Hi
@Dogknox20
Dogknox20 said : "Jesus is God... Christians have ALWAYS taught "Jesus is God"! If you say "Jesus is NOT God then you are clearly not Christian!" (post #1490)
dogknox20, Perhaps you missed my last post to you, it was as follows :
I see you have re-engaged this thread. We still have the following issues to resolve from post #1423.
1) HOW DOES ONE JUSTIFY “LYING FOR GOD”?
Dogknox20 said : “The Watch Tower ADDED the letter "A" to the verse John 1 so it will say Jesus is "A" god!”
Clear responded : “The English sentence rendered “and the Word was a God” is a grammatically correct translation of John 1:1c "και Θεος ην ο λογος".
The source greek itself grammatically lacks the definite article and so their rendering IS, grammatically, how the source greek reads.
If you disagree with the theology, you are going to have to argue historical context, and not grammar.
However, YOUR offering of John 1:18 is unauthentic and a false rendering of the source Greek.
Your offering doesn’t merely add an “a”, but it adds entire false phrases of multiple words to the Greek that are not there in the source Greek. This is much worse than your complaint against others.
How do you justify offering readers a falsely rendered, inauthentic commentary as scripture while complaining that the Jehovahs Witnesses offer a perfectly correct rendering of John 1:1c?
How does the fact that you are offering fake biblical text prove a grammatically correct sentence incorrect?
Dogknox20 responded : “There in NO scriptures in any Christian bible with the letter "A" in John 1! ALL ....”
Clear responded : “Your response did not answer the questions you were asked:
How do you justify offering readers a falsely rendered, inauthentic commentary as scripture while complaining that the Jehovahs Witnesses offer a perfectly correct rendering of John 1:1c?
How does the fact that you are offering fake biblical text prove a grammatically correct sentence incorrect?
Dogknox20 responded : "I post scripture.. NOT ONE of all the bible interpreters over Sixty (60) of them have said the letter "A" should be first before the word "God"!
No, you are NOT posting “scripture”.
There is no Greek source text of the bible that says : 1 John 18 No one has ever seen God. The one and only Son, who is himself God and is at the Father’s side—he has revealed him." (Dogknox, in post #1407).
Of THOUSANDS of Greek papyri and codices, NOT ONE says this.
You are posting a paraphrased commentary masquerading as scripture.
There are readers who notice this dishonest tactic.
This is much worse than you complain the Jehovahs Witnesses are doing.
1)You are offering readers scriptural commentary as though it was authentic scripture.
2)While you complain the grammatically correct rendering adds a single letter in the Jehovahs Witness translation, your paraphrase adds more than 50 letters that do not exist in the source text.
The questions you were asked still remain unanswered :
1) How do you justify offering readers a falsely rendered, inauthentic commentary as scripture while complaining that the Jehovahs Witnesses offer a perfectly correct rendering of John 1:1c?
2) How does the fact that you are offering fake biblical text prove a grammatically correct sentence incorrect?
2) HOW DOES ONE JUSTIFY MULTIPLE THOUSANDS OF MURDERS AND SLAVERY AND OPPRESSION OF ONES OWN ORGANISATION WHILE COMPLAINING ABOUT A MINISCULE NUMBER OF DEATHS BY ADHERANCE TO AN ARTICLE OF FAITH?
Clear said : "Dognox20, I asked the uncomfortable question of you : Why is the murder of thousands of innocents who were simply guilty of not being catholic or unwilling to act in conflict with their own conscience before God, more justifiable than an incredibly small number of individuals who die because they did not receive a blood transfusion?
What is your answer?
Dogknox20 responded : “There in NO scriptures in any Christian bible with the letter "A" in John 1! ALL ....”
Clear responded : “Your response did not answer the questions you were asked:
Why is the murder of thousands of innocents who were simply guilty of not being catholic or unwilling to act in conflict with their own conscience before God, more justifiable than an incredibly small number of individuals who die because they did not receive a blood transfusion?”
Dogknox responded : “I post scripture.. NOT ONE of all the bible interpreters over Sixty (60) of them have said the letter "A" should be first before the word "God"!”
How does this attempt at redirection from the important question justify the murder of thousands of innocents?
Does your mind and heart work such that if you claim others offer a different but correct translation, that this justifies the Catholic organization murdering thousands of innocents?
How does this justification work in your mind?
The same question can be said of the Catholic doctrine in it’s policy of forcing thousands into slavery. How do you justify slavery?
The same question can be asked regarding the Catholic doctrine of the persecution of Jews.
How does one justify the taking of Children from their Jewish parents by force to force the children to be or at least act like they believe in Catholicism?
The same question can be asked of the Catholic doctrine of Thievery.
How does one justify taking the property of thousands of others in order to enrich their organization and themselves in the name of Jesus?
The question can be asked regarding your claim that all of these evils are and were committed by “The Church of Christ” (when, in fact, Jesus would have repudiated such acts)?
How does your mind and heart work that it thinks that all these historical horrors are morally superior to adding an “a” to a sentence in a grammatically correct form?
3) THE NWTESTAMENT IS GRAMMATICALLY CORRECT IN IT'S TRANSLATION OF JOHN 1:1C. CONTEXT AND NOT GRAMMAR WILL DETERMINE CORRECTNESS IN THIS CASE
Clear claimed : “The English sentence rendered “and the Word was a God” is a grammatically correct translation of John 1:1c "και Θεος ην ο λογος".
The source greek itself grammatically lacks the definite article and so their rendering IS, grammatically, how the source greek reads.
If you disagree with the theology, you are going to have to argue historical context, and not grammar”
Dogknox20 responded : “There in NO scriptures in any Christian bible with the letter "A" in John 1! ALL ....”
Clear responded : “Dogknox20. You are unable to read the Greek source text and this specific ignorance is one reason why you seem to simply repeat talking points and religious advertisements rather than approach the actual underlying greek source text.
Answer my simple questions and I will attempt to give you grammatical examples that you can understand, including examples where Bibles created by the Catholics have both added and subtracted the article in Greek, the same as you claim the Jehovahs Witnesses have done.”
Dogknox20 responded : “I post scripture.. NOT ONE of all the bible interpreters over Sixty (60) of them have said the letter "A" should be first before the word "God"!”
Dogknox20. I might as well point out what is obvious to all other readers but you seem oblivious to.
YOU DO NOT READ GREEK.
YOU, DO NOT KNOW WHAT THE SOURCE GREEK SCRIPTURES ACTUALLY SAY.
YOU CANNOT TELL AN ACCURATE FROM A FALSE TRANSLATION (Else, presumably, you would not have offered readers the various false texts you have offered)
The deep irony of this situation stems (partly) from the hypocrisy and the complaint of inaccuracy of another, group, while you are guilty of much, much worse.
While you complain that you cannot find any of 60 (sixty) interpreters who added the “a”, NONE of the THOUSANDS of Greek source texts adds the 55 letters
you offered readers.
While you complain you cannot find a single English version (from 60) that has the “a”, you also cannot find a single Greek source text (from thousands that exist) that grammatically, lacks the “a”.
If any reader on the forum can find a single Greek codex of John 1:1c that grammatically, lacks the “a”, is anyone able to point it out?
Anyone?
Even a single codex from THOUSANDS that exist will do.
Dogknox, I do not understand, How are you able, in your mind, to justify complaining about another person offering grammatically correct sentence while you offer a completely inauthentic and erroneous and grammatically incorrect text and claim it is “scripture” when it is, obviously, NOT scripture.
I do not understand how you justify lying about the Jehovahs Witnesses and the numbers of children who have died from lack of blood transfusion and yet justify your own Churchs’ murder of thousands and thousands of innocents, the enslavement of populations, the oppression and the stealing from entire populations as a policy and doctrine.
It seems so blatantly hypocritical to me.
However, such actions do not merely reflect on a single person or on a single Christian movement. Instead, engaging in such actions often tends to affect other christianities in the eyes of individuals who are investigating Christianity for truth and for a lifestyle.
How do you think it affects the credibility of other Christianities when Christians either “lie for Jesus”, or are blatantly and obviously hypocritical in doing the very thing they complain others should be condemned for?
Can the complaint that “there is no ‘A’ “ in a text that you, yourself cannot read, actually justify doing damage to the Christian cause by lying and hypocrisy?
Clear
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