a history of effectively banning fully automatic firearms, so please let us try this on effectively banning high capacity magazines.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

The National Firearms Act 0f 1934 effectively banned fully automatic guns, I have good reason then this approach might also work to effectively ban high capacity magazines. Please let us agree there should be a hefty tax and national registry database imposed on the private owners of high capacity magazines This sensible gun control measure has a history of effectively banning fully automatic firearms, so please let us try this on effectively banning high capacity magazines.

Fully automatic guns aren't banned, nationally (they are in some states). You just have to have a special federal permit and pay thousands of dollars for it. There's most likely a lot of restrictions on who qualifies for it, though, making it rare.

 

[Suave]

Banning hi cap mags has constitutional problems.
I prefer practical legal useful solutions. We'll never
eliminate violence. But it should be reduced & minimized.

Circuit Court upholds California ban on high-capacity magazines! I suppose this ruling might be challenged in the Supreme Court.

 

[Suave]

Fully automatic guns aren't banned, nationally (they are in some states). You just have to have a special federal permit and pay thousands of dollars for it.

Correct! Likewise, please let us impose this same gun control measure on high capacity magazines. ...

 

[Revoltingest]

Circuit Court upholds California ban on high-capacity magazines! I suppose this ruling might be challenged in the Supreme Court.

It should be.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Correct! Likewise, please let us impose this same gun control measure on high capacity magazines. ...

I don't see the point. A bullet is a bullet.

 

[Suave]

I don't see the point. A bullet is a bullet.

The point is a firearm limited to firing 6 shots without having to be reloaded enables a mass shooter to massacre fewer victims than a firearm capable of firing 30 shots. without having to be reloaded.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

The point is a firearm limited to firing 6 shots without having to be reloaded enables a mass shooter to massacre fewer victims than a firearm capable of firing 30 shots. without having to be reloaded.

I don't see the point, because there's nothing to stop them from getting a bigger clip illegally. Shoot, street gangs have AK-47s and all kinds of other illegal weapons. It's a waste of time trying to ban this stuff. The law-abiding will follow the laws and the criminals will continue to do what they want, as I mentioned about other mass shooters. The ones I mentioned didn't legally own the guns they used.

 

[Suave]

It should be.

Since the U.S. Constitution was written at a time when firearms were limited in capacity to being loaded with just one bullet stored in them, the second Amendment could not even possibly apply to firearms with high capacity magazines. Since Kyle Rittenhouse was able to fend off an angry mob with just 8 shots, there is no need for most anybody having a firearm loaded with 30 rounds of ammo in order to defend himself. Right?