Nonsense Scriptures?

Seeker of White Light said:

Who created humans?
Who put down the guidelines we humans should follow?
Who get us up when we are down?

God does.

Suffering is a part of human life, we are not here to live a perfect carefree life with no struggle.
Life is a school

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Fine!

I'm asking God to stop murdering and torturing and cursing people for minor offenses and disobedience, instruct the confused, feed the starving, strengthen people so they can make a difference.

I'm not asking him to remove suffering and death.

Torturing humanity with what he does and fails to do, bothers me. Hatred, bigotry, slavery, genocide, famines, and dreadful curses he carries out in Scripture, I'm begging him to stop doing.

My conscience tells me it is bad, wrong, sick, far more cruel than anything i would do on my worst days, if I were powerful!

If I were all-powerful, I would try to end confusion, make dreams come true, bring tears of joy, laughter to all, help people before they commit suicide, make paralyzed people walk, cure cancer etc.

Scripture says God is a jealous wrathful God. Wrath and jealousy are two of the seven deadly sins.

Spiderman said:

Fine!

I'm asking God to stop murdering and torturing and cursing people for minor offenses and disobedience, instruct the confused, feed the starving, strengthen people so they can make a difference.

I'm not asking him to remove suffering and death.

Torturing humanity with what he does and fails to do, bothers me. Hatred, bigotry, slavery, genocide, famines, and dreadful curses he carries out in Scripture, I'm begging him to stop doing.

My conscience tells me it is bad, wrong, sick, far more cruel than anything i would do on my worst days, if I were powerful!

If I were all-powerful, I would try to end confusion, make dreams come true, bring tears of joy, laughter to all, help people before they commit suicide, make paralyzed people walk, cure cancer etc.

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You speak about pardise, that comes after all the suffering on earth if we are granted a place in pardise.

I praise and thank you Lord for your many blessings. I jumped off a three story building and broke many bones. Thank you Lord I can walk and not in a wheelchair for life.

I just think the Bible can be dangerous to use as an ultimate authority, so I get zealous in pointing out why. Please help me to do it the right way. Amen!

Seeker of White Light said:

You speak about pardise, that comes after all the suffering on earth if we are granted a place in pardise.

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If God wants us to suffer, fine!

But he doesn't have to curse children for the sins of their parents, or leave people feeling confused, abandoned by God, like God isn't even there, and live lives in constant fear, darkness, disorder, infirmity, injustice, bullying , abuse, and agony.

If I must suffer a life of torture and emptiness with so many others, I accept, but the least God can do is grant understanding, and let us discern what his instructions are.

I'm not asking much from him.

I'm not asking luxury, women, pleasure, or fun, or fame!

Spiderman said:

If God wants us to suffer, fine!

But he doesn't have to curse children for the sins of their parents, or leave people feeling confused, abandoned by God, like God isn't even there, and live lives in constant fear, darkness, disorder, infirmity, injustice, bullying , abuse, and agony.

If I must suffer a life of torture and emptiness with so many others, I accept, but the least God can do is grant understanding, and let us discern what his instructions are.

I'm not asking much from him.

I'm not asking luxury, women, pleasure, or fun, or fame!

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Maybe karma actually is correct....that we suffer for time after doing something wrong, I believe as an example my family had a lot to pay in suffering.
On my father side of family it was 4 generations who got prostat cancer, all of them died before turning 68 years old.

I dont blame God for it.

Seeker of White Light said:

Maybe karma actually is correct....that we suffer for time after doing something wrong, I believe as an example my family had a lot to pay in suffering.
On my father side of family it was 4 generations who got prostat cancer, all of them died before turning 68 years old.

I dont blame God for it.

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That could be correct....

JustGeorge said:

Its possible.

Still, gotta childproof.

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No possibility to eat the fruit? Hmmm
At least the tree of life was made childproof.
An interesting part about that is that Jesus said you have to become like a little child to get to that fruit.
Ask and you shall receive. You have to ask for it and accept it like a child and not think you can work hard enough and earn it.

Spiderman said:

I am baptized! I said sorry I keep dissing God. The cruelty in the Bible just makes me very angry!

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The cruelty in the world is harsher, surely? But is it not better look for the beauty there, for “Beauty is truth, truth beauty - that is all ye know on earth, and all ye need to know.”


Ode on a Grecian Urn by John Keats | Poetry Foundation

Spiderman said:

I didn't quote any verses word for word, but would you agree the descendants of ham were cursed , and all of us were cursed because of Adam and Eve's disobedience?

That strikes me as nonsense to punish children for what their parents did, is what I'm saying .

Do you have any verses you find nonsensical?

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It's naturally a curse, because whoever break God's Law will have to be driven out of His Kingdom. That's the big picture. While wherever outside of God's dwelling realm is literally a cursed place.

Spiderman said:

Napoleon could have been the emperor of the entire Earth, if everybody would just turn the other cheek , and love him, like Jesus commanded.

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You missed the whole point of what the Bible says. Nations on earth are basically beasts fighting each other. This is a wilderness to God's sheep. So it doesn't matter which beast will be ruling the world. Christians' nation is the Kingdom of God which is intangibly formed by Christians on earth.

Spiderman said:

Scripture does have some very wise Noble things like: "turn the other cheek and love your enemies", just what an evil bloodthirsty regime would need to conquer the world.

Napoleon could have been the emperor of the entire Earth, if everybody would just turn the other cheek , and love him, like Jesus commanded.

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Actually, if everyone followed that proscription, there would be no Napoleon's. And there would be no armies for him to command.

Spiderman said:

Is there any scripture verses that you think are nonsense? It has to be in the new testament, the old testament, or the deuterocanonicals.

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The interesting thing about "nonsense" is that it doesn't necessarily imply a lack of value or reason or truthfulness. Only a lack of understanding.

But who's? The writer or the reader?

Spiderman said:

If you don't think any of the scripture is nonsense, is there anything in there you disagree with, or that you find is closer to being nonsense than the rest, anything that stands out?

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As a Catholic I was not raised to presume the stories were historical fact. I was taught to read them as stories, written to convey some religious ideal or other. So I was trained to "make sense" of them by asking myself what ideal the author is trying to convey to me? And if I could not determine this, I didn't just assume the story was "nonsense". I just assumed that whatever ideal the story is trying to share, I'm just not getting it. That it got "lost in translation" between different cultures, centuries, and languages.

Also, I never assumed that it was all written 'for me', anyway. It was written for people that lived long ago and far away and that were very different from me. So I never expected it to be particularly apropos. Nevertheless, I did find some ideas in it that I considered to be very wise, and appropriate to my own life at the time I read them. (I assume these things probably change over time.)

One was the quote "... for a man is punished through that with which he sins". I still see this as a profound truth.

Another was "... for we (mankind) have been wonderfully and frightfully made". Wonderful and frightful ... ain't that the truth!

Also, "... as you forgive others, so, then, shall you be forgiven". So spread it around!

And this last one I can't recall the quote, but my friend Mike used to paraphrase it as; "Any man can be a hero in the face of great adversity, when all he'd lose is his life. If you really want to find out what a man is made of, give him massive success". This one is the truest of all.

PureX said:

Actually, if everyone followed that proscription, there would be no Napoleon's. And there would be no armies for him to command.
The interesting thing about "nonsense" is that it doesn't necessarily imply a lack of value or reason or truthfulness. Only a lack of understanding.

But who's? The writer or the reader?
As a Catholic I was not raised to presume the stories were historical fact. I was taught to read them as stories, written to convey some religious ideal or other. So I was trained to "make sense" of them by asking myself what ideal the author is trying to convey to me? And if I could not determine this, I didn't just assume the story was "nonsense". I just assumed that whatever ideal the story is trying to share, I'm just not getting it. That it got "lost in translation" between different cultures, centuries, and languages.

Also, I never assumed that it was all written 'for me', anyway. It was written for people that lived long ago and far away and that were very different from me. So I never expected it to be particularly apropos. Nevertheless, I did find some ideas in it that I considered to be very wise, and appropriate to my own life at the time I read them. (I assume these things probably change over time.)

One was the quote "... for a man is punished through that with which he sins". I still see this as a profound truth.

Another was "... for we (mankind) have been wonderfully and frightfully made". Wonderful and frightful ... ain't that the truth!

Also, "... as you forgive others, so, then, shall you be forgiven".

And this last one I can't recall the quote, but my friend Mike used to paraphrase it as; "Any man can be a hero in the face of great adversity, when all he'd lose is his life. If you really want to find out what a man is made of, give him massive success". This one is the truest of all.

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Beautiful post. I love the last verse. I knew I made this thread for a reason.

Spiderman said:

Scripture does have some very wise Noble things like: "turn the other cheek and love your enemies", just what an evil bloodthirsty regime would need to conquer the world.
Napoleon could have been the emperor of the entire Earth, if everybody would just turn the other cheek , and love him, like Jesus commanded. .........................

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Taken out of context as the ^ above^ does shows that a person is Not interested in what the Bible has to teach but more interested in a teaching outside of Scripture but teaching it as being Scripture.

At Matthew 5:39-40 is in connection to being insulted - 1 Peter 3:9; Romans 12:17 - How to avoid a personal quarrel.
This is Not speaking about a violent attack.
Don't pay back 'insult for insult'. Jesus was Not speaking about a Napoleon person but when someone insults you personally.
In other words, don't say I will do to him just as he has done to me. - Proverbs 24:29
The King James ' smite' thee is a ' slap '. A slap is meant to provoke like when in dueling days when a 'slap with a glove' was an insult meant to provoke.
Thus, in response a person should Not strike offensively showing the other person that you are in a provoked state.
Rather, if possible seek to make peace with the insulting person.

Seeker of White Light said:

You speak about paradise, that comes after all the suffering on earth .....if..... we are granted a place in paradise.

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In the ^above^ I took the liberty and stressed the word " if " because we are granted a place in that coming paradisical Earth " if " we go on walking as a Christian should - 1 John 1:7 (if......)

Hawkins said:

You missed the whole point of what the Bible says. Nations on earth are basically beasts fighting each other. This is a wilderness to God's sheep. So it doesn't matter which beast will be ruling the world. Christians' nation is the Kingdom of God which is intangibly formed by Christians on earth.

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I too find that since Pentecost the 'Christian's nation' is the Christian congregation governed by the Kingdom of God.
A 'spiritual country' Not located on any map and has No borders nor boundaries found on any map. 1 Peter 2:9

Brian2 said:

No possibility to eat the fruit? Hmmm At least the tree of life was made childproof.
An interesting part about that is that Jesus said you have to become like a little child to get to that fruit.
Ask and you shall receive. You have to ask for it and accept it like a child and not think you can work hard enough and earn it.

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Adam and Eve were adults in Eden.
If they were children then Eden would have been like a HUGE warehouse chock full of candy.
They had access to every tree on Earth except for just one forbidden tree.
If you had a generous neighbor who had lots of fruit trees and he said you can come over any time you want and have a much fruit as you want except for one particular tree, would you consider your neighbor unreasonable ____
Since little children are teachable then to become like one means to be a teachable person.

To have 'faith' in God is not about working hard to earn but putting confidence in His Word (Bible)
Kind of like if you have confidence/faith in a favorite weather person.
He says for sure heavy rain today and you know you have to walk out in the rain to get to work.
So, as Not to get wet or soaked you put faith in that weather report and carry an umbrella
Christians know a 'storm' is in the forecast and the loving thing to do is to inform others about the coming storm.

URAVIP2ME said:

In the ^above^ I took the liberty and stressed the word " if " because we are granted a place in that coming paradisical Earth " if " we go on walking as a Christian should - 1 John 1:7 (if......)

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Maybe there is paradise for every faith, not just Christian

Seeker of White Light said:

Maybe there is paradise for every faith, not just Christian

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Yes, but I am thinking about the biblical paradisical Garden of Eden on Earth.
Adam & Eve along with descendants (includes us) were to populate Earth by expanding out Eden to global proportions.
That is the Bible's paradise where people were to gain 'everlasting life' on a beautiful paradisical Earth as Eden was.
Just because 'man' has dominated 'man' to 'man's injury, 'man's hurt does Not mean God has abandoned His original purpose for Earth.
In the Bible's last book is the promise that God will bring to ruin those ruining the Earth - Revelation 11:18 B.
This is the Bible's paradise and the reason why we are all invited to pray to God for Jesus to come ! -Rev. 22:20
Come and bring ' healing ' to earth's nations - Revelation 22:2
Healing to the point that No one will say, " I am sick....." - Isaiah 33:24
Healing to the point that even ' enemy death ' will be No more on Earth - 1 Corinthians 15:26; Isaiah 25:8