10 people killed in shooting at Colorado supermarket

[Stevicus]

Colorado supermarket shooting claims ‘multiple’ lives, suspect arrested, police say | Reuters

A gunman opened fire at a supermarket in Boulder, Colorado, on Monday, killing 10 people, including a police officer, before being arrested, marking the second deadly U.S. mass shooting in less than a week.

Police gave few immediate details of the shooting and no known motive for the violence, which unfolded at about 3 p.m. at a King Soopers grocery store in Boulder, a north-central Colorado city at the eastern foot of the Rockies, about 28 miles (45 km) northwest of Denver.

Frantic shoppers and employees fled for cover through the supermarket as law enforcement officers swarmed the scene, located about 2 miles from the University of Colorado's flagship campus.

Sarah Moonshadow, 42, a customer and Boulder resident who was in the store with her son, Nicholas, recounted scenes of pandemonium as gunfire rang out from inside the store.

"We were at the checkout, and shots just started going off," Moonshadow told Reuters. "And I said, 'Nicholas get down.' And Nicholas ducked. And we just started listening and there, just repetitive shots ... and I just said, 'Nicholas, run.'"

Moonshadow said she tried to go to the aide of a victim she saw lying on the pavement just outside the store, but her son pulled her away, telling her, 'We have to go.'" The woman broke down in sobs, adding, "I couldn't help anybody."

There was a video showing a man being led away in handcuffs and into an ambulance. They didn't say anything about a possible motive.

 

[Estro Felino]

Omg....
Why?

 

[Trailblazer]

Colorado supermarket shooting claims ‘multiple’ lives, suspect arrested, police say | Reuters

There was a video showing a man being led away in handcuffs and into an ambulance. They didn't say anything about a possible motive.

That's so tragic.

 

[Heyo]

Omg....
Why?

1. Healthcare system (Broken, especially for people with mental health problems.)
2. Gun Laws (Much too easy to get guns, especially for people with mental health problems.)
3. Apathy (US citizens have become accustomed to frequent shootings. They have given up on doing something against it.)

 

[JustGeorge]

1. Healthcare system (Broken, especially for people with mental health problems.)
2. Gun Laws (Much too easy to get guns, especially for people with mental health problems.)
3. Apathy (US citizens have become accustomed to frequent shootings. They have given up on doing something against it.)

1. I can't speak for the whole of the country, but mental health care is a wreck where I am. Absolute wreck. There is no psychologists available for minors in this area(and I don't mean few, I mean zero), and its not a whole lot easier for adults.
2.Few take into account the amount of stolen guns floating around out there as well...
3.Having been a victim of gun crime, I can state that I very much felt like no one gave a rat's behind. Not the cops, nor the citizens. "Well, you knew better than to live in that area." was a common response... as if it was somehow our faults.

 

[Trailblazer]

1. I can't speak for the whole of the country, but mental health care is a wreck where I am. Absolute wreck. There is no psychologists available for minors in this area(and I don't mean few, I mean zero), and its not a whole lot easier for adults.

Tell me about it.
I do not know about children but it is not easy for adults here...If I want an appointment with a counselor I normally have to wait at least a month. Of course the same is true for vet appointments.
And there are no clinical psychologists available for appointments in my health plan, only MA level counselors.. I am a MA level counselor myself so they are going to tell me anything I do not already know. I get more help talking to people on this forum!
And marriage counseling is not a covered benefit either so I would have to pay out of pocket for that.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

1. I can't speak for the whole of the country, but mental health care is a wreck where I am. Absolute wreck. There is no psychologists available for minors in this area(and I don't mean few, I mean zero), and its not a whole lot easier for adults.
2.Few take into account the amount of stolen guns floating around out there as well...
3.Having been a victim of gun crime, I can state that I very much felt like no one gave a rat's behind. Not the cops, nor the citizens. "Well, you knew better than to live in that area." was a common response... as if it was somehow our faults.

Goodness! I'm really sorry you went through that (fwiw).

I 've been a victim, too...in a good neighborhood!

I so look forward to the fulfillment of Psalms 37:10-11, when God's Kingdom (Matthew 6:9-10) rules this Earth!
IMO.

 

[Trailblazer]

1. Healthcare system (Broken, especially for people with mental health problems.)
2. Gun Laws (Much too easy to get guns, especially for people with mental health problems.)
3. Apathy (US citizens have become accustomed to frequent shootings. They have given up on doing something against it.)

Compare/contrast gun laws in Japan to the United States.

Japan has almost completely eliminated gun deaths — here's how

• Japan is a country of more than 127 million people, but it rarely sees more than 10 gun deaths a year.
• Culture is one reason for the low rate, but gun control is a major one, too.
• Japan has a long list of tests that applicants must pass before gaining access to a small pool of guns.

Japan has almost completely eliminated gun deaths — here's how

The weapons law of Japan begins by stating "No one shall possess a firearm or firearms or a sword or swords", and very few exceptions are allowed. Citizens are permitted to possess firearms for hunting and sport shooting, but only after submitting to a lengthy licensing procedure.

Overview of gun laws by nation - Wikipedia

“The only guns that Japanese citizens can legally buy and use are shotguns and air rifles, and it’s not easy to do. The process is detailed in David Kopel’s landmark study on Japanese gun control, published in the 1993 Asia Pacific Law Review, still cited as current. (Kopel, no left-wing loony, is a member of the National Rifle Association and once wrote in National Review that looser gun control laws could have stopped Adolf Hitler.)

To get a gun in Japan, first, you have to attend an all-day class and pass a written test, which are held only once per month. You also must take and pass a shooting range class. Then, head over to a hospital for a mental test and drug test (Japan is unusual in that potential gun owners must affirmatively prove their mental fitness), which you’ll file with the police. Finally, pass a rigorous background check for any criminal record or association with criminal or extremist groups, and you will be the proud new owner of your shotgun or air rifle. Just don’t forget to provide police with documentation on the specific location of the gun in your home, as well as the ammo, both of which must be locked and stored separately. And remember to have the police inspect the gun once per year and to re-take the class and exam every three years.

Even the most basic framework of Japan’s approach to gun ownership is almost the polar opposite of America’s. U.S. gun law begins with the second amendment's affirmation of the “right of the people to keep and bear arms” and narrows it down from there. Japanese law, however, starts with the 1958 act stating that “No person shall possess a firearm or firearms or a sword or swords,” later adding a few exceptions. In other words, American law is designed to enshrine access to guns, while Japan starts with the premise of forbidding it.”

From: A Land Without Guns: How Japan Has Virtually Eliminated Shooting Deaths

This policy is very similar to the Laws of the Baha’i Faith:

173. It hath been forbidden you to carry arms unless essential # 159

Bahá’u’lláh confirms an injunction contained in the Bayán which makes it unlawful to carry arms, unless it is necessary to do so. With regard to circumstances under which the bearing of arms might be “essential” for an individual, ‘Abdu’l-Bahá gives permission to a believer for self-protection in a dangerous environment. Shoghi Effendi in a letter written on his behalf has also indicated that, in an emergency, when there is no legal force at hand to appeal to, a Bahá’í is justified in defending his life. There are a number of other situations in which weapons are needed and can be legitimately used; for instance, in countries where people hunt for their food and clothing, and in such sports as archery, marksmanship, and fencing. The Kitáb-i-Aqdas, pp. 240-241

 

[Stevicus]

1. Healthcare system (Broken, especially for people with mental health problems.)
2. Gun Laws (Much too easy to get guns, especially for people with mental health problems.)
3. Apathy (US citizens have become accustomed to frequent shootings. They have given up on doing something against it.)

There's definitely severe problems in the area of mental health. Not only due to lack of funding, but also a general stigma about people who are mentally ill. A lot of people believe that people with problems should handle them on their own and pull themselves up by their own bootstraps. They think it's weak (to ask for help or "whine" about their problems), and people don't generally want to appear weak in front of others. A show of force makes them look strong, not weak. It may sound kind of twisted, but that's the consequences of the culture we live in.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

1. Healthcare system (Broken, especially for people with mental health problems.)
2. Gun Laws (Much too easy to get guns, especially for people with mental health problems.)

Mass murder is not a symptom or trait of any mental health issue. I'm getting really sick of people trying to connect the two. It's offensive and insulting. Murder is not a mental health issue.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

2.Few take into account the amount of stolen guns floating around out there as well...

Every stolen gun started out as a legal gun.

"Illegal" firearms are still a product of the "legal" firearm industry and gun culture.

 

[We Never Know]

Mass murder is not a symptom or trait of any mental health issue. I'm getting really sick of people trying to connect the two. It's offensive and insulting. Murder is not a mental health issue.

And im getting tired of hearing its the guns fault. Normal(used as a general term) everyday people don't just go out and commit shootings.
Something sets the shooter's apart.

I'm not against stricter gun laws but I am against bans. And quit blaming the guns. After some shootings there have been cases where family members have sued the guns manufactuer and won.

Why can't family members sue beer makers for losses due to someone drunk driving?


A gun or beer doesn't kill on its own.

 

[Heyo]

Mass murder is not a symptom or trait of any mental health issue. I'm getting really sick of people trying to connect the two. It's offensive and insulting. Murder is not a mental health issue.

Charles Whitman

The Facts on Mental Illness and Mass Shootings - FactCheck.org

Mental Illness, Violent Behavior, and Mass Shootings

Mental Health and School Shootings

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Charles Whitman

The Facts on Mental Illness and Mass Shootings - FactCheck.org

Mental Illness, Violent Behavior, and Mass Shootings

Mental Health and School Shootings

I've aware that many have mental illness, but not all do, so this is not primarily a mental health issue. Most murderers are not mentally ill. Are soldiers in combat mentally ill? My point is that there is no mental illness, in of itself, that causes someone to kill. Violence is just something innate to humanity and some people view that as a solution to their problems or a good idea.

 

[anna.]

Every stolen gun started out as a legal gun.

Not necessarily. People who order firearm components online and assemble them themselves aren't constructing a legal gun.

 

[We Never Know]

Not necessarily. People who order firearm components online and assemble them themselves aren't constructing a legal gun.

AKA the zip gun

 

[Heyo]

I've aware that many have mental illness, but not all do, so this is not primarily a mental health issue. Most murderers are not mentally ill. Are soldiers in combat mentally ill? My point is that there is no mental illness, in of itself, that causes someone to kill. Violence is just something innate to humanity and some people view that as a solution to their problems or a good idea.

It is not primarily a mental health issue but it is one factor. The easy availability of guns is another factor (and I think the most important one).
Also, I have a hard time finding an other explanation than mental health problems when someone goes into a supermarket and randomly shoots people. What is their motivation?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Not necessarily. People who order firearm components online and assemble them themselves aren't constructing a legal gun.

They're still constructing a gun from legal parts. There's also still one part of the gun (the receiver, generally) that's considered "the gun" for legal purposes.

Anyhow, my point is that firearms aren't like, say, IEDs or moonshine made from household products in a back shed. They're all made by companies operating under the law. The "illegal" gun market is fed entirely from the legal gun market (which I would say includes the market for gun parts).

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

It is not primarily a mental health issue but it is one factor. The easy availability of guns is another factor (and I think the most important one).
Also, I have a hard time finding an other explanation than mental health problems when someone goes into a supermarket and randomly shoots people. What is their motivation?

It depends on the shooter - suicide, vengeance, targeting specific groups of people, etc. Why does a terrorist blow up a bunch of people? We don't say it's because they're mentally ill.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

And im getting tired of hearing its the guns fault. Normal(used as a general term) everyday people don't just go out and commit shootings.
Something sets the shooter's apart.

Sure - the gun is an inanimate object. But one thing that sets mass shooters apart from the general public that they acquire caches of weapons suited to mass shootings.

I'm not against stricter gun laws but I am against bans. And quit blaming the guns. After some shootings there have been cases where family members have sued the guns manufactuer and won.

Good.

Why can't family members sue beer makers for losses due to someone drunk driving?


A gun or beer doesn't kill on its own.

The intended use of beer isn't drunk driving. The intended use of many firearms is the taking of human life. So that's one difference.

That being said, if a brewer or a firearms manufacturer are designing or marketing their products in a way that causes significant harm to third parties, then why shouldn't they be held liable?