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The significance of the Temple to Jews and Christians

Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
The first and second temples clearly played a significant role in Jewish life in biblical times.

What was the purpose and role of the temple? Who were the principle figures in the running of the temple complex?

How has the practice of Judaism been affected by the absence of a temple in Jerusalem?

Should the temple be rebuilt?

Do Christians believe that there is no longer a need for a physical temple in Jerusalem?
 

rosends

Well-Known Member
What was the purpose and role of the temple?
The temple held a central place in ritual and practice, espcially sacrifical service as that was forbidden anywhere else. It was a destination for the thrice yearly pilgrimages and to where first fruits (among other offerings) were brought.
Who were the principle figures in the running of the temple complex?
Generally, various duties from administrative to religious were run by groups of priests and levites, but there were certain other operations which involved various families resident in Jerusalem.
How has the practice of Judaism been affected by the absence of a temple in Jerusalem?
Yes -- the expansion of prayer as a replacement for sacrifice is a major shift. Lamenting the loss of the temple is one of the driving emotional elements of Jewish understanding.
Should the temple be rebuilt?
Yes, and will.
 

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
We have a three week mourning period plus depressed holiday at the end for both of the Temples.

So quite important.
 

Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
The temple held a central place in ritual and practice, espcially sacrifical service as that was forbidden anywhere else. It was a destination for the thrice yearly pilgrimages and to where first fruits (among other offerings) were brought.

Generally, various duties from administrative to religious were run by groups of priests and levites, but there were certain other operations which involved various families resident in Jerusalem.

Yes -- the expansion of prayer as a replacement for sacrifice is a major shift. Lamenting the loss of the temple is one of the driving emotional elements of Jewish understanding.

Yes, and will.
What was in the Holy of Holies in the second temple? Did it matter that the original ark of the covenant was not present?
 

rosends

Well-Known Member
What was in the Holy of Holies in the second temple? Did it matter that the original ark of the covenant was not present?
It was pretty much empty

The entire contents of the Holy of Holies was hidden away already in the days of Yoshiyahu: the ark (together with the tablets of the law and the broken tablets of the law), the kaporet and the keruvim, and with them "the bottle of manna, the flask of anointing oil, Aharon's rod with its almonds and flowers, and the chest that the Philistines sent as a gift to the God of Israel" (Yoma 52b). The most sanctified area of the Temple – the place where God, as it were, resides – was totally empty throughout the Second Temple period, and therefore on Yom Kippur the High Priest would rest the shovel and the pan on the even ha-shetiya. The Second Temple was a grand and impressive structure whose innermost and most important and sanctified part was empty - this emptiness crying out that the Shekhina was absent. The significance of all this is that of the two supreme functions of the Temple – resting-place of the Shekhina and house of human worship – only one remained in the Second Temple: the people of Israel come there to serve God in His house, but God Himself was not present.

From here
 

Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
It was pretty much empty



From here
Thanks. This article makes fascinating reading.

It makes the case for prophecy ending with Malachi, but also that the Holy Spirit did not entirely disappear from the second temple. The shekinah disappeared from the Holy of Holies, but not from the Menorah - until forty years before the destruction of the second temple.

What is this all about? Why was the Holy Spirit fading from the second temple?
 

rosends

Well-Known Member
Thanks. This article makes fascinating reading.

It makes the case for prophecy ending with Malachi, but also that the Holy Spirit did not entirely disappear from the second temple. The shekinah disappeared from the Holy of Holies, but not from the Menorah - until forty years before the destruction of the second temple.

What is this all about? Why was the Holy Spirit fading from the second temple?
Here is some reading on that
https://www.yutorah.org/togo/chanuka/articles/Chanuka_To-Go_-_5770_Mrs_Knoll.pdf
 

Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
Once again, l found this very interesting.

What l'm about to say you may object to, but to me there are spiritual parallels between the consecration of a new 'house' and the oil used in the Menorah.

I believe that Solomon's temple was a 'type' of Christ. The shekinah glory above the mercy seat, in the Holy of Holies, is the presence of God (the Holy Spirit). The building that surrounds the sanctuary is made up of courts, each offering access with degrees of holiness. So, in the temple (the body of Christ), the High Priest is the only one having access to the shekinah glory within the Holy of Holies. This, to me, is Christ. But, next, we have the priests and Levites, who have access to the Holy Place. Further away, in the inner court, we have lsrael, and beyond that, in the outer court, we have the Gentiles.

We are told in the NT that when Jesus was crucified, the parochet was torn from top to bottom, allowing access to the Holy of Holies. Given the position of the courts, the priests would have been the first to enjoy access to the presence of God, if it had been there!

Jesus also told a parable about ten virgins who were awaiting the bridegroom. Five had their lamps prepared with oil, and five did not. Only those with oil in their lamps were admitted to the marriage feast [Matthew 25:1-13].

Oil is understood, in spiritual terms, to be the Holy Spirit. Is it not possible that the declining glory of the temple was a preparation for the coming of God's Christ?

Why do you think God allowed the destruction of the temple in 70 CE?
 

rosends

Well-Known Member
Once again, l found this very interesting.

What l'm about to say you may object to, but to me there are spiritual parallels between the consecration of a new 'house' and the oil used in the Menorah.
...
Is it not possible that the declining glory of the temple was a preparation for the coming of God's Christ?

"What l'm about to say you may object to" but, no.
Why do you think God allowed the destruction of the temple in 70 CE?
I could say "because that's the punishment that the people deserved" but I don't try to assign reasons to God's plan.
 

Eyes to See

Well-Known Member
The first and second temples clearly played a significant role in Jewish life in biblical times.

What was the purpose and role of the temple? Who were the principle figures in the running of the temple complex?

How has the practice of Judaism been affected by the absence of a temple in Jerusalem?

Should the temple be rebuilt?

Do Christians believe that there is no longer a need for a physical temple in Jerusalem?

Greetings. Did you know before the temple there was the tabernacle (or tent)? The instructions for its design were given to Moses and Jehovah imbued certain artisans with holy spirit to give them the wisdom to craft it the way he so desired. (Read the entire chapter of Exodus 25)

Exodus 36:1 tells us: “Bezʹal·el will work along with O·hoʹli·ab and every skilled man to whom Jehovah has given wisdom and understanding so as to know how to do all the work of the holy service just as Jehovah has commanded.” This tells us that God can make us become what he needs us to be to accomplish his purposes. I really appreciate this because it it intricately linked with what the name of the true God Jehovah means. It comes from a Hebrew verb hawah (הָוָא) become. Many scholars agree that Jehovah means: "He causes to become." Which is quite an appropriate name for the true God. And his name means he can become whatever he needs to be to accomplish his goodwill. But it also means that he can cause any of his creation to become what he so deems to accomplish his purposes.

The tabernacle stayed with the Israelites all throughout their 40 year trek through the wilderness in the middle of the assembly. Imagine Israel being divided into 12 divisions 3 on each side and the tabernacle in the middle. And there the pillar of fire by night and the pillar of cloud by day resided. There Aaron consecrated the priesthood to Jehovah. Aaron, the high priest would have the urim and thumim. These would be used to inquire of matters of the true God. And also on his headband was written "Holiness Belongs to Jehovah." Thus emphasizing God's holiness, and our need to be holy. No one could serve in the temple without first being cleansed. And sacrifices were made in the courtyard for the sins of the people daily. The Most Holy with the shakanah light represented the presence of the very God Jehovah. And no one but the high priest would be allowed entrance, and he had to be spotless and undefiled, and only on one day a year, the day of atonement, to offer the blood of the goat sacrifice over the alter for the sins of the entire people.

These are all lessons for us. Firstly God is perfect, just, holy. To approach him and serve him he requires that of us. Since we are in a sinful condition we need a redeemer.

The tabernacle remained situated in Shiloh after the conquer of the promised land, and the ark of the covenant was taken on occasion with the Israelites rebelled against Jehovah. When David finally conquered Jerusalem (the same place that was formerly known as Salem where the king-priest Melchizedek resided meaning Possession (foundation) of twofold peace (Salem meaning peace). David wanted to build the temple but God told him he would not have a man who had shed blood build his temple. So David saved up and contributed to the construction of it. I don't recall exactly, but it was somewhere over a $1 billion dollars of material provisions he himself gave to his son Solomon to construct the temple.

When Solomon consecrated the great temple to Jehovah smoke descended from heaven and and consumed the place, showing Jehovah's approval and presence of it. No one could enter the temple because of the smoke. Later Jehovah had his temple destroyed because of the Israelites' disgusting apostasy. And after a 70 year exile in Babylon faithful Jews who loved and served Jehovah faithfully returned to Jerusalem where Jehovah commissioned the rebuilding of the temple which he raised people such as Nehemiah, Zerubbabel (the second temple was called Zerubbabel's temple), Haggai, and Zechariah to give power and spirit to the people to build it.

In the book of Daniel Jehovah foretells the destruction of the second temple by the Romans. And when Jesus was on earth he made it clear that the prophecy concerning the "disgusting thing standing in a holy place" referred to the Roman armies. Jehovah foretold he would have the temple destroyed a second time because the people would reject the Messiah. And Jesus confirmed this when his apostles asked Jesus to lay his eyes on the lofty walls of the city, he told them that not a stone would be left on a stone.

There is a prophecy in Ezekiel about a symbolic temple in chapters 40-48. But it was never to be taken literally. Any Israelite would have to have known this because of its sheer dimensions, where it was situated, and what flowed from it. Ezekiel saw this temple on a very high mountain that would not fit any description of any mountains in existence in the region. And a river would flow from the temple sanctuary and continuously get wider and bigger as it progressed. No Israelite would imagine a river starting from the temple sanctuary. And the mountains terrain of the promised land would not allow for the straight parallel borders between tribes as described.

The temple vision in Ezekiel showed that true worship was to be restored. It also teaches about God's high and lofty standards, it would move a sinner to shame, and have a person want to purify themselves in order to be acceptable to Jehovah God. For example in the temple vision therein found in Ezekiel 40-48 the words "measure" and "measurement" are used over 50 times. As one work writes: "Measurements, weights, laws, statutes—what was Jehovah telling his people? It seems that he was reminding them, in powerful language, of this vital truth: Jehovah alone sets the standards for pure worship. Those who had departed from those standards needed to feel ashamed!" quoted from https://www.jw.org/en/library/books/pure-worship/restoration/meaning-of-temple-vision/

(I edited this after reading through it and seeing some errors in grammar).
 
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Eyes to See

Well-Known Member
Finally to get to your last question about if there will be another temple on earth. What was the purpose of the temple? Was it not the arrangement for pure worship? Showing God's high and elevated moral standards for the people? It was also where sacrifices were offered and accepted to atone for sin. None of this is required today.

The temple was also just an anti-type of the real spiritual temple which is in heaven. That spiritual temple in heaven came into existence in 29 C. E. when Jesus was baptized in water and with holy spirit. Upon Jesus' death the curtain that separated the Holy from the Most Holy was rent in two. That is because God no longer needed the temple arrangement on earth. The Most Holy which represents God's very presence was transferred to heaven, God himself. And 50 days later on Pentecost of 33 C. E. the resurrected spirit son of God, Jesus Christ entered into the spiritual sanctuary in heaven before the very presence of Jehovah God and offered up his blood offering of his perfect human life as a proprietary (or covering) sacrifice for all of humankind's sins, once and for all times. And he now serves as king and high priest in heaven in the real temple sanctuary.

Please read the entire chapter of Hebrews 9 to get an understanding of these things:

https://www.jw.org/en/library/bible/study-bible/books/hebrews/9/#v58009001

In part there it says:

11"However, when Christ came as a high priest of the good things that have already taken place, he passed through the greater and more perfect tent not made with hands, that is, not of this creation. 12 He entered into the holy place, not with the blood of goats and of young bulls, but with his own blood, once for all time, and obtained an everlasting deliverance for us. 13 For if the blood of goats and of bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who have been defiled sanctifies for the cleansing of the flesh, 14 how much more will the blood of the Christ, who through an everlasting spirit offered himself without blemish to God, cleanse our consciences from dead works so that we may render sacred service to the living God?

15 That is why he is a mediator of a new covenant, in order that because a death has occurred for their release by ransom from the transgressions under the former covenant, those who have been called may receive the promise of the everlasting inheritance. 16 For where there is a covenant, the death of the human covenanter needs to be established, 17 because a covenant is valid at death, since it is not in force as long as the human covenanter is living. 18 Consequently, neither was the former covenant put into effect without blood. 19 For when Moses had spoken every commandment of the Law to all the people, he took the blood of the young bulls and of the goats, with water, scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled the book and all the people, 20 saying: “This is the blood of the covenant that God has commanded you to keep.” 21 He likewise sprinkled the tent and all the vessels of the holy service with the blood. 22 Yes, according to the Law nearly all things are cleansed with blood, and unless blood is poured out no forgiveness takes place.

23 Therefore, it was necessary for the typical representations of the things in the heavens to be cleansed by these means, but the heavenly things require far better sacrifices. 24 For Christ did not enter into a holy place made with hands, which is a copy of the reality, but into heaven itself, so that he now appears before God on our behalf. 25 This was not done to offer himself often, as when the high priest enters into the holy place from year to year with blood that is not his own. 26 Otherwise, he would have to suffer often from the founding of the world. But now he has manifested himself once for all time at the conclusion of the systems of things to do away with sin through the sacrifice of himself. 27 And just as it is reserved for men to die once for all time, but after this to receive a judgment, 28 so also the Christ was offered once for all time to bear the sins of many; and the second time that he appears it will be apart from sin, and he will be seen by those earnestly looking for him for their salvation."

Reading verses 23-27 we are shown that Christ did not enter into a holy place made with human hands, but when he returned to heaven in his resurrected spirit body he entered into heaven itself, and appears directly before God on our behalf. The temple arragement was only a copy of the reality in heaven. And now that the heavenly arrangement is in place, with Jesus Christ already offering his perfect life blood once and for all time for all people, and serving as high priest and mediator between humankind and Jehovah God there is no longer a need for the representation, or the type, on earth the physical temple, that only was a shadow and a representation of the far more lofty and grand spiritual temple that now exists as a reality in heaven:

Hebrews 7:26-28 says of Jesus' human sacrifice which was offered up before Jehovah God in the great spiritual temple in heaven:

"For it is fitting for us to have such a high priest who is loyal, innocent, undefiled, separated from the sinners, and exalted above the heavens. 27 Unlike those high priests, he does not need to offer up sacrifices daily, first for his own sins and then for those of the people, because he did this once for all time when he offered himself up. 28 For the Law appoints as high priests men who have weaknesses, but the word of the oath sworn after the Law appoints a Son, who has been made perfect forever."

So we see there is no more need for an earthly man-made temple, and there is no more need for a human high priest, of which all were sinners, and they had to firstly offer up sacrifices for their own sins, and then that of the people, and they all grew old and died. The reality of the temple is in heaven where Jehovah God's person resides, and where Jesus Christ, the high priest, who lives forever supplicates for humankind as our high priest before his Father Jehovah God.
 
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Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
Finally to get to your last question about if there will be another temple on earth. What was the purpose of the temple? Was it not the arrangement for pure worship? Showing God's high and elevated moral standards for the people? It was also where sacrifices were offered and accepted to atone for sin. None of this is required today.

The temple was also just an anti-type of the real spiritual temple which is in heaven. That spiritual temple in heaven came into existence in 29 C. E. when Jesus was baptized in water and with holy spirit. Upon Jesus' death the curtain that separated the Holy from the Most Holy was rent in two. That is because God no longer needed the temple arrangement on earth. The Most Holy which represents God's very presence was transferred to heaven, God himself. And 50 days later on Pentecost of 33 C. E. the resurrected spirit son of God, Jesus Christ entered into the spiritual sanctuary in heaven before the very presence of Jehovah God and offered up his blood offering of his perfect human life as a proprietary (or covering) sacrifice for all of humankind's sins, once and for all times. And he now serves as king and high priest in heaven in the real temple sanctuary.

Please read the entire chapter of Hebrews 9 to get an understanding of these things:

https://www.jw.org/en/library/bible/study-bible/books/hebrews/9/#v58009001

In part there it says:

11"However, when Christ came as a high priest of the good things that have already taken place, he passed through the greater and more perfect tent not made with hands, that is, not of this creation. 12 He entered into the holy place, not with the blood of goats and of young bulls, but with his own blood, once for all time, and obtained an everlasting deliverance for us. 13 For if the blood of goats and of bulls and the ashes of a heifer sprinkled on those who have been defiled sanctifies for the cleansing of the flesh, 14 how much more will the blood of the Christ, who through an everlasting spirit offered himself without blemish to God, cleanse our consciences from dead works so that we may render sacred service to the living God?

15 That is why he is a mediator of a new covenant, in order that because a death has occurred for their release by ransom from the transgressions under the former covenant, those who have been called may receive the promise of the everlasting inheritance. 16 For where there is a covenant, the death of the human covenanter needs to be established, 17 because a covenant is valid at death, since it is not in force as long as the human covenanter is living. 18 Consequently, neither was the former covenant put into effect without blood. 19 For when Moses had spoken every commandment of the Law to all the people, he took the blood of the young bulls and of the goats, with water, scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled the book and all the people, 20 saying: “This is the blood of the covenant that God has commanded you to keep.” 21 He likewise sprinkled the tent and all the vessels of the holy service with the blood. 22 Yes, according to the Law nearly all things are cleansed with blood, and unless blood is poured out no forgiveness takes place.

23 Therefore, it was necessary for the typical representations of the things in the heavens to be cleansed by these means, but the heavenly things require far better sacrifices. 24 For Christ did not enter into a holy place made with hands, which is a copy of the reality, but into heaven itself, so that he now appears before God on our behalf. 25 This was not done to offer himself often, as when the high priest enters into the holy place from year to year with blood that is not his own. 26 Otherwise, he would have to suffer often from the founding of the world. But now he has manifested himself once for all time at the conclusion of the systems of things to do away with sin through the sacrifice of himself. 27 And just as it is reserved for men to die once for all time, but after this to receive a judgment, 28 so also the Christ was offered once for all time to bear the sins of many; and the second time that he appears it will be apart from sin, and he will be seen by those earnestly looking for him for their salvation."

Reading verses 23-27 we are shown that Christ did not enter into a holy place made with human hands, but when he returned to heaven in his resurrected spirit body he entered into heaven itself, and appears directly before God on our behalf. The temple arragement was only a copy of the reality in heaven. And now that the heavenly arrangement is in place, with Jesus Christ already offering his perfect life blood once and for all time for all people, and serving as high priest and mediator between humankind and Jehovah God there is no longer a need for the representation, or the type, on earth the physical temple, that only was a shadow and a representation of the far more lofty and grand spiritual temple that now exists as a reality in heaven:

Hebrews 7:26-28 says of Jesus' human sacrifice which was offered up before Jehovah God in the great spiritual temple in heaven:

"For it is fitting for us to have such a high priest who is loyal, innocent, undefiled, separated from the sinners, and exalted above the heavens. 27 Unlike those high priests, he does not need to offer up sacrifices daily, first for his own sins and then for those of the people, because he did this once for all time when he offered himself up. 28 For the Law appoints as high priests men who have weaknesses, but the word of the oath sworn after the Law appoints a Son, who has been made perfect forever."

So we see there is no more need for an earthly man-made temple, and there is no more need for a human high priest, of which all were sinners, and they had to firstly offer up sacrifices for their own sins, and then that of the people, and they all grew old and died. The reality of the temple is in heaven where Jehovah God's person resides, and where Jesus Christ, the high priest, who lives forever supplicates for humankind as our high priest before his Father Jehovah God.
I'm assuming this is all JW teaching?

What role do you think lsrael plays during the millennium? Is the millennium not a time of peace and rest on earth?
 

Eyes to See

Well-Known Member
I'm assuming this is all JW teaching?

What role do you think lsrael plays during the millennium? Is the millennium not a time of peace and rest on earth?

It's what the Bible teaches. I merely reasoned to you from the scriptures. These existed long before you or I were born. If you want to know what the Bible teaches the best place to go is a Jehovah's Witness.

Yes, the 1,000 year reign of Christ will bring untold blessings to humanity. When Jesus asks for us to pray for his kingdom rule to come to earth and let God's will be done on it as is in heaven we are asking for the kingdom rule of Jesus Christ to come. It will first and foremost clash with and put an end to all human rule, abyss Satan and his demons so they can no longer influence human society. Then it will bring untold blessings to humankind, including the resurrection to life from the dead of all the untold millions/billions of people. All sickness will be done away with, and there will be no more war, crime, famine, sickness, or death.

The spiritual nation of Israel as the "sons of God" will be revealed during that period of time. God's word reveals deep hidden truths about the "revelation of the sons of God" of whom the 144,000 spiritual Israelites are, they come out of every tribe and tongue on earth and are bought to heaven where they will rule with Jesus Christ for the 1,000 year reign.
 

Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
It's what the Bible teaches. I merely reasoned to you from the scriptures. These existed long before you or I were born. If you want to know what the Bible teaches the best place to go is a Jehovah's Witness.

Yes, the 1,000 year reign of Christ will bring untold blessings to humanity. When Jesus asks for us to pray for his kingdom rule to come to earth and let God's will be done on it as is in heaven we are asking for the kingdom rule of Jesus Christ to come. It will first and foremost clash with and put an end to all human rule, abyss Satan and his demons so they can no longer influence human society. Then it will bring untold blessings to humankind, including the resurrection to life from the dead of all the untold millions/billions of people. All sickness will be done away with, and there will be no more war, crime, famine, sickness, or death.

The spiritual nation of Israel as the "sons of God" will be revealed during that period of time. God's word reveals deep hidden truths about the "revelation of the sons of God" of whom the 144,000 spiritual Israelites are, they come out of every tribe and tongue on earth and are bought to heaven where they will rule with Jesus Christ for the 1,000 year reign.
IMO, if you want to know what the Bible teaches then the best place to go is the Holy Spirit!

The temple being built by God in Christ is, without question, a spiritual temple. But can the spiritual temple exist on earth now without a body of flesh? Can an individual, or 'lively stone' be a part of the spiritual temple if they do not have the baptism in the Holy Spirit promised by Jesus?

Have all JWs received baptism in the Holy Spirit?
 

Eyes to See

Well-Known Member
IMO, if you want to know what the Bible teaches then the best place to go is the Holy Spirit!

The temple being built by God in Christ is, without question, a spiritual temple. But can the spiritual temple exist on earth now without a body of flesh? Can an individual, or 'lively stone' be a part of the spiritual temple if they do not have the baptism in the Holy Spirit promised by Jesus?

Have all JWs received baptism in the Holy Spirit?

Agreed we need holy spirit to understand Bible truths. Very well said. Jehovah's Witnesses are baptized in the name of Jehovah God, Jesus Christ, and the holy spirit. Not all JWs are baptized with holy spirit. I have been baptized by holy spirit.

God is a God of peace not of disorder. He works through his channel to dispense spiritual food at the proper time. And that today is through the anointed remnant. Among those whom he has called and baptized with holy spirit he has selected a few to take the lead who are able-bodied, men of faith, full of virtue and righteousness. They are the faithful and discreet slave class, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses. If you acknowledge Jehovah God and his son Jesus Christ you must also acknowledge their channel on earth to dispense spiritual food. So it is most appropriate to go to Jehovah's Witnesses in order to receive spiritual enlightenment.
 

Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
Agreed we need holy spirit to understand Bible truths. Very well said. Jehovah's Witnesses are baptized in the name of Jehovah God, Jesus Christ, and the holy spirit. Not all JWs are baptized with holy spirit. I have been baptized by holy spirit.

God is a God of peace not of disorder. He works through his channel to dispense spiritual food at the proper time. And that today is through the anointed remnant. Among those whom he has called and baptized with holy spirit he has selected a few to take the lead who are able-bodied, men of faith, full of virtue and righteousness. They are the faithful and discreet slave class, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses. If you acknowledge Jehovah God and his son Jesus Christ you must also acknowledge their channel on earth to dispense spiritual food. So it is most appropriate to go to Jehovah's Witnesses in order to receive spiritual enlightenment.
Who are 'the anointed remnant', exactly? Are we talking about a discrete group of male Jehovah's Witnesses?
 

Eyes to See

Well-Known Member
Who are 'the anointed remnant', exactly? Are we talking about a discrete group of male Jehovah's Witnesses?

I have a post I was looking for where I go into detail about the anointed unfortunately the search features on this website are not that good to find it right away. But I did find a featured post of mine that explains who the anointed are in some detail. As I don't have that much free time at the moment I direct you to that thread, it should answer your question.

And no it's not a group of discreet males, lol.

The Son of Man and the Saints of Daniel 7
 

Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
I have a post I was looking for where I go into detail about the anointed unfortunately the search features on this website are not that good to find it right away. But I did find a featured post of mine that explains who the anointed are in some detail. As I don't have that much free time at the moment I direct you to that thread, it should answer your question.

And no it's not a group of discreet males, lol.

The Son of Man and the Saints of Daniel 7
I read the post you made and I have no problem with the scriptures, but l do with certain aspects of your interpretation!

In the Hebrew scriptures the Church Age is largely hidden from view. That's why, in passages such as Isaiah 61, there is no separation between the first and second comings of Christ. The prophecies relating to Israel conflate the two appearances into one.

The rapture of saints, mentioned in Thessalonians, does not appear to be directly connected to the 144000 spoken about in Revelation. To my understanding, the 144000 are from the twelve tribes of Israel, and are those that accept Christ and come through the tribulation.

The temple being built in Christ appears to leave the nation of lsrael until last. Only when the Gentile times come to an end do we see a recommencing of the (final week of) prophecy for lsrael.

As l see it!
 
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