You should try reading posts before replying.
And I'm still waiting for your Harry Potter analogy explanation.
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Existence of God is my knowledge
- Thread starter questfortruth
- Start date
You should try reading posts before replying.
And I'm still waiting for your Harry Potter analogy explanation.
rational experiences
Veteran Member
God theists America.
O earths cosmic heaven memory. Life came out first on one continent only. Originally real.
Science origin was built by man as the giant pyramid. All life on earth origin became extinct.
Heavens cosmic memory. Snap froze instant. Melt. America is origin human race. Giant memory pyramid frozen. Exact. Why you remember in vision causes.
Why a human feels believes America was human beginnings. Historic correct to origin. Not after ice age.
Exhibited in humans memory in America. Where Satan cloud angels emerged in mass cooling after satanic destruction by the alien UFO mass star fallout. Holding memory.
Also exhibited by American Indians paintings about heavens voice memories.
Is exact.
Today is memory defected by the reinherited ice age. Not the constant memory. Given back memory only.
No ice states the dinosaur life lived in between the returned snap freeze.
America owns least ground mass beneath plates. Father says a huge cavernous earth hole is there.
America owns most UFO sightings.
A crime A America. Returned human life to origin scene sciences crime is real.
America notified of Romes rich man position past church founding. Said rich man will get life destroyed. Rich man history is humans life's problems.
Notified by the nation's DNA spiritual indian father. Aware by America's cloud mass visions himself. Foretold when white man comes to his land...nuclear end of life warning.
My own woman visions. Against human man theist of all science terms. In vision placed our human brother and pyramid advice in first dinosaurs life destruction.
So I wondered. Researched asking had man actually been living in times of the dinosaur. As memory virtually said he was present.
Cold blooded biology said no. Advice pre warning said old man's pyramid science was still attacking the earth body destroying life. He had activated stats asteroid fall.
It keeps returning.
Stated consciously. Human man thinker said he owned the holy wandering star. Notified human ownership is stated.
Men's mind hurt. Self destructive man became a drunk drug taker in America. Goes back to his rebuilt church. Returns he says to his promised man status.
Oath to protect human life on earth versus rich man. Still fixated on organisational egotism.
As natural family are the highest natural spiritual innocent self. Humanity.
Holy. Natural. Never poor.
Rich man invented by civilisation status of poor man is fake.
I could have founded a natural healing venue. Based on other humans money. I was advised it was needed free medical but not a part of teaching as a human healer grounded mind awareness.
I wanted it for families sake. Spirit asked me not to on message gained returned of humans only advice. I listened. What was needed. Not what I wanted.
Manifested human messages I saw were in holy life's returned body mass given by earths God ice saviour. Cloud message imaged visions...stories.
Where father's mother's true microbial water life regenerates itself. By cloud mass support. Giving the message back as a Human only.
As microbial food energy is part of humans life own bio subsistence. Holy water real.
We prove we didn't belong in creation spiritually human from eternal form as we die.
Yet consciously after death we re awake as the eternal part of consciousness itself.
I was taught humans are the bio spirit eternals own living brain. Experience only. We live biology as their created caused physical brain mind.
Why a human can state one day the extent of their eternal body placing massive pressure upon creation is where mass O bodies push back. Will end. It will shut. Explode scatter.
Their body will be owning only a scar as an experience it caused. Shut creation eternal self always had existed. Is a direct word used taught human explanation.
Exact meaning. Had and always will exist.
God Rock has not always existed. Nor did the heavens exist until rock had. Exact warned teachings.
So they teach us. Humans are living a bio organic mind dream of their own causes.
It's true. We are all living as a part of a message by what we do interpret by being. The small messages gain an overviewed human only message that guides us.
O earths cosmic heaven memory. Life came out first on one continent only. Originally real.
Science origin was built by man as the giant pyramid. All life on earth origin became extinct.
Heavens cosmic memory. Snap froze instant. Melt. America is origin human race. Giant memory pyramid frozen. Exact. Why you remember in vision causes.
Why a human feels believes America was human beginnings. Historic correct to origin. Not after ice age.
Exhibited in humans memory in America. Where Satan cloud angels emerged in mass cooling after satanic destruction by the alien UFO mass star fallout. Holding memory.
Also exhibited by American Indians paintings about heavens voice memories.
Is exact.
Today is memory defected by the reinherited ice age. Not the constant memory. Given back memory only.
No ice states the dinosaur life lived in between the returned snap freeze.
America owns least ground mass beneath plates. Father says a huge cavernous earth hole is there.
America owns most UFO sightings.
A crime A America. Returned human life to origin scene sciences crime is real.
America notified of Romes rich man position past church founding. Said rich man will get life destroyed. Rich man history is humans life's problems.
Notified by the nation's DNA spiritual indian father. Aware by America's cloud mass visions himself. Foretold when white man comes to his land...nuclear end of life warning.
My own woman visions. Against human man theist of all science terms. In vision placed our human brother and pyramid advice in first dinosaurs life destruction.
So I wondered. Researched asking had man actually been living in times of the dinosaur. As memory virtually said he was present.
Cold blooded biology said no. Advice pre warning said old man's pyramid science was still attacking the earth body destroying life. He had activated stats asteroid fall.
It keeps returning.
Stated consciously. Human man thinker said he owned the holy wandering star. Notified human ownership is stated.
Men's mind hurt. Self destructive man became a drunk drug taker in America. Goes back to his rebuilt church. Returns he says to his promised man status.
Oath to protect human life on earth versus rich man. Still fixated on organisational egotism.
As natural family are the highest natural spiritual innocent self. Humanity.
Holy. Natural. Never poor.
Rich man invented by civilisation status of poor man is fake.
I could have founded a natural healing venue. Based on other humans money. I was advised it was needed free medical but not a part of teaching as a human healer grounded mind awareness.
I wanted it for families sake. Spirit asked me not to on message gained returned of humans only advice. I listened. What was needed. Not what I wanted.
Manifested human messages I saw were in holy life's returned body mass given by earths God ice saviour. Cloud message imaged visions...stories.
Where father's mother's true microbial water life regenerates itself. By cloud mass support. Giving the message back as a Human only.
As microbial food energy is part of humans life own bio subsistence. Holy water real.
We prove we didn't belong in creation spiritually human from eternal form as we die.
Yet consciously after death we re awake as the eternal part of consciousness itself.
I was taught humans are the bio spirit eternals own living brain. Experience only. We live biology as their created caused physical brain mind.
Why a human can state one day the extent of their eternal body placing massive pressure upon creation is where mass O bodies push back. Will end. It will shut. Explode scatter.
Their body will be owning only a scar as an experience it caused. Shut creation eternal self always had existed. Is a direct word used taught human explanation.
Exact meaning. Had and always will exist.
God Rock has not always existed. Nor did the heavens exist until rock had. Exact warned teachings.
So they teach us. Humans are living a bio organic mind dream of their own causes.
It's true. We are all living as a part of a message by what we do interpret by being. The small messages gain an overviewed human only message that guides us.
firedragon
Veteran Member
Read the OP mate.
rational experiences
Veteran Member
Basic God is humans science as rock beginning.
There is no science in fact says the human thinker.
Money man fake.
No money or riches exist. God first does not make you rich. Rich men said it had by terms their number factors they infer to substance then money.
Man owning machine. Took earths mass first forced it into becoming a machine.
Didn't spend anything except some human sweat building.
Lies about money's status as how much he's spent personally...conscious says his human self only.... to now not getting his money losses back.
Makes very evil human choices on his fakery.
The exact an Agreed greed of Alpha man. Status rich men take. Destroys all life in earth.
As it's a real human warning.
You never knew rock stone as it wasn't any beginnings except by human science thesis.
Beginning terms in cosmic no status of anything now.
There is no science in fact says the human thinker.
Money man fake.
No money or riches exist. God first does not make you rich. Rich men said it had by terms their number factors they infer to substance then money.
Man owning machine. Took earths mass first forced it into becoming a machine.
Didn't spend anything except some human sweat building.
Lies about money's status as how much he's spent personally...conscious says his human self only.... to now not getting his money losses back.
Makes very evil human choices on his fakery.
The exact an Agreed greed of Alpha man. Status rich men take. Destroys all life in earth.
As it's a real human warning.
You never knew rock stone as it wasn't any beginnings except by human science thesis.
Beginning terms in cosmic no status of anything now.
Read it, don't get it, I need someone with your superior intellect to explain it to this unintelligent infidel. Or just send more personal attacks, they amuse me.
Altfish
Veteran Member
Change the word 'God' to 'Zeus' or 'The Flying Spaghetti Monster' and it makes as much sense.
Using math to prove that God exists?
Okay. 2 + 2 = 4, therefore Santa Claus exists.
Exactly my point. The use of math doesn't strengthen the logic.
If the world really was done with intelligent design, the designer would have been a genius. But, all indications are that the world naturally occurred. Natural Selection accounts for the increased complexity of life.
I think that inbreeding creates mutations, and this allows natural selection to create creatures that adapt to changing conditions.
Science interferes with religion. Theists say that the universe is 6,000 years old, and scientists say that it is 13.8 billion years old.
Therefore, reading also interferes with religion.
PureX
Veteran Member
You have no logical reason to assume that just because you don't know if or what 'God' is, that God doesn't exist. So calling your preferred bias "truth" is not serving anything but your own ego. If that's good enough for you, then so be it, I guess.
First, you don't know what's an illusion and what isn't. Second, from a human perspective, all truth is an "illusion" in that we can never be certain of it. And third, sharing an idea that works well for us, with others, is just a logical thing to do. Especially knowing that we cannot force anyone to accept any idea as truth. So your objections, here, seem to be failing on all counts.
I would love to see you explain this course of reasoning.
All anyone can do is share their ideas and experience of living by those ideas with others. That's it. There is no "proof' to be had for the nature or existence of 'God'. So demanding such proof is basically just a fools distraction.
Their "insistence" is irrelevant. Just as your insisting that there is nothing "in the box" is equally irrelevant. No one knows what's "in that box". It's not possible for we humans to determine. So the question that matters, is how does what we choose to assume is in the box effect the value of our lives. You claim it gives you "truth", but of course you can't know the truth. So all it gives you is the false pretense of truth ... the very same thing you seem to be so annoyed with in those who think they know God is "in the box". The difference is that at least their chosen 'illusion' serves them in some way more than just massaging their ego.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
I do not think that is correct. Mutations happen everywhere naturally.
However "Inbreeding results in homozygosity, which can increase the chances of offspring being affected by recessive traits. (Inbreeding - Wikipedia)"
Pharaohs are supposed to have suffered due to inbreeding.
firedragon
Veteran Member
Great.
What do you need with the word God in that? What does it add to debate any god's existence indeed, or to ascribe any qualities to the source of the universe. Is your imagination really serving you here? I find no value in metaphysical speculations.
So what you are doing is using the idea of a god because it makes you feel better. Fine. What you never seem to get is that that's a need YOU have and may not be universal. YOUR life is made better by a comforting fiction, and you seem to think that everybody is like that - that everybody should inject a little magic into their worldview to make it seem more interesting. You apparently can't conceive of others having spiritual intuitions about reality directly without god concepts.
So good for you that you've found a way to maintain that intuition with the addition of a pleasant fiction, but it's arrogant and naive of you to assume that all others have that same need, and that those who don't invoke gods ought to do so.
What you are missing is that many don't need a god and aren't benefitted by such a belief. How many times have I used the metaphor of eye glasses with you, always ignored. Although I would have loved to discuss with you why you didn't find the metaphor apt if you didn't, I don't need your reaction. I'll repeat it anyway.
You're like the man born with blurry vision who one day gets a pair of glasses and sees better. He's so excited he shouts about these wonderful things that have added so much to his life. He tells his friends to try them. A an with good vision discovers that glasses never improve his vision, and often degrade it. His zealous friend continues to implore him to just open his mind and enjoy the rich vistas glasses reveal, but the man reports that glasses never reveal anything to him and often degrade his vision. And then his friend says a prayer for him because he just can't find better vision with glasses, and laments the view his friend is limited to, never realizing that his vision unaided is better than the guy whose vision is improved with glasses. That's you telling other the joy of a god belief because of what it does for you, unable to conceive that they are past that. The mystery is the gift? One doesn't need the god glasses to have a spiritual understanding of nature and one's place in it.
You mentioned above that it is logical to invoke gods if it makes one feel better. Agreed. The belief isn't rational, but benefitting from it if possible is. What you keep missing is that if the belief doesn't provide any benefit, it is logical to discard it even in a world where so many people see that as a loss rather than a step forward in spiritual maturation, and continue to implore you to make the illogical choice of returning to a belief that adds nothing.
I have no reason to even think about the matter, whatever it is your imagination is referring to here with "God."
You may know that I'm a Grateful Dead fan, and one of their best loved numbers was a cover of a Cajun bayou song called AIKO (sometimes spelled IKO). The following is something I created about twenty years ago using phrases from the song. I think it embodies this attitude of the world being sacred without gods. It's a viewpoint that runs through the music, which is very human and spiritual without gods. Brokedown Palace ("In a bed, in a bed, by the waterside I will lay my head. Listen to the river sing sweet songs to rock my soul") and Black Muddy River ("When the moon splits the southwest horizon with the scream of an eagle on the fly, I will walk alone by the black muddy river and sing me a song of my own") are two examples. Here's AIKO. See if you can help me out by showing me where the addition of a deity to this adds anything:
This is a personal belief system called AIKO*, which is meant to represent the gratitude that (this) one feels to be included in existence. The creation, FEENO, is a stunning and awesome thing, remarkable not only for its beauty, complexity and potential for beneficence, but remarkable just that it can and does exist and is apparent to us.
That anything at all exists is itself the most fundamental and awe-inspiring mystery (AYE-NA-NAY), one which is a continual source of awe (FIYO), and for which we are deeply grateful (FEE-NA-NAY). That existence should be as rich and robust as we find it is infinitely more remarkable. That we were included in it as conscious beings to experience it even more so, and that that conscious experience includes a faint intuition of divinity that is accompanied by an experience of mystery, of awe and of graitude.
To experience FEENO is the greatest gift. My gratitude that all of this is so is called AIKO, and it is expressed as an affinity for the creation FEENO, and by implication, its source JOCKOMO, whether that be person-like, purposeless and accidental forces, or any other ontogenic entity or entities.
Nothing can be said or known about the creative source of FEENO, an entity termed JOCKOMO. All that can be ascertained about the reality of JOCKOMO is that which is faintly intuited by the mystery faculty called SPYBOY (the faculty of the brain that intuitively produces the experience of mystery or divinity to us), and whatever little bit that the reasoning faculty can add to that.
JOCKOMO may be existent, may have been formerly existent, or something else altogether. It may be substantial (material) or transcendent. It may be plural or singular, finite or immortal, conscious or insentient; we cannot know. Whatever the case, we love it and identify with it through its creation, FEENO by which we intuit JOCKOMO faintly and indirectly.
We do not know if JOCKOMO knows us or can know us. It is not necessary. We are astounded and grateful nevertheless. We are indebted to JOCKOMO for being included in the creation FEENO and being blessed with the faculty of conscious mind, including SPYBOY that generates our intuition of the mysterious and divine, called AYE-NAH-NAY. The awe we feel is called FIYO, and the gratitude that results naturally from these is FEE-NAH-NAY.
AIKO – a belief system
FEENO – the creation
JOCKOMO – the source of the creation FEENO
SPYBOY – the faculty that reveals the mystery and awesomeness of the creation FEENO
AYE-NA-NAY – the intuition of the mysterious and divine
FEE-NA-NAY – the gratitude experienced for being included in the creation
FIYO – the experience of awe
That anything at all exists is itself the most fundamental and awe-inspiring mystery (AYE-NA-NAY), one which is a continual source of awe (FIYO), and for which we are deeply grateful (FEE-NA-NAY). That existence should be as rich and robust as we find it is infinitely more remarkable. That we were included in it as conscious beings to experience it even more so, and that that conscious experience includes a faint intuition of divinity that is accompanied by an experience of mystery, of awe and of graitude.
To experience FEENO is the greatest gift. My gratitude that all of this is so is called AIKO, and it is expressed as an affinity for the creation FEENO, and by implication, its source JOCKOMO, whether that be person-like, purposeless and accidental forces, or any other ontogenic entity or entities.
Nothing can be said or known about the creative source of FEENO, an entity termed JOCKOMO. All that can be ascertained about the reality of JOCKOMO is that which is faintly intuited by the mystery faculty called SPYBOY (the faculty of the brain that intuitively produces the experience of mystery or divinity to us), and whatever little bit that the reasoning faculty can add to that.
JOCKOMO may be existent, may have been formerly existent, or something else altogether. It may be substantial (material) or transcendent. It may be plural or singular, finite or immortal, conscious or insentient; we cannot know. Whatever the case, we love it and identify with it through its creation, FEENO by which we intuit JOCKOMO faintly and indirectly.
We do not know if JOCKOMO knows us or can know us. It is not necessary. We are astounded and grateful nevertheless. We are indebted to JOCKOMO for being included in the creation FEENO and being blessed with the faculty of conscious mind, including SPYBOY that generates our intuition of the mysterious and divine, called AYE-NAH-NAY. The awe we feel is called FIYO, and the gratitude that results naturally from these is FEE-NAH-NAY.
AIKO – a belief system
FEENO – the creation
JOCKOMO – the source of the creation FEENO
SPYBOY – the faculty that reveals the mystery and awesomeness of the creation FEENO
AYE-NA-NAY – the intuition of the mysterious and divine
FEE-NA-NAY – the gratitude experienced for being included in the creation
FIYO – the experience of awe
PureX
Veteran Member
Once we understand that we cannot know the nature or existence of what we call "God", we are free to imagine and speculate about it without being dishonest, so long as we continue to acknowledge that this is what we are doing. That a "God of my understanding" is exactly that, and only that. And there are lots of ways we can use that kind of imagined 'higher power' to help is live better and more valued lives. The problems come when we want the rest of the world and it's people to behave as if the God of our understanding IS God. Because they will not willingly comply.
And what you never seem to get is that most theists are not trying to impose their idea of God on anyone. But you are so obsessed with those few that are, that you just cannot manage to acknowledge this. And most theists are not just making themselves "feel better" (as if that were a silly thing to do) but they are trying to actually BE better people. And many of them are succeeding. But of course you can't see any of that because all you ever look for are those theists that are trying to impose their religious ideas on others.
What is so sad and obnoxious about that statement is that you actually presume you know what is and isn't "fiction" regarding the nature and existence of "God". And of course you really have no idea at all. Nada. Zippo. And if you were to stop and think for a minute, you'd realize that you have no idea at all. But you don't stop and think. You're driven to fight the theists. And what a sad waste of time that is.
I make no such assumptions. But you can't see that because I'm a theist, and that means, in your mind, that I MUST be making those hated assumptions. Right?
Well, let's see, out the 7 BILLION humans on the planet well over 6 BILLION of them seem to think they do need a God-concept to help them live better lives. So I think it's you are aren't getting the full picture, here. And by the way, hardly any of those 6+ BILLION humans are trying to force you to believe anything.
Humans share their ideas and experiences with each other. Oh, the INHUMANITY!
Faith IS rational, because it works. And because there is no logical reason not to employ it. Blind denial is what's not rational.
I stated at the beginning of this post that belief is the problem. Not faith. Unfortunately, your intense bias against all think theistic blinds you to the difference.
False. It is reasonable to NOT assume religious claims as true or based on some information. No one knows what "God" is, and that is because there is no data, no facts, no observations about any gods. All we have is ancient lore, and we have no reason to assume these ancient stories are true in any way.
You are projecting here. All I am saying is that it is honest and true to acknowledge that a box is empty, and that those who claim there is something humans can't sense IS in the box can't substantiate their claim, or even their guess. What is biased about saying an empty box is indeed empty? That you want there to be something in the box has nothing to do with a bias on my part. You fail to argue your beliefs that something IS in the box, but humans can't sense it. Everything we observe is that you are imagining something in the empty box, and you don't like that.
False, we skeptics can easily see that what theists claim has no evidence available to ordinary sense and rational minds. What theists believe is best described as illusions. You claim no special powers, so you're left being judged as ordinary, flawed humans.
False, there are many self-evident truths that are factual, like the laws of physics. But you have a habit of trying to blur knowledge and your religious belief so you don't have to acknowledge your beliefs are not factual like knowledge is.
Many bad ideas have been shared through history that benefits a tribe at the cost of others. Slavery is an example. Religious beliefs have benefitted tribes of believers but also been the root of wars and conflict. Look at how evangelicals have worked to eliminate reproductive options for women in the USA, and that is surely a huge problem. So your vague and overly broad assertion here, that sharing ideas works well for us, certainly isn't true WHEN the ideas are ideological, including religion.
Really? You need an explanation how a human being looks into an empty box and can determine the box is empty? Is this a hard thing for you to do? Or are you being deliberately obtuse because this is my metaphor and you prefer your fuzzy and blurry approach to clarity?
I'm using the empty box as a metaphor as honest and unbiased and uninfluenced thinkers do not see evidence for any gods, and theists cannot provide any evidence for their gods that would compel a rational thinker that a god exists.
Demanding proof for any gods existing is less a foolish than believing a god exists despite the lack of evidence for a rational mind to conclude. As long as believers claim some sort of God exists rational minds will ask for evidence and a coherent argument.
Your posts here demonstrate that you disagree and believe belief in a god is very relevant.
The empty box that we all observe is similar to acknowledging there is no evidence for any gods in human lore. It is very relevant as your participation in these discussions reveal.
The box being empty is enough for observers to acknowledge it is empty. There is no cat, that's for sure.
How would they know? Then humans should not insist there is something in there. If you admit humans can't know a od exists then they shouldn't claim one does. They aren't sure, so why believe?
Sure, if we imagine the emptiness is valuable and spend a lot of time worshipping the empty space in the box, then we will value that emptiness and the box itself. At some point the box will be what is valued, because there is nothing else for there to worship and value.
I assert that we are capable of determining that a box is empty, and that it is empty is true, thus truth.
To imagine the box is full of something we can't detect is nonsense. If we cannot detect it, how can we assert there is anything as we imagine it?
This is theists. Theists belief in something they can't actually determine is real versus imagined. So you don't consider this a false pretense of truth?
PureX
Veteran Member
There is plenty of "data". Just no proof. And I would love to watch you explain the logic of presuming the negative in the face of no data. Because the only way that idea flies is if you can define the data that you should be getting if God/gods do exist. AND, how you would determine it's validity. And so far no one in history has been able to do that.
No, it isn't. It would be honest and true to state that we humans cannot see into this box, to determine if it's empty or not.
The fact that you can't and don't know that.
That's because I don't 'believe' that there is something in the box. I simply choose to hope that there is, and that I will gain a positive result when I act on that hope. I have no knowledge of or control over whatever's in that box. And I don't pretend to.
No, the data is anecdotal, so quite dubious and better explained as types of human social behavior. No evidence means no reason to believe. To point to people who believe without evidence as a data point is a type of circular fallacy.
You love your "proving a negative" scenarios. My point is clear, if you look in a box and it is empty there is no reason to believe there's something in it. When theists claim their gods exist but can't explain how rational minds can determine this, then the default is to not accept the claim. The default is: no belief.
More switching the burden of proof. Why should we assume gods exist as an a priori?
Theists are the one's claiming data, claiming gods, claiming experiences, and none of it can be shown to correlate to objective reality, only imagination. So pressuring me to make the theists's argument for them only shows how weak your approach is.
Atheists say: There's nothing here.
Theists claim: There is something here, but we cannot sense or determine it's real.
So the theist claiming something is there is not being truthful. If we cannot know, then we don't know.
There's more of your preference to blind yourself so you can draw a false conclusion. We atheists CAN see. We just don't have an ulterior motive to blind ourselves.
Hahaha, it's what I have been arguing. Maybe your blindness is a liability.
Why do you need hope? That's the question you should be asking. I don't see how you can feel any hope by being confused and misleading yourself. All that gives you is an excuse to believe. Some don't have to courage to not believe, but it does give a person the freedom to be courageous even when they doubt themselves.
I'll take that as an admission that you have no idea what the Harry Potter analogy is about either.
Really? You have been condescending from the start. You pity the skeptic. You depict him as empty because he doesn't have a god belief and doesn't. He's missing something, hence the response of the eyeglasses metaphor, which you still steadfastly refuse to address. All of that is you telling others to be more like you and to think like you whatever their situation.
As I said, there's no need for you to explain why you keep ignoring the metaphor and refusing to comment on why you think it isn't apt if that's what you sincerely believe. I think I know the answer, and would have liked you to confirm it with if correct or amend it if it isn't using words, but since you choose to have no input, my best guess is the default answer. You don't answer because you can't. Either you don't understand it, which ought to have evoked a comment to that effect unless you're embarrassed, or you can't think of a rebuttal and don't want to reveal that.
More of your condescension. Don't cry for me, Argentina.
And of course I can identify fictions about gods. Why can't you? Are you unaware of the limits of knowledge, and that the claims theists make about gods are things that they cannot know? Those are fictions, stories, verbal inventions like all beliefs about the metaphysical. Nobody knows anything that doesn't derive from experience, that doesn't impact upon the senses at some point.
And what fraction see better with glasses to live better lives?
Did you read what I wrote? "You mentioned above that it is logical to invoke gods if it makes one feel better. Agreed. The belief isn't rational, but benefitting from it if possible is." The belief is irrational if it isn't the product of reasoning pretty much by definition. Holding the irrational belief and believing by faith is rational if it comforts at no cost, but faith itself will never graduate above guessing. Faith offers the humanist nothing, just like glasses offer the person with 20-20 vision nothing, so holding such a belief doesn't "work" and would be as irrational as the belief itself.
By your reasoning, atheism is rational for those who don't need a god belief because the atheism works but not the god belief. And, it is preferable to live without one if possible, just as it's better to live without corrective lenses if you can't benefit from them. I can testify to that.