U.S. default this fall would cost 6 million jobs, wipe out $15 trillion in wealth, study says

PureX · Sep 22, 2021

Stevicus said:
They also fool the public into believing that all this warmongering is necessary for America's interests. But considering how much America's economy has been crippled and our government facing possible default on the debt, one might well ask: How have America's interests benefited from all of this? Our government has wasted so much money, yet has nothing to show for it.

The billionaires have plenty to show for it. So does Wall Street. And they're all that ever mattered in this country. They're all that matters to some of the people on RF. We are a nation that 'believes in greed'. That believes greed is a virtue. And we will not be dissuaded. Even as it destroys us.

PureX · Sep 22, 2021

Revoltingest said:
Without profit, there's no reason to invest.

No one said anything about there being no profit.

Revoltingest · Sep 22, 2021

PureX said:
No one said anything about there being no profit.

If you want, I could re-phrase it as without "adequate profit".
The important thing to understand is that less profit means
less investment.

PureX · Sep 22, 2021

Revoltingest said:
As long as you voters continue voting for politicians who
wage these useless wars, they'll continue waging them.
Or do you argue that voting is irrelevant? Everyone
might as well stay home in November because the
result is dictated by some secret cabal, eh.

They will wage war no matter who we vote for because they are ALL corrupted by the legalized bribery and they all will get very high-dollar jobs when they leave office corrupting their successors. They don't much care whether we want a war or not. Their cohorts in corporate owned media will tell us we're all under threat, and we won't know any different, so they'll get their war, regardless. And the billionaires will just keep getting richer off the trillions of tax dollars we all pay to make bombs and planes and ships for them to blow up or leave to the enemy when we get tired of spreading peace by killing people in country "X", to move onto country "Y".

PureX · Sep 22, 2021

Revoltingest said:
If you want, I could re-phrase it as without "adequate profit".
The important thing to understand is that less profit means
less investment.

"Adaquate" profit is an irrelevant term. All that matters to the capital investor is "maximum" profit. Which is why if 5 cents on the dollar is the maximum they can get, they will take it. But they will always want more, of course. And so they will fight tooth and nail to stop the government from doing anything to minimize costs; all the while blaming government for the reckless spending that they ensure through their bribery. Because they don't want us to realize that our government is just their lackey, and is doing their bidding.

Heyo · Sep 22, 2021

Revoltingest said:
If you want, I could re-phrase it as without "adequate profit".
The important thing to understand is that less profit means
less investment.

Do you think the pharma companies don't make "adequate profit" in Canukistan? They do, but they frolic at the dumb US administration who don't and won't negotiate prices, they just pay anything the companies demand.

sun rise · Sep 22, 2021

Revoltingest said:
Are you advocating occasional war...just for this purpose?

Hardly. I'm just pointing out that it's easier to justify defense spending in a war.

Revoltingest said:
Try working in defense industries.
It's not what you imagine.

The internet is full of sites like this U.S. Defense Contractor and Employees Sentenced for Procurement Fraud Scheme

Revoltingest · Sep 22, 2021

PureX said:
They will wage war no matter who we vote for because they are ALL corrupted by the legalized bribery and they all will get very high-dollar jobs when they leave office corrupting their successors. They don't much care whether we want a war or not. Their cohorts in corporate owned media will tell us we're all under threat, and we won't know any different, so they'll get their war, regardless. And the billionaires will just keep getting richer off the trillions of tax dollars we all pay to make bombs and planes and ships for them to blow up or leave to the enemy when we get tired of spreading peace by killing people in country "X", to move onto country "Y".

Do you vote?

Terrywoodenpic · Sep 22, 2021

America's policy is to disengage with China.
Chinas response has been a new dual system, where it continues to engage with the American block, but replace reliance on American advanced technology and patents, by home research and advanced product development and manufacture.
And increasing internal trade.

It is hard to imagine that China will not be a leading advanced chip designer and maker within 20 years.

This will change the relationship entirely, as China will become technologically independent. As will the countries in the China block.

Revoltingest · Sep 22, 2021

PureX said:
"Adaquate" profit is an irrelevant term. All that matters to the capital investor is "maximum" profit. Which is why if 5 cents on the dollar is the maximum they can get, they will take it.

You're not taking risk into account.
5% won't be worth it for high risk investments.

Revoltingest · Sep 22, 2021

Heyo said:
Do you think the pharma companies don't make "adequate profit" in Canukistan?

I've never considered how much they make.

They do, but they frolic at the dumb US administration who don't and won't negotiate prices, they just pay anything the companies demand.

We could use better administration.

Revoltingest · Sep 22, 2021

sun rise said:
The internet is full of sites like this U.S. Defense Contractor and Employees Sentenced for Procurement Fraud Scheme

I approve prosecution for fraud.
But the existence of it doesn't mean government
should take over the means of production for defense.
Hmmm....that would mean even more fraud.

PureX · Sep 22, 2021

Revoltingest said:
You're not taking risk into account.
5% won't be worth it for high risk investments.

Any percentage of profit will be "worth it" compared to no percentage. You keep jumping to the extremes to try and deny this, but there is no denying it.

Anyway, what's so desirable about investing in high risk commercial enterprise besides the chance for a big payoff? To SOCIETY, I mean, not the investor.

Revoltingest · Sep 22, 2021

PureX said:
Any percentage of profit will be "worth it" compared to no percentage. You keep jumping to the extremes to try and deny this, but there is no denying it.

You keep missing the idea that it can be better to just sit on cash
than to invest. There is no economic law requiring that investment
always happen. And setting aside such extremes, if profit is lessened,
then incentive to invest will be too. This can be observed in rent
controlled cities.
Ref...
Why Rent Control Doesn’t Work (Ep. 373) - Freakonomics

Nakosis · Sep 22, 2021

Stevicus said:
U.S. default this fall would cost 6 million jobs, wipe out $15 trillion in wealth, study says (msn.com)

I think we knew this would come eventually. 30-40 years of fiscal irresponsibility has definitely had its effects.

Eventually, we'll have to either cut spending or raise revenue - or a combination of the two.

One way of cutting spending is by reducing the prices of things our government spends money on, particularly in the areas of healthcare and defense.

There might be inventive ways of raising revenue. Since the U.S. government seems to love capitalism so much, then perhaps selling advertising space on public buildings and other properties might be just the thing. They could even have sponsors for press conferences and sessions of Congress.

Reporter: And what's the President's plan for the Middle East?
Psaki: I'll answer that in a moment, after a brief word from our sponsors. Friends, whenever I get irregularity, I take Ex-Lax, but I always make sure to never squeeze the Charmin.

Things like that, they could probably do.

What other ways of cutting spending and/or raising revenues are there?

Capitalism trying to correct itself. The government has been artificially propping up the economy for years. Kicking the can down the road usually in favor of keeping larger corporations afloat.

I don't know how long they can keep it up but I suspect eventually the system will have to correct itself.

Revoltingest · Sep 22, 2021

Nakosis said:
Capitalism trying to correct itself. The government has been artificially propping up the economy for years. Kicking the can down the road usually in favor of keeping larger corporations afloat.

Damn those corporations...paying all those property taxes,
payroll taxes, income taxes, & taxes on dividends paid out.

Government doesn't produce anything....it only consumes.
Businesses & we taxpayers keep government afloat.
Ref...
Who Really Pays Uncle Sam's Bills?

Nakosis · Sep 22, 2021

Revoltingest said:
You keep missing the idea that it can be better to just sit on cash
than to invest. There is no economic law requiring that investment
always happen. And setting aside such extremes, if profit is lessened,
then incentive to invest will be too. This can be observed in rent
controlled cities.
Ref...
Why Rent Control Doesn’t Work (Ep. 373) - Freakonomics

Wow that first photo in your link IMO explains a lot about the coming crisis.
People want the government to control pricing and not the invisible hand of the market.
I guess people have been taught not to trust freedom.

Revoltingest · Sep 22, 2021

Nakosis said:
Wow that first photo in your link IMO explains a lot about the coming crisis.
People want the government to control pricing and not the invisible hand of the market.
I guess people have been taught not to trust freedom.

Tis as though many people grow up always expecting
some parental figure to care for them....once actual
parents...now government.
The problem with freedom is that people make choices
I don't like. Oh, if only government could be trusted to
make the right choices for us.

BTW, I prefer to think of the "invisible tentacle".

Nakosis · Sep 22, 2021

Revoltingest said:
Damn those corporations...paying all those property taxes,
payroll taxes, income taxes, & taxes on dividends paid out.

Government doesn't produce anything....it only consumes.
Businesses & we taxpayers keep government afloat.
Ref...
Who Really Pays Uncle Sam's Bills?

Damn all of those business using tax payer money to keep themselves afloat.
If they were healthy and producing good wanted product at a reasonable cost, they shouldn't need the government to bail them out.

Nakosis · Sep 22, 2021

Revoltingest said:
Tis as though many people grow up always expecting
some parental figure to care for them....once actual
parents...now government.
The problem with freedom is that people make choices
I don't like. Oh, if only government could be trusted to
make the right choices for us.

BTW, I prefer to think of the "invisible tentacle".

U.S. default this fall would cost 6 million jobs, wipe out $15 trillion in wealth, study says

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