15 dollar an hour minimum wage hike....... oh oh..

[ecco]

I think you are overestimating how much college grads make...

I didn't estimate anything. I did some research.

 

[ecco]

Well maybe some of you should read what the CBO had to say about it.
$15 Minimum Wage Would Reduce Poverty But Cost Jobs, CBO Says.
Government report says $15 minimum wage would cost 1.4 million jobs

I'm sure the CBO has people far more knowledgeable than me. But, I question comments like...

Government report says $15 minimum wage would cost 1.4 million jobs

That is because higher wages would increase the cost of producing goods and services and, in response, many employers would reduce their workforce or hire fewer employees, the report said.

​

That implies that companies could produce the same amount of goods and services and profits with fewer employees. That always struck me as strange. Why not get rid of the excess now and increase the bottom line.

 

[ecco]

There is much to this. A mom & pop operation in rural PA (very inexpensive to live here) who might need to hire a person or two to help out would likely find $15 prohibitively high.

Why would they need to hire them? If they are so busy they must be making money and expect their new hires to make even more profits.

If a new employee gets paid $35000 annually, the owners need to expect their profits will increase $70,000.

If a new employee gets paid $50000 annually, the owners need to expect their profits will increase $100,000.

If not, don't hire.

 

[averageJOE]

A $15 minimum wage was so 15 years ago. I no longer support it.

I support a Living Wage for anyone working 40 hours a week in any job.

 

[metis]

I'm sure the CBO has people far more knowledgeable than me. But, I question comments like...

Government report says $15 minimum wage would cost 1.4 million jobs

That is because higher wages would increase the cost of producing goods and services and, in response, many employers would reduce their workforce or hire fewer employees, the report said.

​

That implies that companies could produce the same amount of goods and services and profits with fewer employees. That always struck me as strange. Why not get rid of the excess now and increase the bottom line.

Exactly. Most employers don't hire excess employees over what they need just for the heck of it.

Also, raising the minimum wage puts more $ into the hands of lower-income families and/or young people, whom are more likely to spend it locally, which is where we want economic growth to be generated-- Economics 101,

Also, if some do not have a livable wage, they must draw on government funds paid for out of taxes or steal or get into the black market in order to get by.

 

[tytlyf]

That implies that companies could produce the same amount of goods and services and profits with fewer employees. That always struck me as strange. Why not get rid of the excess now and increase the bottom line.

I wonder how many of the 1.5 millions job loss estimate is from paranoid small business owners firing an employee when the new wage is implemented?
I'd assume some small business owners that fear a wage increase will be the first to fire at least 1 employee to make sure they can make ends meet.
Even before letting the system run it's course.

Soon enough, these business owners are going to be looking to hire that person right back.

 

[esmith]

Mandating a minimum wage for the entire country remindes me of the Forrest Gump line "stupid is as stupid does".
The cost of living varies considerably across the country and in many instances across the region or State. What is needed for instance in say San Francisco CA is totatly different in Homedale ID; also the cost of living is different in Homedale ID and Boise ID.
Government should not mandate many policies and this is one of them.

 

[metis]

It's just seems so utterly "evil" that so many on the right want government to help big business but not lower-income workers. So, when Amazon pays the same percent in federal taxes as do middle-income Americans, please let us know, OK?

 

[Twilight Hue]

It's just seems so utterly "evil" that so many on the right want government to help big business but not lower-income workers. So, when Amazon pays the same percent in federal taxes as do middle-income Americans, please let us know, OK?

I changed my tune on minimum wage once I saw this gem.

Why 70% Of Companies Paid Zero In Corporate Taxes: They Had Zero Profits

It's time anyways to let the lower tier worker prosper.

 

[tytlyf]

Mandating a minimum wage for the entire country remindes me of the Forrest Gump line "stupid is as stupid does".
The cost of living varies considerably across the country and in many instances across the region or State. What is needed for instance in say San Francisco CA is totatly different in Homedale ID; also the cost of living is different in Homedale ID and Boise ID.
Government should not mandate many policies and this is one of them.

We get it, you support corporate policy over worker policies. That's why you're a Republican

 

[Shaul]

Ultimately the government doesn’t set the minimum wage, the market does.

 

[tytlyf]

Ultimately the government doesn’t set the minimum wage, the market does.

Since when?

 

[esmith]

Since when?

Just a off the wall question. Have you ever worked for a business that had more than 1 employee?
If you had, then you would know that when there is a shortage of qualified empoyees to fil a position the incentivities and salaries increase.

 

[Stevicus]

Just a off the wall question. Have you ever worked for a business that had more than 1 employee?
If you had, then you would know that when there is a shortage of qualified empoyees to fil a position the incentivities and salaries increase.

Not if outsourcing or using undocumented workers is an option. There have been some businesses who have complained that they wouldn't be able to survive if there was any real crackdown on illegal immigration. There's obviously something very wrong if businesses can't survive without breaking the law or working around the domestic market. If they have to rely on illegalities and/or outsourcing to authoritarian countries where there is a captive labor force, then it's not exactly a "free" market, now is it?

 

[esmith]

Not if outsourcing or using undocumented workers is an option. There have been some businesses who have complained that they wouldn't be able to survive if there was any real crackdown on illegal immigration. There's obviously something very wrong if businesses can't survive without breaking the law or working around the domestic market. If they have to rely on illegalities and/or outsourcing to authoritarian countries where there is a captive labor force, then it's not exactly a "free" market, now is it?

Did I say anything about outsourcing or illegal aliens?
So, not sure where you are attempting to go with your response to my post.

 

[Stevicus]

Did I say anything about outsourcing or illegal aliens?
So, not sure where you are attempting to go with your response to my post.

Your post was in response to another post in the context of an assertion of the market setting the minimum wage.

 

[esmith]

Your post was in response to another post in the context of an assertion of the market setting the minimum wage.

That is correct. the labor market sets the value of a position.
When there is a shortage a business has to either pay overtime or hire someone to fill that position.
If there is a shortage of "qualified", and I reiterate "qualifed", workers then the business has to offer some form of initiative to attract that skill set. This initiave can be in the form of a hiring bonus or salary.
You may not agree with this opinion but that is the way I look at it.

 

[fantome profane]

Not if outsourcing or using undocumented workers is an option. There have been some businesses who have complained that they wouldn't be able to survive if there was any real crackdown on illegal immigration. There's obviously something very wrong if businesses can't survive without breaking the law or working around the domestic market. If they have to rely on illegalities and/or outsourcing to authoritarian countries where there is a captive labor force, then it's not exactly a "free" market, now is it?

There is something wrong with the business or there is something wrong with the law, or possibly both,

What you need is a migrant worker program that would allow more foreign workers to come and work legally in those industries that require them. That way you could protect both the migrant workers from being abused, and also protect American workers at the same time.

 

[Stevicus]

That is correct. the labor market sets the value of a position.
When there is a shortage a business has to either pay overtime or hire someone to fill that position.
If there is a shortage of "qualified", and I reiterate "qualifed", workers then the business has to offer some form of initiative to attract that skill set. This initiave can be in the form of a hiring bonus or salary.
You may not agree with this opinion but that is the way I look at it.

No, I agree with it in theory, but it just doesn't appear to work that way in practice.

I find this to be true across the board whenever there is a debate involving capitalism. Capitalists always argue about the abstract and theoretical, while conveniently ignoring how capitalism actually is in practice.

 

[Stevicus]

There is something wrong with the business or there is something wrong with the law, or possibly both,

What you need is a migrant worker program that would allow more foreign workers to come and work legally in those industries that require them. That way you could protect both the migrant workers from being abused, and also protect American workers at the same time.

I agree, although capitalists will never go for that. That's why the migrant workers have remained in legal limbo as neither major party wants to change the status quo. A major crackdown on undocumented workers would bring about economic chaos, or so say the businesses that benefit from it. But then, they also don't want to make them legal either, since the workers would then be protected by labor laws, OSHA - and businesses would be subject to the same rules as in the domestic labor market.