I guess my approach is different.

I've been wanting to say this for quite some time now. Today i decided i would finally share this with y'all.

Many of you in the Hindu forum might think of me as a Godless person since i don't worship any dieties.
Things like offering incense, flowers, sweets to idols is something that i don't like doing. Hindus believe that doing such things will cleanse one's heart of impurities and bring him/her closer to God but to me they are just rituals probably started by some ancient people who found comfort or a deeper connection with divinity by doing such repetitive actions on a daily basis.
But not me.

When i grew up among the hare krishna devotees, i did all those rituals as best i can, but i never felt drawn towards God at a deeper level. I was being instructed to chant 108 times daily but i thought it was too mechanical and found no divine pleasure in it. The devotees would sing and dance in big groups in the temples but i always avoided it since i'm terrified of crowds.

Later in my mid twenties when i was going through anxiety issues, i used to isolate myself away from crowds and instead of puja or chanting, i would communicate with God in the privacy of my room. No puja, flowers or rituals. Just man to man conversation. I would look up at the sky and talk to him, imagining him sitting up there up above the clouds with a big white beard or sometimes a blue guy holding a flute.

Before this i prayed in public temples and my prayers were never perfect since i was easily distracted by people around me. But in the privacy of my room that wasn't the case and i felt a deeper connection for the first time.

It has been like that from then onwards.
I guess i'm just a devotee cloaked in the garb of an Advaitin. lol

If you've any questions feel free to ask.

The Crimson Universe said:

Many of you in the Hindu forum might think of me as a Godless person since i don't worship any dieties

Click to expand...

Some might
I don't

The Crimson Universe said:

Things like offering incense, flowers, sweets to idols is something that i don't like doing

Click to expand...

Even as a Child I told my mother "I rather leave the flower outside and alive, why kill it, and put it inside the house"

Circa 10 years later, when I was listening to a discourse my Guru was giving He said "People offer flowers to me, I rather have you not kill them, and leave them outside, and instead offer your wicked deeds to me"

The Crimson Universe said:

Things like offering incense, flowers, sweets to idols is something that i don't like doing. Hindus believe that doing such things will cleanse one's heart of impurities and bring him/her closer to God but to me they are just rituals probably started by some ancient people who found comfort or a deeper connection with divinity by doing such repetitive actions on a daily basis.
But not me

Click to expand...

My Master created the opportunity for me to do puja for maybe a year or so. Not my plan, but when flying to India to participate in a huge paduka puja, I said mentally:

"You know that puja really is not my thing, and then those padhukas, gold and silver, costing a few hundred euros, is really over the top, BUT if it's your Will that I, for whatever reason, participate with this Puja then you give me the money".

My flight got delayed, and I got so much money from this company for the delay, that it was plenty to buy these padukas.

Oh my God, I thought, I got myself in trouble, well let's see. So, I participated, and it was nice, esp. with my Guru being around guiding us. Glad He gave me the padukas, more fun this 10 day festival while fully participating than watching it from the outside

Afterwards I was supposed to continue the puja myself. Oh boy, really not my thing. But I tried. Using milk, honey etc. to pour over them. Luckily I heard a discourse in which my Master said "doing the Puja mentally is 10 times more effective than doing it with literal milk, honey etc". Boy, was I happy. That way it became more fun. Even small miracles happened, but still not my thing.

Then after a few years my Master came into my dream and He touched my feet, I said "why you do this?". Exactly He said, why you do it? I don't want you to touch my feet.

That was a great dream, and the end of my mental Puja too. Same day my Master gave a discourse in which He told the maybe 50.000 gathered "I don't want you to do Paduka Puja anymore".
Wonderful confirmation my dream was True. From that day no more Puja for me

BUT,

because of all these experiences I lost my prejudice. Now, If I am with people who enjoy doing puja, I don't argue about whether it's useful or not, I even participate in it, but I do it in Silence. Now I know, that for some this is the way to go, and for others it's not. It's not about what is best, both are fine from my POV.

Still I repeat God's Name anyway, because I Love God, and I need God

The Crimson Universe said:

When i grew up among the hare krishna devotees, i did all those rituals as best i can,

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I went to quite a few Hare Krishna meetings. Not so far from me, there is Radhadesh, a wonderful castle in the woods, where some Hare Krishnas live.

I was always a bit ambivalent about it. Not myself used to the offering stuff, but still liking the atmosphere of chanting and focus on God.

Also not helpful was that they disrespected my Guru 30 years ago. I went back once, a few years ago, and discovered that they were not judgmental like 30 years ago, I liked it even more now

The Crimson Universe said:

The devotees would sing and dance in big groups in the temples but i always avoided it since i'm terrified of crowds

Click to expand...

I love big crowds now, with my Master I got used to huge crowds, having been there for ca. 11 years, with crowds of even sometimes up to ½ a million (His birthdays celebrations only). Usual there were like 25.000

Before I avoided big crowds, but I love my Master, and that helped me to overcome my feeling of not being comfortable wirh big crowds.

I am very good in going inside, and with big crowds it's now easy for me to keep my focus inside. When being with 1 or a few people, that's more difficult.

Trailblazer said:

Thanks for sharing. I like your approach. I am not much for rituals and religious practices. I am uncomfortable in crowds and praying and reading scriptures in groups so I do not participate with others of my religion that way. If I have something to say to God I say it privately. Unfortunately, I rarely feel a deep connection with God but that is because I have personal issues with God and His system. I do feel God's presence though, and I know God is near and there for me when needed.

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It seems like we both have a lot of things in common. I often get angry at God when i see suffering around me and would often blame him for what's happening in our world. But i don't keep a grudge against him for too long. :=)

The Crimson Universe said:

I've been wanting to say this for quite some time now. Today i decided i would finally share this with y'all.

Many of you in the Hindu forum might think of me as a Godless person since i don't worship any dieties.
Things like offering incense, flowers, sweets to idols is something that i don't like doing. Hindus believe that doing such things will cleanse one's heart of impurities and bring him/her closer to God but to me they are just rituals probably started by some ancient people who found comfort or a deeper connection with divinity by doing such repetitive actions on a daily basis.
But not me.

When i grew up among the hare krishna devotees, i did all those rituals as best i can, but i never felt drawn towards God at a deeper level. I was being instructed to chant 108 times daily but i thought it was too mechanical and found no divine pleasure in it. The devotees would sing and dance in big groups in the temples but i always avoided it since i'm terrified of crowds.

Later in my mid twenties when i was going through anxiety issues, i used to isolate myself away from crowds and instead of puja or chanting, i would communicate with God in the privacy of my room. No puja, flowers or rituals. Just man to man conversation. I would look up at the sky and talk to him, imagining him sitting up there up above the clouds with a big white beard or sometimes a blue guy holding a flute.

Before this i prayed in public temples and my prayers were never perfect since i was easily distracted by people around me. But in the privacy of my room that wasn't the case and i felt a deeper connection for the first time.

It has been like that from then onwards.
I guess i'm just a devotee cloaked in the garb of an Advaitin. lol

If you've any questions feel free to ask.

Click to expand...

I always got the impression that the rituals were just an exercise. Like yeah one will do them to be obedient to what one perceives as the “correct way to worship” (for lack of a better phrase.) But ultimately they’re not compulsory.
Well unless you’re literally in the temple I guess lol.
My mother taught me the rituals. But it was framed more like, “we do this in order to be polite.” Not in a “god will smite you if you don’t” kind of way. If that makes sense?

Meditation and nurturing one’s connection with divinity are also important. There isn’t really that much of a need for rituals. Unless that’s what makes one happy in their devotion.

So you do you.
I’m not exactly orthodox myself, to be honest

When true wisdom dawns, it gives rise to a celebration. Often in celebrations, you tend to lose focus or awareness. To maintain awareness in the midst of celebrations, the ancient rishis brought rituals to every celebration; puja being one of these rituals, brings sacredness to life. ~ Sri Sri Ravi Shankar

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A sense of sacredness helps to bring about awareness, and this is why rituals are performed in recognition of the sacredness of the event.

Otherwise one would be under the influence of inertia and carelesness.So rituals and arrangements were devised to create a sense of sacredness.

However, after a certain span of time, even rituals can be done mechanically and habitually.

So the best antidote is to perform everything with awareness or mindfulness. This transforms everything into a sacred ritual.

Even breathing done with awareness is said to transform the whole process.


“When you breathe without awareness, it is air. If you breathe with awareness, it is prana.” ~ Avdhoot Shivanand

stvdv said:

I went to quite a few Hare Krishna meetings. Not so far from me, there is Radhadesh, a wonderful castle in the woods, where some Hare Krishnas live.

I was always a bit ambivalent about it. Not myself used to the offering stuff, but still liking the atmosphere of chanting and focus on God.

Also not helpful was that they disrespected my Guru 30 years ago. I went back once, a few years ago, and discovered that they were not judgmental like 30 years ago, I liked it even more now

Click to expand...

Thanks for sharing with us your story. Yeah, like you said, the Hare Krishnas often belittle other hindu sects and swamis. Its the only thing that i don't like about them. Other than that there's nothing wrong with them. They have some of the beautiful temples, especially the one that is under construction in Mayapur, Bengal. :=)

The Crimson Universe said:

Thanks for sharing with us your story. Yeah, like you said, the Hare Krishnas often belittle other hindu sects and swamis. Its the only thing that i don't like about them. Other than that there's nothing wrong with them. They have some of the beautiful temples, especially the one that is under construction in Mayapur, Bengal. :=)

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The belittling of other people their (non) religion is also my major dislike with people

I am from Holland, and I did see lots of improvement in Hare Krishna here. 30 years ago they were very judgmental (maybe they were ex Christians, and dropped Christianity but not judgmental behavior)

In India I got the feeling the Hare Krishnas are much less judgmental than in Holland. I visited Bangalore temple of HK, and Bombay, and maybe 2 more. You say they are still judgmental...is that your experience from India HK, or other countries?

The Bengal temple I never saw

And indeed their temples are beautiful, as is their dedication. Very good inspiration for me, as to chant God's Name, as the panacea for this century

Did you visit the Bengal Temple?

stvdv said:

The Bengal temple I never saw

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Here's a CGI picture of it.

Its not ready yet. Construction work is going on for the past 10 years or so.

stvdv said:

Did you visit the Bengal Temple?

Click to expand...

I'm originally from Kyiv.
My parents moved to Mayapur, Bengal in the early 90s when i was a baby. Since then this has been my home. Back then the temple in the picture didn't exist. Only a small temple was there which we often visited.

SomeRandom said:

I always got the impression that the rituals were just an exercise. Like yeah one will do them to be obedient to what one perceives as the “correct way to worship” (for lack of a better phrase.) But ultimately they’re not compulsory.
Well unless you’re literally in the temple I guess lol.
My mother taught me the rituals. But it was framed more like, “we do this in order to be polite.” Not in a “god will smite you if you don’t” kind of way. If that makes sense?

Meditation and nurturing one’s connection with divinity are also important. There isn’t really that much of a need for rituals. Unless that’s what makes one happy in their devotion.

So you do you.
I’m not exactly orthodox myself, to be honest

Click to expand...

I see you have the image of Kali in your avatar.

Are you a devotee of the Goddess?

The Crimson Universe said:

I see you have the image of Kali in your avatar.

Are you a devotee of the Goddess?

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I am indeed.
Ma Kali always spoke to me. Even as a child.
My mother was a little apprehensive when I told her, though never discouraged me from exploring the Shakta paths
(Likely fearing retribution lol)
I am a Kali devotee

The Crimson Universe said:

Here's a CGI picture of it.

Its not ready yet. Construction work is going on for the past 10 years or so.



I'm originally from Kyiv.
My parents moved to Mayapur, Bengal in the early 90s when i was a baby. Since then this has been my home. Back then the temple in the picture didn't exist. Only a small temple was there which we often visited.

Click to expand...

Thank you,

Wow, the temple looks indeed beautiful.

Nice to live nearby such a place. For me the closest nice temple place is ca. 400 km away.

India is a great country with all the Temples and all the Spirituality everywhere. Huge difference from Holland. I miss that part of life here in Holland. Luckily I have spend ca. 11 years there, so I got my fair share

As you live in India, then your experience about Indian HK is more accurate than mine, that they still need to work about respect towards other religions (I think this is a human thing though, Christians and Muslims have it too...Hindus seem to have it less. The more fanatic people believe, the more they have this)

SomeRandom said:

I am indeed.
Ma Kali always spoke to me. Even as a child.
My mother was a little apprehensive when I told her, though never discouraged me from exploring the Shakta paths
(Likely fearing retribution lol)
I am a Kali devotee

Click to expand...

Lately while browsing thru some introductory articles on hindu tantra i found out it has many schools / denominations.
The ones that peaked my interest are the Shakta tantra schools like Kularnava, Sri vidya and there were two more. I forgot their names. Its the dark stuff associated with these schools that interests me, like Aghoris eating flesh of corpses, necrophilia etc.

I just like to read about them. Its like reading horror novels. lol

stvdv said:

Thank you,

Wow, the temple looks indeed beautiful.

Nice to live nearby such a place. For me the closest nice temple place is ca. 400 km away.

India is a great country with all the Temples and all the Spirituality everywhere. Huge difference from Holland. I miss that part of life here in Holland. Luckily I have spend ca. 11 years there, so I got my fair share

As you live in India, then your experience about Indian HK is more accurate than mine, that they still need to work about respect towards other religions (I think this is a human thing though, Christians and Muslims have it too...Hindus seem to have it less. The more fanatic people believe, the more they have this)

Click to expand...

Yeah, the HKs need to work on that.
The Shiva devotees and even Advaitins or the Smartas are very respectable towards other schools though.
They would hardly discriminate.

From what i've read in school is that the brahmins (the preistly hindu class) took excessive pride in themselves few centuries ago. They claimed that only they had the right to enter temples and perform holy rituals and so looked down on the working/labour class who were inferior to them. I think it all started from there and found its way to the vaishnava/HK schools.

I was reading a book a few months ago. "Jesus lived in India by Holger Kersten". There the author mentioned that the Buddhists of Nepal and Tibet have written records of Jesus visiting india in his 13th or 14th year with the company of merchants.
He lived among the Brahmins of eastern India (Puri, Orissa), and studied the vedas but when he started preaching the content of the vedas to the lower working classes of india, it angered the brahmins and they drove him away from their city. Later Jesus spent 6 years in Tibet and after that he was welcomed by the Shiva worshippers of India with open arms. These Shiva worshippers allowed all hindu classes, even the lower working class into their school.

They have a written record of Jesus's stay in India as well. They probably called Jesus by the name Isa or Ishanath. I'm forgetting the correct term. Jesus in his 29th year or so, returned back to his homeland.

The Crimson Universe said:

Lately while browsing thru some introductory articles on hindu tantra i found out it has many schools / denominations.
The ones that peaked my interest are the Shakta tantra schools like Kularnava, Sri vidya and there were two more. I forgot their names. Its the dark stuff associated with these schools that interests me, like Aghoris eating flesh of corpses, necrophilia etc.

I just like to read about them. Its like reading horror novels. lol

Click to expand...

Lol I can relate to that.
I’m personally not that “extreme,” as it were. But I have read about them. The idea is to break past all barriers and achieve true inner peace. Even if you have to break social taboo. Nothing is to go to waste, including the dead. Basically anyway

The Crimson Universe said:

Many of you in the Hindu forum might think of me as a Godless person since i don't worship any dieties.

Click to expand...

Godless people such as you are the reason that I have to lock my door at night.

The Crimson Universe said:

Things like offering incense, flowers, sweets to idols is something that i don't like doing.

Click to expand...

I presume you have no motivation to do any of that. In my case, I never do those things because I just don’t care to. The only things I offer are food and drink before personal consumption, and even then, it’s not each and every time.

The Crimson Universe said:

doing such repetitive actions on a daily basis.

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One soon or later dreads having to do some daily, repetitive action even if it’s a beautiful one. That’s why I don’t do pūjā daily. (Hmm. Do I do pūjā at all? No.)

The Crimson Universe said:

i used to isolate myself away from crowds and instead of puja or chanting, i would communicate with God in the privacy of my room. No puja, flowers or rituals. Just man to man conversation.

Click to expand...

Like you, I prefer doing spirituality alone and without the typical formalities. Chanting though is something I enjoy doing.

The Crimson Universe said:

If you've any questions feel free to ask.

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Do you have any connection to specific names and forms such as Śiva, Devī, or Hari?

mangalavara said:

Do you have any connection to specific names and forms such as Śiva, Devī, or Hari?

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I don't know. I just like the calm meditative form of Shiva and Krishna as well. :=)

@stvdv hello! I am living in Germany and used to visit iskcon and can also relate to them being judgemental. Very much so. As well as belittleling other sampradayas or seeing other religions as beneath them. Not everyone does this, but I mean they openly preach how a person gets to the "final" stage of birth & death when they become Krishna conscious and accoding to them, Krishna devotees possess the "most sacred" knowledge of all. Which is essentially why they preach so much.. to "enlighten" others. *eye roll*

@The Crimson Universe hello! I saw your comment that you are from Kyiv. I am from Russia but living in Germany for many years. Iskcon was also my life for many years, but now I don't go there anymore. I also like Shiva and Krishna, as well as other hindu gods (or greek, pagan gods etc).

Rituals are not for everyone; rituals are very important for some. I like to know why I am doing something, so I look into what a ritual is, what it means and why I should do it. I'm autistic, so there's the why for me. I'd been very confused about how to do puja, doing it just right, etc. (damn autism feature ). But when I learned about pancha upachara puja and the symbolism of it ... booyah! that's my daily puja. This is the beauty of Hinduism: there is no one way, and I don't think anyone should be judged, "corrected", chided, or what-have-you for their beliefs and methods.