Heyo
Veteran Member
The abortion is still on the hands on the doctor and the woman. But everything that is caused by the delay (e.g. foetus being sentient) is on the hands of those who caused the delay.
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Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
It's not " my" actions, since I never got an abortion, or in any way caused one.
Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
That's like saying it's my fault a serial killer killed again because I tried to stop him.
Have you caused an abortion to be delayed, though? That's what we're talking about here.
(Though the answer might very well be "no" - you give off the vibe of someone who's big on hot air but not on action, IMO)
You're the one who's drawing a distinction between early-term and late-term abortions. If you delayed an abortion that should have happened early so that it happened late, then you're responsible for a late-term abortion.
Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
And this is why I think so called pro choicers are completely illogical.
Because they think if someone opposes something that person caused it to happen instead of the person who actually did it.
No one is forcing anyone to terminate their child.
Here is how responsibility works:
- you have a choice: do a thing or not do it.
- if you do the thing, one set of stuff happens.
- if you don't do the thing, some other set of stuff happens.
- the foreseeable difference between those two sets of things is what you're responsible for.
Heyo
Veteran Member
Let's say someone wants to build a nuclear power plant in your town and you don't like that. You park your car in the middle of the road so that the trucks can't get through. You cause a delay, the police tows your car and the building begins.
Then you get an invoice for the towing and the additional time the workers had to spend, waiting.
Are you going to pay up or are you suing because you just wanted to prevent a power plant being built?
Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
You just put the responsibility on the mother and the abortion provider.
Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
Nothing to do with the subject. Again no one is being forced to go to a clinic.
Responsibility isn't a zero-sum game.
So it's like I said: you don't like taking responsibility for your actions.
Heyo
Veteran Member
No-one is forced to build a power plant.
But if you know that they will go to the clinic, if you do something to delay them - e.g. harass patients going into their local clinic so they don't feel safe entering, or lobbying for a change in the law so it's shut down altogether so that they have to go out-of-state and get an abortion later than they wanted - YOU are the one choosing the late-term abortion.
It wasn't them; they chose an early-term abortion, but YOU took that option away from them. The late-term abortion is your responsibility.
Before now perhaps they didn't think they had to.
That doesn’t work. There was the reprehensible leaking of the draft decision weeks ago. Yet they still did nothing.
wellwisher
Well-Known Member
The Supreme Court sent abortion back to the states where each state can choose for itself. The Democrat run states can do what they want with abortion; though internal hook or crook. While the Republican run states can also do what they want. This seems to be a fair compromise. This is better than a one way street, where two sides cannot agree.
One problem that may appear is Democrat run states tend to be more mismanaged and over taxed. Many of these states screwed up badly, during the pandemic power fest. They tend to have much higher overhead and more long term obligations.
Now they will not be able to depend on Big Government to funnel extra tax revenue, from the better run Republican states; using the general federal tax fund to pay for abortion. This may cause problems in Democrat state, due to more under funded obligation, and the need for even more taxes.
For example, property taxes are more expensive in many Democrat run states like NY and CA. Until Trump, there was a tax deduction for property taxes; period. This looked fair, but it actually benefited all the over taxed Democrat run states. due to their much bigger deductions; higher taxes were rewarded with higher deductions. This ripped off the lower tax and efficient Republican states, who were forced to supplement the tax and spend states, via their federal taxes.
Abortion, in an over taxed Democrat states, may come down to even more states taxes and/or less services, to pay for the extras implied by abortion. The Fed will now be out of this, and can no longer steal from Joe to pay Sally. This new state math may will cause some Democrats to change parties or states, since not all Democrats live to have an abortion.
I also like the Supreme Court looking into the bureaucratic state. Congress has a Constitutional basis to make laws. This obligation is being side stepped, through bureaucratic agencies, where unelected people; career cronies, get to make law decisions. This is not in the Constitution.
Congress gets to be silent partner, without any need for a public hearing or political flack. There is a case between West Virginia; Coal and the EPA, where the EPA it being used to interfere in the free market. This is based on the Democrat mythology on how to fix climate change. It is one thing to see climate change, but it is another to fix it. The Democrats do not have a good track record of practical skills. The EPA may be reigned in, so Congress can do its job, and not try to run its shadow scams from the bleachers.
I think, the hysteria by the pro-abortion groups, is because that do not trust their own team to make this work at the state level, without the Federal power to rip off others to supplement their incompetence. The pro life states sees this with an enthusiasm; ding dong the witch is dead.
Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
I certainly do .. and my actions don't cause anyone to decide to terminate their offspring.
Wildswanderer
Veteran Member
They don't have to get one at all. What an absolutely absurd way of seeing cause and effect. It confirms what I have often thought about the liberal mind never taking personal responsibility.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Sometimes, in light of the premature decision, I really wonder if a person makes the decisions or an algorithm using statistical data that spit out an early decision?
Just a related side thought.