Brian2
Veteran Member
I can see what you are saying that I did but you have picked up the tricks of your teachers when you only quote part of what I said and so misrepresent what I said.
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Daniel 12:2
- Thread starter Frank Goad
- Start date
I can see what you are saying that I did but you have picked up the tricks of your teachers when you only quote part of what I said and so misrepresent what I said.
Triumph
FREEDOM OF SPEECH
Thomas did not call Jesus his God. Thomas was praising his God for resurrecting His son Jesus. Jesus accepted the word Lord only as a teacher. Lord is a expression of respect ( similar to the word Mister) for a man such as a king, prince, military commander, landowner, slave owner and husband. Jesus is none of those but the word "Lord" is also used for a respected teacher and Jesus did accept being called Lord in that context as he faithfully taught the words of God, his Father.
ALL Lords are beneath God because they are all men and God is not a man. Some kings did claim to be the Lord thy God, demanding the right to kill anyone they pleased as if they were a God. What those kings, sons of Abraham, desired to happen they claimed Lord God desired it. Those men wanted the same power over people that the pharaohs of Egypt had that claimed to BE Gods passing the title "God" to their bloodline sons that also claimed to be Gods. Jesus taught no man is a God.
Jesus said no man has seen the face of God and people looked at the face of Jesus often, so Jesus never taught he is God. Jesus did say Angels of children see God's face. God wants people to love and protect all children.
Matthew 18:10
Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven.
1 John 4:12
No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us." Jesus is one with the words he hears from God and taught them correctly and faithfully.
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Brian2
Veteran Member
I have heard a number of explanations for what Thomas said to try to make it look as if Thomas was not saying to Jesus "My Lord and my God" and meaning it just as it sounds. So really I don't have to say anything about your explanation.
The disciples only started calling Jesus "Lord" after His resurrection. That is the context.
It is amazing that you think that when Thomas said "My Lord and my God" the term "my Lord" applies to Jesus but the term "My God" does not apply to Jesus.
Not all Lords were men in those days. I'm sure there were many Lord gods in other religions.
When did Jesus teach that no man is a God? Jesus did teach that the Jewish judges had been called gods (Ps 82, John 10:35)
The Old Testament does say that people saw God. How do you explain that seeming contradiction?
Triumph
FREEDOM OF SPEECH
Correct that Jesus is the Son of the Father, a unique creation unlike any other man on Earth.
Jesus is not "equal in nature" to God because only God is good. Jesus had the sin of wrath, anger when he caused physical harm to men in the temple when Jesus knew God commanded him to love even his enemies as beloved family. Jesus wanted to save their lives and had no intention of killing them but did not teach in the manner of mercy and kindness that God told Jesus to teach. That is a reason Jesus was required by God to show submission and repentance by being water baptized to make himself whole to enable God to forgive him for his unkind acts. What Jesus did is not a deadly sin but it was an offense to God, an act of disobedience.
Triumph
FREEDOM OF SPEECH
Brian2
Veteran Member
You do not know that Jesus harmed anybody when He drove the sellers and money changers out of the Temple.
You do not know that He was angry when He did that.
If He was angry you seem to think that anger by itself is wrong.
You seem to think that Jesus was not good, that He was a sinner and so was not the sacrifice free from sin, the lamb without blemish, that could die for the sins of everyone instead of just dying for His own sins.
You seem to think that Jesus was a creation when the Bible teaches that Jesus was not brought into existence. (see John 1:2,3)
Triumph
FREEDOM OF SPEECH
The contradiction that most people are blind to see is that the Jews worshipped a made by Abraham Lord God that Abraham invented out of his imagination to exalt himself to a throne by telling people they are God's people if they will accept Abraham has a covenant with Lord God so Abraham and his sons could rule as Lord God.
The true creator and Living God, Father of Jesus is not the Lord God the followers of Abraham worship. Those are 2 different Gods and only one is real. God is not Lord God.
Chapter 1 in the Bible presents the Living God, Father of Jesus, and God's outline of creation is finished with people alive for generations before the fake Lord God the Jews worship is presented in Genesis 2:4. Abraham invented his own God just like a Greek man invented Zeus to be his God. There is only one true God but most people do not worship Him even though they do believe they worship God. God is the God that created the humans named Abraham, Issaac and Jacob but Jacobs well has no eternal life in it because those men never worshiped the true God but did worship the fictional God Abraham had his scribes write is Lord God.
True religion did not come with Abraham and Moses because God is not a God of wrath and destruction. Men bring wrath and destruction as they serve fake wrathful Gods that only exist in their imaginations supported by traditions of wrathful, deceitful men. Those men died in their sins and are Dead. God is not a God of the dead but of the living that learn God is love and God is a Father that wants his children to not kill each other. God desires people to love one another with kindness and mercy working differences out by discussion with equality not on a battlefield. Righteousness is not determined by what ruler has the strongest killers.
True religion began on Earth with John the Baptist offering merciful sin removal that removes belief in animal and human sacrifice and Jesus Christ of Nazareth, Son of the Living God teaching the true words of God that offers eternal life.
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Brian2
Veteran Member
You seem to be saying things that the Bible does not teach, things that you have made up or that your teachers have made up about the Bible and Abraham and which parts of the Bible are acceptable.
Do you teach the Gospel of the Kingdom and that repentance and the ritual of baptism, without Jesus sacrifice, is enough for the forgiveness of our sins,,,,,,,,,,,,,,or one of those? Which parts of the Bible do you accept and/or reject?
Triumph
FREEDOM OF SPEECH
Are the words of Jesus enough? Jesus said if you want to KILL HIM then you do not love God or Jesus. In John 8:37 Jesus said the people that DO NOT have the WORD OF GOD in them seek to kill Jesus. That means God is not accepting anyone that kills His beloved son or agrees with his murder for sins he did not commit. If people have Holy Spirit they do not agree with the death of Jesus because it is unmerciful and without love of Jesus or love of the Words of God that Jesus taught.
Want Jesus to die on a cross for sins he did not commit? Why do you not not believe Jesus?
John 8: 47He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
Jesus never said I am going to die to remove sin because his death had nothing to do with sin removal at all. Jesus was forced to make the decision to die to keep the Jews from continuing to kill his disciples and friends thus stop a local war over religion.
Only the liar Pharisee Paul claimed blood sacrifice removes sin even though Jesus taught against blood sacrifice for sin removal even whipping temple priests for doing it. It is highly probable that Pharisee Paul that calls himself the "Hebrew of Hebrews" and a "son of Abraham", was among the Pharisees that Jesus whipped and argued with in the temple.
The Lord God Paul worships is not the God that Jesus worships. God is true Justice and that is the guilty are punished for their actions and the innocent are set free.
Water Baptism is acceptable by God for forgiveness/repentance of sins and not the death of an innocent life. Blood sacrifices are inequity. God sent John the Baptist to stop people from believing in animal and human sacrifice because the true Living God never accepted any of them. Heathens/Pagans sacrifice humans to their Gods and it is a cruel, demonic ritual. Jesus was sent to the Hebrew/ Jews because they were LOST human sacrificers that were so cruel they dashed infants against rocks and burned innocent children alive and owned human slaves. Jews/Hebrews were allowed by their man made religious laws to beat their slaves to death, male or female. Hebrews claimed to be the people of God but were not as they served hundreds of man made religious laws said to be from God but were not. Jesus taught against slavery and against killing children ( thou shall not kill the innocent! ) and against blood sacrifices because none of those acts were ever acceptable to God. Seek Holy Spirit, the Words of God taught by Jesus, and see this is truth.
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Gezellig
Member
Let's assume this is so. Then what about Ecclesiastes 9:5, 6?
"The living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing...
their love, their hatred and passions have passed... ."
Then you can see verse 10.
Another similar verse in the 10th chapter is the second part of the 14th verse.
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