Yahweh first, others second, us last

"Today, most people of the world intend to live to please only themselves. They put themselves in the number one position. Yet...we were taught in our youth to put the Almighty first in all things, to place others second and to consider ourselves last. Why has this noble concept been changed so drastically in our time throughout society?"

Taken from the Sacred Name Broadcaster, July 2022 edition.

Discuss.

In ancient times and dating as far as into medieval age nations were led by religious authority and most leaders were religious or at least pretending to be.
This changed, today leadership promotes capitalism and the rule of money and openly dismiss religious way.

People learn from above, who ever above them is.

Messianic Israelite said:

"Today, most people of the world intend to live to please only themselves. They put themselves in the number one position. Yet...we were taught in our youth to put the Almighty first in all things, to place others second and to consider ourselves last. Why has this noble concept been changed so drastically in our time throughout society?"

Taken from the Sacred Name Broadcaster, July 2022 edition.

Discuss.

Click to expand...

Teachers are idiots, what is there to discuss?

Messianic Israelite said:

Why has this noble concept been changed so drastically in our time throughout society?

Click to expand...

Ask YHWH, it is his creation. No?

Messianic Israelite said:

"Today, most people of the world intend to live to please only themselves. They put themselves in the number one position. Yet...we were taught in our youth to put the Almighty first in all things, to place others second and to consider ourselves last. Why has this noble concept been changed so drastically in our time throughout society?"

Taken from the Sacred Name Broadcaster, July 2022 edition.

Discuss.

Click to expand...

This is why people turn away from religion.
It is possible to be compassionate, tolerant and not selfish without religion, in fact I would say in many cases it is easier to be compassionate, unselfish and tolerant without religion.

Messianic Israelite said:

"Today, most people of the world intend to live to please only themselves. They put themselves in the number one position. Yet...we were taught in our youth to put the Almighty first in all things, to place others second and to consider ourselves last. Why has this noble concept been changed so drastically in our time throughout society?"

Click to expand...

I have to disagree. I find nothing noble in "putting the Almighty first." There is no virtue in theism or piety. Virtue resides in integrity, empathy (kindness), reason, education, skepticism, and justice. The Christian commandment to love God and love one another can be shortened to just the Golden Rule, especially when one considers what is meant by love in Christianity. Love has nothing to do with blood sacrifice or being rescued from the hell the deity created. That's a perversion of the Golden Rule, one that leads to people claiming that their homophobia and misogyny are acts of love.

And no, most people in the world don't exist only to please themselves. That's another religious trope intended to demean humanity and to make religion appear to be necessary. Humanists, for example, are typically law abiding people raising families and contributing to their communities. They care about all of those people - their loved ones, their neighbors, and strangers who can use help. Who is taking the side of transgender rights, or teaching racial history, or is now attempting to restore reproductive rights to American women? Who is fighting against climate change and COVID disinformation, or trying to protect democracy from its enemies?

Not the Christians putting Yahweh first.

Messianic Israelite said:

"Today, most people of the world intend to live to please only themselves. They put themselves in the number one position. Yet...we were taught in our youth to put the Almighty first in all things, to place others second and to consider ourselves last. Why has this noble concept been changed so drastically in our time throughout society?"

Click to expand...

Because it is not a noble concept. A noble concept is to put the needs of the less fortunate, less powerful above one's own needs. To put the needs of the fortunate, the powerful, the leaders above one's own needs or the less fortunates needs is a slave mentality and that is exploited by the powerful.

Messianic Israelite said:

"Today, most people of the world intend to live to please only themselves. They put themselves in the number one position. Yet...we were taught in our youth to put the Almighty first in all things, to place others second and to consider ourselves last. Why has this noble concept been changed so drastically in our time throughout society?"

Taken from the Sacred Name Broadcaster, July 2022 edition.

Discuss.

Click to expand...

I often put others first before myself. It's just my nature. At times I put myself first because I am somebody and I am worth something like everyone else. No need or use for an "Almighty". A belief or faith in an "Almighty" doesn't demonstrate compassion and service to others, especially those in most need.

Messianic Israelite said:

"Today, most people of the world intend to live to please only themselves. They put themselves in the number one position. Yet...we were taught in our youth to put the Almighty first in all things, to place others second and to consider ourselves last. Why has this noble concept been changed so drastically in our time throughout society?"

Taken from the Sacred Name Broadcaster, July 2022 edition.

Discuss.

Click to expand...

In my experience, monotheists' image of God is a personification of their own beliefs and values, so "putting God first" actually means putting themselves first.

Messianic Israelite said:

"Today, most people of the world intend to live to please only themselves. They put themselves in the number one position. Yet...we were taught in our youth to put the Almighty first in all things, to place others second and to consider ourselves last. Why has this noble concept been changed so drastically in our time throughout society?"

Taken from the Sacred Name Broadcaster, July 2022 edition.

Discuss.

Click to expand...

My question would be, why is it wrong to please ourselves? So long as we are not hurting anyone, why should seeking pleasure be wrong?

I'm not saying be selfish, but it's pretty normal for humans to want to do things that make them happy. So why would I give up my happiness to please a deity I don't even worship? I see nothing noble about it.

syo said:

Teachers are idiots, what is there to discuss?

Click to expand...

Yeah? Is that so?

Altfish said:

This is why people turn away from religion.
It is possible to be compassionate, tolerant and not selfish without religion, in fact I would say in many cases it is easier to be compassionate, unselfish and tolerant without religion.

Click to expand...

Hi Altfish. Good afternoon. Being compassionate, tolerant and not selfish would be dependent on the rules we live by, or were taught throughout life. If you have children, you'll realise you have to teach them these qualities. Tolerance however is not always a good trait to have. Tolerating sin will make one weak. But that aside, the Bible gives us guidance and rules as to how we should live our lives. Those who do not have such rules are often subject to their own personal feelings as to when or if they should show these quality traits. With the Bible, showing such attributes is a way of life. Although I can imagine that some people who are not religious may show some good character traits sometimes, those who adhere to the Bible will be showing these without variance. Jacob 3:17 says "But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, easy to be entreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without variance, without hypocrisy."

If you put the average non-religious person in a situation where they were in life-death situation, I'm of the opinion that most would disregard any favourable attributes in order to save themselves alive. I've seen this several times through my life, where non-religious people who seem to have good qualities abandon them whenever it suits them to. To me, following the Bible must be done even if threatened with death. Faith in Yahweh is a very important element if we want to please Yahweh (Hebrews 11:6) and actually, it would not be possible to overcome our sinful natures without the help of Yahweh. Yahshua my Savior was able to overcome his sinful nature which we all have but he was constantly praying, even in the middle of the night, relying upon Yahweh. When we put Yahweh first, others second and us last, I find we put things in to proper perspective. Actually, putting Yahweh first can be demonstrated by the first of the Ten Commandments, but also other places like Proverbs 3:5-9. When we put Yahweh first, we put his Law first and his Law will guide us in every situation to keep us from the many pitfalls of life. We then learn how not to be selfish, because Yahweh is not selfish.

Proverbs 16:7 says "When a man’s ways please Yahweh, He maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him." This I have found to be true. Pleasing Yahweh first adds a great deal of peace to one's life, and that extends to the lives of others also.

It Aint Necessarily So said:

I have to disagree. I find nothing noble in "putting the Almighty first." There is no virtue in theism or piety. Virtue resides in integrity, empathy (kindness), reason, education, skepticism, and justice. The Christian commandment to love God and love one another can be shortened to just the Golden Rule, especially when one considers what is meant by love in Christianity. Love has nothing to do with blood sacrifice or being rescued from the hell the deity created. That's a perversion of the Golden Rule, one that leads to people claiming that their homophobia and misogyny are acts of love.

And no, most people in the world don't exist only to please themselves. That's another religious trope intended to demean humanity and to make religion appear to be necessary. Humanists, for example, are typically law abiding people raising families and contributing to their communities. They care about all of those people - their loved ones, their neighbors, and strangers who can use help. Who is taking the side of transgender rights, or teaching racial history, or is now attempting to restore reproductive rights to American women? Who is fighting against climate change and COVID disinformation, or trying to protect democracy from its enemies?

Not the Christians putting Yahweh first.

Click to expand...

Hi It Aint Necessarily So. Good afternoon. I would say putting Yahweh first is noble because of the definition of the term 'noble' which is "having or showing fine personal qualities or high moral principles." When we put Yahweh first, we will be showing the same personal qualities as Yahweh and Yahshua. Most don't seem to agree with this, but Yahweh is a moral Elohim. You'll probably want to respond with some of the times when Yahweh exterminated people: Noah's flood, or Sodom and Gomorrah, or even the conquests of the Israelites. Yahweh is consistent. He always replaced unrighteous people with righteous ones. The Israelites were no exception. All over the age of 20 were destroyed, and their children went in to inhabit the Promised Land. Yahweh destroys wicked people because wickedness is infectious and to protect the innocent or righteous such an action needs to be taken. Yahweh could of ignored the problem. He doesn't. He acts and He is hated for it and He knows He will be hated by people but He does it anyway. Yahweh is certainly of the strongest character that I know. When Yahshua was on this earth, He represented Yahweh and we can all see that Yahshua lived an upstanding and highly moral life. There is virtue in piety. At least when it comes to the Bible.

If you put your (say) wife or husband first, and that person is a wicked person, then you will also be wicked. Something similar is mentioned in Proverbs 29:12 regarding rulers. When we put Yahweh first, when we care about Him, His thoughts and His Name, we learn a great deal. We start thinking like Yahweh. We start acting like Yahshua. But the noble aspect of it also comes from the fact that we are putting our Creator first. He created us. It is noble that we put Yahweh first. Yahweh didn't have to give us life. He could have created us and left us a dead corpse, not giving us the breath of life. Yahweh foresaw all the evil that mankind would do and yet He created us anyway.

I found it curious that you mentioned scepticism as a virtue. I wouldn't agree. Rather, one should say 'truth' or truthful speaking is a virtue. We do not have to be skeptics, but it is important to follow the inductive method and be people of truth. I hate lying. The older I get, the more I hate lying. And to avoid lies, telling lies or believing lies, I have to take what people say with a pinch of salt but I wouldn't call myself a sceptic, questioning everything. I certainly don't question the Word.

In terms of the Golden Rule that you mentioned, yes, do unto others as you would have them do unto you. But you can't just take that one rule out of the Bible and ignore the rest. The whole Biblical Law relates to the Golden Rule. Yahweh gave His Law to us so we could make it in to the Kingdom of Yahweh and live the Kingdom way of life. Yahweh did unto us, what He would have someone do unto Him by giving us instructions as to how to make it to the Kingdom and not leaving His creation in the dark. You say love has nothing to do with Yahshua's sacrifice. I don't see how you can say that. The Bible tells us that the greatest act of love we can show is when we lay down our life for another. Yahweh sent His only Begotten Son, someone who had no business having to suffer on this earth as a human being, and sent him to bring back His people and to offer his life as a perfect sacrifice for us that we might have a blood covering for our sins. You probably are saying that love has nothing to do with Yahshua's sacrifice because you don't realise that our Creator hates sin, and sin separates humankind from Yahweh and the only way back to Yahweh is through a blood sacrifice. If we want to draw closer to Yahweh, we must do so through Yahshua.

Misogyny, which you mentioned, is a hatred for women. I don't see Yahshua hating women when he was on this earth, or anyone else in the Bible. You say humanists are generally law-abiding people. Well, that's your opinion. A few weeks ago, I read about a woman who had lost a few pounds, and now had a 'bikini body' and wanted to now leave her husband and try out other men. Humanism is not an enlightened way of thinking. Thinking that there is no after life causes people to act in a selfish way. Thinking this way will make people act in a way that they think will make them happy regardless of the cost to others. You can't beat the Bible when it comes to morality. Even in Laws such as Leviticus 18:22 regarding homosexuality, there is logic to these laws. AIDS and HIV and other diseases such as monkeypox are evident among those who practice such lifestyles.

Guitar's Cry said:

Yeah? Is that so?

Click to expand...

Yes.

syo said:

Yes.

Click to expand...

<Checks my certification>

Hm...don't see anything on idiocy...

Messianic Israelite said:

Hi Altfish. Good afternoon. Being compassionate, tolerant and not selfish would be dependent on the rules we live by, or were taught throughout life. If you have children, you'll realise you have to teach them these qualities. Tolerance however is not always a good trait to have. Tolerating sin will make one weak. But that aside, the Bible gives us guidance and rules as to how we should live our lives. Those who do not have such rules are often subject to their own personal feelings as to when or if they should show these quality traits. With the Bible, showing such attributes is a way of life. Although I can imagine that some people who are not religious may show some good character traits sometimes, those who adhere to the Bible will be showing these without variance. Jacob 3:17 says "But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, easy to be entreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without variance, without hypocrisy."

If you put the average non-religious person in a situation where they were in life-death situation, I'm of the opinion that most would disregard any favourable attributes in order to save themselves alive. I've seen this several times through my life, where non-religious people who seem to have good qualities abandon them whenever it suits them to. To me, following the Bible must be done even if threatened with death. Faith in Yahweh is a very important element if we want to please Yahweh (Hebrews 11:6) and actually, it would not be possible to overcome our sinful natures without the help of Yahweh. Yahshua my Savior was able to overcome his sinful nature which we all have but he was constantly praying, even in the middle of the night, relying upon Yahweh. When we put Yahweh first, others second and us last, I find we put things in to proper perspective. Actually, putting Yahweh first can be demonstrated by the first of the Ten Commandments, but also other places like Proverbs 3:5-9. When we put Yahweh first, we put his Law first and his Law will guide us in every situation to keep us from the many pitfalls of life. We then learn how not to be selfish, because Yahweh is not selfish.

Proverbs 16:7 says "When a man’s ways please Yahweh, He maketh even his enemies to be at peace with him." This I have found to be true. Pleasing Yahweh first adds a great deal of peace to one's life, and that extends to the lives of others also.

Click to expand...

I don't know where to start ...
The rules that I and my family and friends live by are not in any particular book, they are built up through life's experiences, learning to be empathetic, treating others as you would wish to be treated yourself. Meanwhile The Bible teaches you not to mix certain fabrics, not to work on the Sabbath, who to worship and plenty of other useless things.

Your opinion of what the average non-religious person would do in a life-death situation are purely anecdotal and in my experience, non-believers, instead of praying do useful things to save their own lives and lives of others.

Quoting your holy book does not impress non-believers; I'm sure if I quoted Sam Harris or Christopher Hitchens you would be equally unimpressed.

Heyo said:

Because it is not a noble concept. A noble concept is to put the needs of the less fortunate, less powerful above one's own needs. To put the needs of the fortunate, the powerful, the leaders above one's own needs or the less fortunates needs is a slave mentality and that is exploited by the powerful.

Click to expand...

Hi Heyo. Good afternoon. Interesting concept. But just because one might be powerful, doesn't necessarily mean one is fortunate, does it? Ecclesiastes 1:18 says "For with much wisdom comes much sorrow; the more knowledge, the more grief." There is none with more wisdom than Yahweh. I don't know why more people aren't sensitive to Yahweh's needs and wants. Yes Yahweh is powerful, but He is grieved every day with all the wickedness that is going on in this world. Read Psalm 7:11 "Elohim is a righteous judge, Yea, a Elohim that hath indignation every day." Does that sound like being fortunate to you. To be able to see all the evil that is going on in the world, you think that is something to be desired? Yahweh is spiritually rich, but in this world it seems He is poor. He doesn't have many followers. More and more people are turning away from faith.

What I am trying to say is this. Yahweh has needs, and His needs are far more important than our needs. And whose heart deserves comforting more than Yahweh's? You've no doubt read Genesis 6, how Yahweh's heart was grieved with all the wickedness in the world in Noah's time. It's my aim to comfort Yahweh, to prove to Yahweh they are still those trying to do His will and please Him the way He wants. Malachi 1:6 says "A son honoreth his father, and a servant his master: if then I am a father, where is mine honor? and if I am a master, where is my fear? saith Yahweh of hosts unto you, O priests, that despise my name. And ye say, Wherein have we despised thy name?" Where is Yahweh's honor in this world? Most people are quick to accuse Yahweh, and not quick to bless Him.

No, Yahweh's needs matter most and being the most loving of all Beings, yet also having to uphold justice, Yahweh is very much alone. If it was not for a small remnant that seek to please Him, Yahweh would be terribly discouraged. Putting Yahweh first is a noble concept not simply because so few people do it, but because it's the right thing to do for the one who created us, cared for us and wants to bring us in to the Kingdom (2 Peter 3:9).

Viker said:

I often put others first before myself. It's just my nature. At times I put myself first because I am somebody and I am worth something like everyone else. No need or use for an "Almighty". A belief or faith in an "Almighty" doesn't demonstrate compassion and service to others, especially those in most need.

Click to expand...

Hi Viker. Good afternoon. It's good that you have this in your nature. However, if we just have the idea to put others first, without putting Yahweh first, because other people can be evil or evil-minded, you risk actually doing more harm than good, not just to them but yourselves. A not very good example of this but the only one I can think of in the moment is when a homeless person asks for cigarettes, or money, specifically to buy drugs. If you put that person first, if you put their wants first, you might be inclined to give them what they want and therefore they will be damaging their own bodies. When we put Yahweh first, we realise that the sixth commandment instructs us not to kill, and that by getting the homeless person those things we would be doing something to damage or kill them which is unlawful. However, Yahweh's Law also tells us to give to the poor (Deuteronomy 15:11), so in that situation you would decline to get or buy those things for the homeless person and offer to buy them food or something else instead. If we put Yahweh first, it safeguards us against many pitfalls in life that just putting others first won't necessarily do.

However, it is true that when we put the needs of others above our own, we often do good to ourselves in the process. Proverbs 11:6 says "The merciful man doeth good to his own soul; But he that is cruel troubles his own flesh." One of the things I do is distribute food to the poor. I haven't been doing too much of it in the past couple of months because of Sabbatical Year, however, normally I enjoy to do this, making soup such as sweet potato soup, tomato soup, broccoli soup etc and distributing it on an evening to the poor. Many times I prosper from this as I learn how to make new soups, but also if there is any left over, I'll eat that myself. Doing good to others, often allows us to do good to ourselves.

You say faith in the Almighty doesn't demonstrate compassion and service to others, but I have found that it does. We become like that which we look at and concerning ourselves with Yahweh will make us compassionate people.

Messianic Israelite said:

He doesn't. He acts and He is hated for it and He knows He will be hated by people but He does it anyway.

Click to expand...

That’s because given His powers, acting like a normal human tyrant seems an odd choice. He could have a better relationship with people and support them and instead He just shows up to complain after centuries of neglect.

9-10ths_Penguin said:

In my experience, monotheists' image of God is a personification of their own beliefs and values, so "putting God first" actually means putting themselves first.

Click to expand...

Hi 9-10ths_Penguin. Good afternoon. Interesting idea. However, we don't need to make up our own image of Yahweh. Yahweh's will, wants and desires are openly shown in His Word for all to view, read and study. In a sense, putting Yahweh first is putting ourselves first because Yahweh is concerned with His people and wants the best for them. The scriptures say: "Can a man be profitable unto Elohim? Surely he that is wise is profitable unto himself." Is not therefore seeking wisdom, doing Yahweh's will, in a sense selfish? Somewhat so, because our wisdom, our doing the will of Yahweh, will bring us in to the Kingdom. You could say we do it for ourselves. But because Yahweh is so caring and loves us so much, then when we love him back by putting him first, we always come out of every situation on top.