So, you want me to come up with a ruling in the Quran, then show you that ruling was change in the Quran itself?
If you like, but that would just show that the Quran contradicts itself.
My point is that what Allah made halal (like slavery, execution by torture, using female captives for sex), no man can make haram.
The civilised world may have outlawed those things, but they are still considered morally acceptable in Islam.
Protest all you want. It is irrelevant to the ruling
Exactly. Islam imposes barbaric punishments that the civilised world has outlawed. Anyone suffering those punishments should be defended.
I mean puberty, not property
So you accept that the onset of puberty is the baseline by which Islam determines adulthood.
It is YOU who can't understand the point
Whatever he did, was morally acceptable, it doesn't mean 21st century people follow him and do the same.
If morality is objective and divinely revealed (as Islam claims) then if whatever Muhammad did in the 7th century is objectively moral, then it is still objectively moral.
Obviously, Muslims do not have to follow everything he did (they would be arrested if they did!), but you cannot claim that it is morally unacceptable.
Muhammad married and had sex with a child. Therefore it was morally acceptable then and morally acceptable now.
Muhammad tortured people to death. Therefore it was morally acceptable then and morally acceptable now.
Muhammad owned and traded slaves. Therefore it was morally acceptable then and morally acceptable now.
A pretty simply concept.
Well, the long discussion we had and all my explanation, that is the base of my conclution.
I don't know what was the age, could be 9 could be 20
On what do you base the claim that she could have been 20?
The point is, it was fine back then, but it doesn't mean it will be fine if she was 9 today because time changes, people change,
. It is fine today if Muhammad is the perfect moral example for all mankind.
It is not fine today if he was just a man of his time and place.
You claim he is the perfect moral example foe all mankind.
and maturity levels changed
The available evidence shows that girls generally reach puberty younger today than they did non the ancient world.
If you can't get it, it doesn't change anything
I get it just fine. It is you who is struggling to grasp the concept. You are trying to claim that a perfect, timeless moral example is not a perfect moral example for today because what he did is morally unacceptable today. Which would mean that cannot be a perfect, timeless moral example. See?
The problem is that you have essentially answered it with both "yes" and "no".
Arranged marriage was common back then even at the time baby girls are born, But, when it comes to the actual marriage when the girl becomes a woman, she is asked her opinion
Aisha's marriage to Muhammad
was arranged. That is not in dispute.
Even if she was asked her opinion (which is unlikely), given the circumstances, she would almost certainly have consented. But of course, the consent of a child is not valid by modern legal standards - but it is by islamic standards.
