Watchtower: Jesus is not "a god"!

Muffled · Sep 13, 2021

Soapy said:
Where did the idea that God is three and God is One at the same time m, come from or is shown in the scriptures?

Is there anything within creation that reflect the three-someness of a trinity God?

Satan is called ‘God’ in the scriptures.

Moses is called ‘God’ in the scriptures.

Holy men of heroic nature are called ‘God(s)’ in the scriptures (‘I said ye are Gods’)

How many ‘Gods’ are there?

I believe you are in error There is not a three someness to God. The Trinity is not three different things it is three gospel imperative instances of the one God.

I believe for instance there are many instances of God. You could mention Isaiah, Jeremiah and Ezekiel but they are not gospel imperative.

I believe Satan may be mentioned as a god but never God.

I believe there is one God: Yahweh, Jesus and the Paraclete.

Muffled · Sep 13, 2021

paarsurrey said:
Since Jesus had no (physical) seed of God/Allah/YHVH,
Jesus shared no attribute of God/Allah/YHVH, please. Right?

Regards

I believe that makes no sense. The Qu'ran by saying that God does not have sons precludes the idea that God in a body produces a son that way.

The Qu'ran gives the correct statement of God is His Son. That is only possible spiritually.

Muffled · Sep 13, 2021

YoursTrue said:
Interesting point, paarsurrey, because Mary also had genes that were inherited from Adam and Eve.

I believe he missed the point. The attributes of God are not physical.

Soapy · Sep 13, 2021

Dogknox20 said:
BUT.. Soapy you fail to see.. Christians rejected Arius because He taught "Jesus is NOT God"! Christians believe "Jesus is God"; Always have!
Christians believe the scriptures!

This Scripture Prophesy cannot work in the reverse... "Christians were NOT among Arius"! It can only work in the one direction "Arius was AMONG Christians" UNTILL he was removed as a Heretic! "Arius was AMONG Christians" UNTILL he taught; Jesus is NOT God!
2 Peter 2:1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves.

Soapy This is Scripture Prophesy! You are forced to reject the words of Jesus to be a JW!

Jesus is God the scriptures tell you so..
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
&
John 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us.
&
John 1:18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God,

Thomas tells you "Jesus is his God"! Thomas is an Apostle Thomas is a CHRISTIAN; Christians have always believed and Taught Jesus is God!

The man who started your church "Mr. Russell" taught as Arius taught that Jesus is NOT God. He preached Jesus is NOT God1800 years AFTER Jesus! Russell taught 1800 years after Christians have been teaching Jesus IS GOD! He rejected what Christians have always taught! He rejected the scriptures!
Soapy You have to reject Christians and the scriptures to be a JW!

Why are you calling me a JW?

And, in any case, Jesus says he didn’t accept praise from mankind. (John 5:41)

So, if he doesn’t accept praise from mankind, how can he accept so-called ‘Worship’ from mankind?

And, are doing Satan’s works by upholding the false ideology that Jesus is God even as Jesus himself denied all claims that he made any such claim:

‘what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’?’ (John 10:36)

And furthermore, Jesus plainly stated that ‘GOD, the Father, sent him…’:

Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I have come here from God. I have not come on my own; God sent me.” (John 8:42)

Jesus is ‘from God’. God sent him AFTER Jesus was baptised:

“You know what has happened throughout the province of Judea, beginning in Galilee after the baptism that John preached, how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him.‘ (Acts 20:37-38)
“Again Jesus said, “Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.” (John 20:21)

Jesus also said:

“I will remain in the world no longer, but they are still in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them by the power of your name, the name you gave me, so that they may be one as we are one.” (John 17:11)

Here, Jesus says he is ‘[going] to the Father’. He does not say he is ‘Going BACK to the Father’. This is because the ‘Sending into the world’ is a term meaning, ‘To face the wickedness of the world’.

Also, notice that Jesus says he desires that the apostles (disciples) to he ONE with himself AND GOD, the Father. Do you therefore say that Jesus is desiring that ‘they’ become God, the Father… ‘We and the Father ARE ONE!’

Soapy · Sep 13, 2021

Dogknox20 said:
.
I reply.. Followers of Christ believe the words of Christ! Christians rejected Arius because he taught "Jesus is NOT God!" All who believe as Arius are NOT Christian!
Thomas is a Christian he is a Follower of Christ he is an APOSTLE! He tells you; Jesus is his God! To reject what CHRISTIANS believe is not a follower of Christ; it is "Anti-Christ"!
Soapy Jesus tells you the same thing he told Thomas.. 29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”
Scriptures tell you.. They worship Jesus: Jesus lets them worship him, NEVER does Jesus stop anyone from worshipping him! Worship is ONLY for GOD!
Scriptures tell you.. "The WORD was GOD and the WORD became flesh and lived with us"!
Christians believe and teach; Jesus is God!
Christians believe the scriptures!
The Word was God the Word became Flesh and lived among us!
Charles Taze Russell is an Anti-Christ 1800 years after Jesus established Christianity Russell taught "Jesus is NOT God" just as Arius the False Teacher did! If I was Satan I also would start a church and teach Jesus is Not God.. Satan wants to be worshiped he does not want Jesus to be worshipped!

Thomas says Jesus is HIS GOD… but HIS GOD is not our God…!!!

In any case, it is a nonsense thing to claim Thomas was ‘seeing God’ because:

“No one [of humanity] has seen God nor heard his voice…”, Jesus SAID!!

Plus, what did the other 10 apostles do when Thomas was supposed to have ‘seen God - God who was NOT A SPIRIT but flesh and bone!’ Doesn’t scriptures say that ‘God is Spirit!’?

Also, Jesus ‘doesn’t stop people kneeling to him because kneeling to him IS NOT WORSHIP…. If it were then there are too many instances of human worship throughout the scriptures. No! The people were merely bowing, kneeling, giving obeisance, to Jesus… Consider that the Jews were seeking ways to have Jesus killed: what better way than to witness him being ‘worshipped’ and take up the hue and cry that only God should be worshipped and Jesus was claiming to be God… and arrest and stone the bowers and kneelers, and obeisance givers as blasphemists?

Which way you gonna take it?

Why didn’t the Jews arrest Jesus for ‘receiving worship’? Perhaps because it WAS NOT WORSHIP?!

Soapy · Sep 13, 2021

Muffled said:
I believe you are in error There is not a three someness to God. The Trinity is not three different things it is three gospel imperative instances of the one God.

I believe for instance there are many instances of God. You could mention Isaiah, Jeremiah and Ezekiel but they are not gospel imperative.

I believe Satan may be mentioned as a god but never God.

I believe there is one God: Yahweh, Jesus and the Paraclete.

Muffled… if matters not how you or anyone tries to define a load of codswallop…! It still remains codswallop!

There are not ‘many instances of God’. You fail to DEFINE the word, ‘God’.. that’s your problem!

There is at least two threads specifically aimed at defining ‘God’, but guess what, NONE OF THEM EVEN COME CLOSE TO DOING SO because all contributors want to retain their belief … THAT IS NOT THE WAY TO DEFINE AN ENTITY.

The word, ‘God’ is a TITLE and an ADJECTIVE.

Your view of others being called ‘God’ is ensconced in the ADJECTIVE.

This means that you are saying that these others are or were:

Glorious
Powerful
Mighty
Rulers
Magistrates / Judges
Wise
Highly intelligent
Majestic
Masterful
… other superlatives!

Permutate and select which of these superlatives apply to which entity in each case BY CONTEXT.

Yes, Satan is called ‘God …’: the CONTEXT is that of the wickedness in the world. Satan is a POWERFUL, HIGHLY INTELLIGENT, MAJESTIC Angel … but with a wicked mindset…. An overinflated and negative pride. He RULES and JUDGES those whom he feels worthy to be HIS CHILDREN of wickedness!

Yes, he is GOD OF THE LIE… he is a MASTER of the lie… A glorious deceiver and majestically deceitful!!!
Do not underrate him!

And Moses was called ‘God’ by title because he was endowed with the powers of God BY GOD to speak to Pharoah and overcome the wickedness of Pharoah.

I notice that although Moses was EXPLICITLY CALLED ‘GOD’ (by God) Trinitarians always refrain from mentioning this EXTREME CASE in favour of contrived claims that Jesus was called ‘God’ when in fact it was merely the SUPERLATIVES that were referred to:

“Thy throne o God….”
“Thy throne o mighty one…

and:

“Therefore, God, Thy God, …”
“Therefore, God (title: the Father), Thy wise and powerful worshipped one (his Heavenly Father)…”

And, consider this: those verse were firstly aimed at KING DAVID… so Trinitarians are inadvertently claiming that king David was being called ‘God’… but they can’t say it … can they?

Oh, and king David was ‘WORSHIPPED’ by Bathsheba at his bedside in his old age…. Yet Trinitarians suddenly claimed that Bathsheba WORSHIPPING her husband was a mere ‘Kneeling down’, obeisance, … Suddenly, ‘worship’ becomes ‘not worship’,.., ho hum!!!

Dogknox20 · Sep 13, 2021

rational experiences said:
God in science chosen by human men as scientific quotes was stone the seal.

Theists. Just humans as a human born a human have lived however long as just humans have lived.

Yet one self which anyone is says a human is only as old as your human given age.

Scientific fact both occult and medical and cannot be argued against. Age of one human is how old that human is as science data.

Yet theists just humans were given entitled human status to theory against life existing. By claiming life living incorrectly as destroyed history.

By the rich humans who want to get richer. By false status money. Money is a fake system.

O earth owns naturally any product as God the planet. Named by men in science.

Life lived on earth equally is a human teaching of scientific natural observed intelligence.

Science by natural terms is real intelligence present now only.

Which by science law is all about just human babies.

Using no other advice.

Bible said the human baby owned the adult life and all were innocent.

To be innocent you cannot be guilty so hence no law is broken. No judgement of a law imposed.

Science only imposes laws.

Is the correct bible teaching using a historic advice.
Advice.....as correct and incorrect information is both taught to claim I was advised.

Babies are innocent hence no human man life should get sacrificed.

So father told me the bible is a human contradiction.

As so is science by status I research destructive advice. To cause loss of human life by its conditions advised.

A healer reasons hurt life and never sought destruction advice as advised.

So Jesus is involved with all defined quotes Satan. Destruction.

And the terms it was against God remaining one and whole as it's first body. The planet.

Why you are wrong. Natural life lives surviving only. You heal bodily if you can. If you cannot the human is advised of bodily damage as term healthy is removed.

Healthy was our first human self advice. Everyone hence should only be healthy with God. Whole.

God was just the one body of science quotes the stone.

In the heavens human bio owns life only which is not science as a definition.

Because we did not own life by a baby life as an act destruction. It was by sex.

Also discussed humans chose to have sexual intercourse.

Therefore only some bible quotes are real. The test is attacked life advice.

If you want attacked life advice your human self believes in it and is motivated to cause it.

Science owns no place to say humanity is wrong. Science sought destruction.

A natural human not a scientist is right. Your science community today and historic a lot of liars is real. The term God in occult science conditions.

As even a large medical reasoning is now based on human greed.

rational experiences Good to meet you.. I hope all is well...
Are you a philosopher? I think a lot of what you said is Opinion!

rational experiences · Sep 13, 2021

Dogknox20 said:
rational experiences Good to meet you.. I hope all is well...
Are you a philosopher? I think a lot of what you said is Opinion!

Humans owned opinion before science as a used hence chosen conscious expression.

Motivated want in his man life proves that a human chose to want to know creation as a thesis to force change it.

Science not natural it was man human invented by man's owned purpose

Why consciousness human is stated to exist only after Christ heavens to stop man lying.

Where they looked as a human who calculated theories first to design build control never controlled God.

Visionary feedback heaven vision advice for science.

Yet by maths not owning mass natural they did sacrifice owning firstborn human DNA as the human body mind who reapplied science thesis..

So confessed maths lied as mother womb confession said they were abominated attacked as man placed machine by design to be his life partner.

In natural life equal partnered to a human female. His bond marriage a human.

In bible he stated marriage to bonded alchemical or gases.

I am not lying science is.

What you are possessed by.

Hitler is proof as he read a book that discussed cloud father image as white snow haired blue eyes. Sky is blue. Hence he claimed his race direct descendant of the heavenly father.

As the one only.

Jewels of God earth irradiated conversion owned crystalline mass by God were gone sacrificed so he blamed humans who used Jew title as EL stated God powers gone.

For not all DNA humans in Germany were living blonde snow white hair and blue eyed. How an irrational science theist began his hateful journey.

Of placating new science fallout irradiation would re establish one only DNA life body form on earth. Hence made a thesis science statement product he claimed would achieve it.

Proving his man psyche knew nuclear fallout eradicated DNA.

Science after ice age humans were firstborn all eradicated out of DNA. So blonde blue eyed were not first either. We only own the DNA that survived.

To want science is to change your thoughts to motivate human reasoning to design it.

After your confession maths is wrong still your ego wants to argue no man is God or gods mass journey in spatial creation.

Dogknox20 · Sep 13, 2021

Soapy said:
Why are you calling me a JW?

And, in any case, Jesus says he didn’t accept praise from mankind. (John 5:41)

So, if he doesn’t accept praise from mankind, how can he accept so-called ‘Worship’ from mankind?

And, are doing Satan’s works by upholding the false ideology that Jesus is God even as Jesus himself denied all claims that he made any such claim:

‘what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’?’ (John 10:36)

And furthermore, Jesus plainly stated that ‘GOD, the Father, sent him…’:

Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I have come here from God. I have not come on my own; God sent me.” (John 8:42)

Jesus is ‘from God’. God sent him AFTER Jesus was baptised:

“You know what has happened throughout the province of Judea, beginning in Galilee after the baptism that John preached, how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him.‘ (Acts 20:37-38)

“Again Jesus said, “Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.” (John 20:21)

Jesus also said:

“I will remain in the world no longer, but they are still in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them by the power of your name, the name you gave me, so that they may be one as we are one.” (John 17:11)

Here, Jesus says he is ‘[going] to the Father’. He does not say he is ‘Going BACK to the Father’. This is because the ‘Sending into the world’ is a term meaning, ‘To face the wickedness of the world’.

Also, notice that Jesus says he desires that the apostles (disciples) to he ONE with himself AND GOD, the Father. Do you therefore say that Jesus is desiring that ‘they’ become God, the Father… ‘We and the Father ARE ONE!’

You asked... So, if he doesn’t accept praise from mankind, how can he accept so-called ‘Worship’ from mankind?
I reply: .. The Scriptures tell you Jesus accepted worship!.. HOW he can accept it is a QUESTION no one can answer because no one is God accept Jesus!

Soapy Christians worship Jesus because "Jesus is God"! Your opinions are MOOT! You are forced to reject the scriptures to believe differently then Christians!
Scriptures tell you "Jesus is God"!
Scriptures warn you about Heretics what will teach "Jesus is NOT God"!
Soapy You cannot say you are Christian and reject what Christians teach and believe.. You are las Judas a Hypocrite he did the same! Judas reject the teaching of God but stayed with the rest of the Christians pretending to be a believer!

Dogknox20 · Sep 13, 2021

Soapy said:
Thomas says Jesus is HIS GOD… but HIS GOD is not our God…!!!

In any case, it is a nonsense thing to claim Thomas was ‘seeing God’ because:

“No one [of humanity] has seen God nor heard his voice…”, Jesus SAID!!

Plus, what did the other 10 apostles do when Thomas was supposed to have ‘seen God - God who was NOT A SPIRIT but flesh and bone!’ Doesn’t scriptures say that ‘God is Spirit!’?

Also, Jesus ‘doesn’t stop people kneeling to him because kneeling to him IS NOT WORSHIP…. If it were then there are too many instances of human worship throughout the scriptures. No! The people were merely bowing, kneeling, giving obeisance, to Jesus… Consider that the Jews were seeking ways to have Jesus killed: what better way than to witness him being ‘worshipped’ and take up the hue and cry that only God should be worshipped and Jesus was claiming to be God… and arrest and stone the bowers and kneelers, and obeisance givers as blasphemists?

Which way you gonna take it?

Why didn’t the Jews arrest Jesus for ‘receiving worship’? Perhaps because it WAS NOT WORSHIP?!

You Are CORRECT to say.. Thomas says Jesus is HIS GOD… but HIS GOD is not our God…! Yes BUT who are these others you mention as "OUR" I thought it was just you I was talking to!? Thomas God is NOT your god correct!.. Because Thomas is a Christian his God is Jesus!
Soapy Thomas is an APOSTLE a CHRISTIAN!

You are really mistaken "Thomas is a Apostle"! Thomas is a Christian! Thomas' God is MY God because I am also a Christian!

Soapy Thomas tells you "Jesus is his God"! I tell you Jesus is MY God! The early Christians rejected Arius because he was as YOU a NON Christian; Arius rejected what Christians believe; Just as you do!
Soapy Jesus tells Thomas "YES you are right; You believe I am God because you have seen me.. Other who have NOT seen me but believe I am God are BLESSED"!

16 These are the twelve he appointed: Simon (to whom he gave the name Peter), 17 James son of Zebedee and his brother John (to them he gave the name Boanerges, which means “sons of thunder”), 18 Andrew, Philip, Bartholomew, Matthew, Thomas, James son of Alphaeus, Thaddaeus, Simon the Zealot 19 and Judas Iscariot, who betrayed him.

Soapy Thomas' God is the same God Christians have always had.. "Jesus is God"!

rational experiences · Sep 13, 2021

Irrational human men like arguing.

O stone has to exist first as the science theist has a human body that owns bones.

What rational human thinkers versus irrational scientist had to contend with.

We think too. We live naturally. We had to argue against illogical human theists.

So to argue correctly we are not actually scientists.

O planet first stone. Heavens second.

Both are spatial formed mass natural bodies.

Water mass oxygen heavens exists first.

As we live inside of the status water oxygenated heavens as a human at the ground. Walking on the stone owning water in its sealed mass protecting us. From irradiation.

A human story taught against nuclear science breaking earths seal making the water be removed out of stone from beneath our feet.

One God. O planet first.

It was an argument human living owned science argument for life already living on earth.

Versus science human theist who theories space in a formula to own a caused forced science reaction. By calculated formula. Conversion and reacting.

2ndpillar · Sep 14, 2021

Dogknox20 said:
.
Christians believe Jesus is God!
Christians believe the scriptures!
NO the word does NOT have a beginning..
"In the Beginning was the word!" .... In the beginning was GOD!
2ndpillar Are you saying; God had a beginning?
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

NIRV
In the beginning, the Word was already there. The Word was with God, and the Word was God.
WE
The Word already was, way back before anything began to be. The Word and God were together. The Word was God.

2ndpillar Scripture Prophesy proves Jesus is God!
Arius was AMONG Christians until he taught "Jesus is not God" he was removed as a False Teacher!
2 Peter 2:1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves.

This PROPHESY cannot work in the reverse.. Christians were NOT AMONG Arius! Christians believe Jesus is God as the scriptures tell you! Thomas is an Apostle he tells you "Jesus is his Lord and GOD!"
28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”
2ndpillar Jesus does NOT correct Thomas;. Thus Jesus is GOD! Jesus does NOT stop Thomas from making error because Jesus is GOD! LOOK..

2ndpillar look what Jesus said to Thomas in reply...
29 Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”
2ndpillar Jesus is telling you: "You are NOT blessed"!

Charles Taze Russell taught "Jesus is NOT God!" 1800 years AFTER Christians have taught "Jesus is God". Russell comes along teaching the opposite!
2ndpillar Jesus warned about Anti-Christs, If I was to look for a true church I would reject the JWs because they don't teach what Christians have always taught! If I was Satan I would also start a church that rejects Jesus!

The "Christian" church is built on the lie that "you surely shall not die" (Genesis 3:4) (1 Corinthians 15:50-52), which was preached by the serpent/devil, as well as the false prophet Paul, who subsequently died.

As for Thomas, the "Christians" deleted his gospel from their canon. He apparently was too much of a gnostic, and dealt in images and not bread and butter issues. What he did write in his gospel was:
114. Simon Peter said to them, "Make Mary leave us, for females don't deserve life."

Jesus said, "Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of Heaven."

12. The disciples said to Jesus, "We know that you are going to leave us. Who will be our leader?"

Jesus said to them, "No matter where you are you are to go to James the Just, for whose sake heaven and earth came into being."

Maybe you should become a follower of James and not the false prophet/teacher Paul, and follow the teachings of James. James taught to keep the Law, and the Law describes to have "no other gods before me".

As for 2 Peter, it wasn't written by Peter, and even 1 Peter is under question as to what language he would have used, and who actually wrote it in Greek, and how good would have been the translation..

As for Arius, he was cut off by the "beast with two horns like a lamb" (Revelation 13), Constantine, but Constantine, at one time, also exiled Athanasius, the teacher of the Trinity doctrine as well. The Catholic's Saint Eusebius, a church leader, and a leader of the Arians, was the the Arian guy who baptized the Eastern church's Saint Constantine. The Catholic feast day of Saint Eusebius is 14 August. When a vote was taken at the Council of Nicaea, to exile Arian, Eusebius abstained from voting.

2ndpillar · Sep 14, 2021

Dogknox20 said:
You Are CORRECT to say.. Thomas says Jesus is HIS GOD… but HIS GOD is not our God…! Yes BUT who are these others you mention as "OUR" I thought it was just you I was talking to!? Thomas God is NOT your god correct!.. Because Thomas is a Christian his God is Jesus!
Soapy Thomas is an APOSTLE a CHRISTIAN!

You are really mistaken "Thomas is a Apostle"! Thomas is a Christian! Thomas' God is MY God because I am also a Christian!

Soapy Thomas tells you "Jesus is his God"! I tell you Jesus is MY God! The early Christians rejected Arius because he was as YOU a NON Christian; Arius rejected what Christians believe; Just as you do!
Soapy Jesus tells Thomas "YES you are right; You believe I am God because you have seen me.. Other who have NOT seen me but believe I am God are BLESSED"!

16 These are the twelve he appointed: Simon (to whom he gave the name Peter), 17 James son of Zebedee and his brother John (to them he gave the name Boanerges, which means “sons of thunder”), 18 Andrew, Philip, Bartholomew, Matthew, Thomas, James son of Alphaeus, Thaddaeus, Simon the Zealot 19 and Judas Iscariot, who betrayed him.

Soapy Thomas' God is the same God Christians have always had.. "Jesus is God"!

Yeshua says "you are all gods" (John 10:34), which is not to say you are God. Yeshua said "I am the son of God" (John 10:36), which is not to say, "I am God". A son has a beginning and a source. God has no beginning, and is not begotten. I understand you are steeped in the doctrine of the Whore of Babylon, but that whore is not destined to survive (Matthew 7:27), nor is her leader (Isaiah 22:25), who will "fall", and his followers will be "cut off".

Dogknox20 · Sep 14, 2021

2ndpillar said:
The "Christian" church is built on the lie that "you surely shall not die" (Genesis 3:4) (1 Corinthians 15:50-52), which was preached by the serpent/devil, as well as the false prophet Paul, who subsequently died.

As for Thomas, the "Christians" deleted his gospel from their canon. He apparently was too much of a gnostic, and dealt in images and not bread and butter issues. What he did write in his gospel was:
114. Simon Peter said to them, "Make Mary leave us, for females don't deserve life."

Jesus said, "Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of Heaven."

12. The disciples said to Jesus, "We know that you are going to leave us. Who will be our leader?"

Jesus said to them, "No matter where you are you are to go to James the Just, for whose sake heaven and earth came into being."

Maybe you should become a follower of James and not the false prophet/teacher Paul, and follow the teachings of James. James taught to keep the Law, and the Law describes to have "no other gods before me".

As for 2 Peter, it wasn't written by Peter, and even 1 Peter is under question as to what language he would have used, and who actually wrote it in Greek, and how good would have been the translation..

As for Arius, he was cut off by the "beast with two horns like a lamb" (Revelation 13), Constantine, but Constantine, at one time, also exiled Athanasius, the teacher of the Trinity doctrine as well. The Catholic's Saint Eusebius, a church leader, and a leader of the Arians, was the the Arian guy who baptized the Eastern church's Saint Constantine. The Catholic feast day of Saint Eusebius is 14 August. When a vote was taken at the Council of Nicaea, to exile Arian, Eusebius abstained from voting.

2ndpillar Your quoted scripture is NOT scripture.. It is clearly made up phony scripture! You have been deceived believing these lies!
If you want to talk to me then you will have to post scripture from the bible!

I am a Christian! Christians believe and teach "Jesus is God"!
Christians believe the scriptures!

Thomas the Apostle is a Christian he tells us "Jesus is his God"!

Dogknox20 · Sep 14, 2021

2ndpillar said:
Yeshua says "you are all gods" (John 10:34), which is not to say you are God. Yeshua said "I am the son of God" (John 10:36), which is not to say, "I am God". A son has a beginning and a source. God has no beginning, and is not begotten. I understand you are steeped in the doctrine of the Whore of Babylon, but that whore is not destined to survive (Matthew 7:27), nor is her leader (Isaiah 22:25), who will "fall", and his followers will be "cut off".

.
2ndpillar The One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church is the ONLY Church Jesus established! The Catholic Church has a Foundation of ROCK it will never fail Jesus did not build on Sand!
How can you say I am not in Jesus when you know full well your church was NOT started by Jesus! Catholics believe Jesus is God!
All Christians believe and teach "Jesus is God"!
Christians believe the scriptures!

Soapy · Sep 14, 2021

Dogknox20 said:
You Are CORRECT to say.. Thomas says Jesus is HIS GOD… but HIS GOD is not our God…! Yes BUT who are these others you mention as "OUR" I thought it was just you I was talking to!? Thomas God is NOT your god correct!.. Because Thomas is a Christian his God is Jesus!
Soapy Thomas is an APOSTLE a CHRISTIAN!

You are really mistaken "Thomas is a Apostle"! Thomas is a Christian! Thomas' God is MY God because I am also a Christian!

Soapy Thomas tells you "Jesus is his God"! I tell you Jesus is MY God! The early Christians rejected Arius because he was as YOU a NON Christian; Arius rejected what Christians believe; Just as you do!
Soapy Jesus tells Thomas "YES you are right; You believe I am God because you have seen me.. Other who have NOT seen me but believe I am God are BLESSED"!

16 These are the twelve he appointed: Simon (to whom he gave the name Peter), 17 James son of Zebedee and his brother John (to them he gave the name Boanerges, which means “sons of thunder”), 18 Andrew, Philip, Bartholomew, Matthew, Thomas, James son of Alphaeus, Thaddaeus, Simon the Zealot 19 and Judas Iscariot, who betrayed him.

Soapy Thomas' God is the same God Christians have always had.. "Jesus is God"!

Why isn’t there a Gospel of Thomas?

‘You believe I am god because you have seen me…’?

Which Bible is that written in?

Anyway, please re-examine your belief and turn to believe in the true God: the Father… and in Jesus Christ, the Lord.

Please remember that ‘Christ’ means:

“Anointed one”

Please remember that it was GOD who anointed Jesus… to make him ‘Christ/Messiah’:

“Therefore let all Israel be assured of this: God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Messiah.” (Acts 2:36)

Who did God make to he Lord, and Christ?

Also:

“God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.” (1 Cor 5:21)

Who is that had no sin…, in whom we might become the righteousness of God?

Who is it that GOD madd to be sin … for righteousness sake?

Soapy · Sep 14, 2021

Dogknox20 said:
You asked... So, if he doesn’t accept praise from mankind, how can he accept so-called ‘Worship’ from mankind?
I reply: .. The Scriptures tell you Jesus accepted worship!.. HOW he can accept it is a QUESTION no one can answer because no one is God accept Jesus!

Soapy Christians worship Jesus because "Jesus is God"! Your opinions are MOOT! You are forced to reject the scriptures to believe differently then Christians!
Scriptures tell you "Jesus is God"!
Scriptures warn you about Heretics what will teach "Jesus is NOT God"!
Soapy You cannot say you are Christian and reject what Christians teach and believe.. You are las Judas a Hypocrite he did the same! Judas reject the teaching of God but stayed with the rest of the Christians pretending to be a believer!

I say that I am a Christian but not a TRINITARIAN Christian.

‘Christian’ means ‘Follower of Christ’. So I am Christian. I am not a “trinitarian follower of Christ”, which means I don’t believe in any way that Jesus is YHWH Almighty God.

Further, no scriptures says Jesus is God, nor did Jesus say he was God, nor is there any three-in-one God…. Which contradicts God saying he is the only God…

There is no such thing as an only God who is three… that is an oxymoron (in more than one meaning!!)

2ndpillar · Sep 14, 2021

Dogknox20 said:
.
2ndpillar The One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church is the ONLY Church Jesus established! The Catholic Church has a Foundation of ROCK it will never fail Jesus did not build on Sand!
How can you say I am not in Jesus when you know full well your church was NOT started by Jesus! Catholics believe Jesus is God!
All Christians believe and teach "Jesus is God"!
Christians believe the scriptures!

Your conflating what the Catholic Church says with what Yeshua and the "Scripture" say. Peter was not even the 1st bishop of Rome, according to the second-century Irenaeus, it was a man named Linus, who was appointed to the office of bishop by Peter and Paul (Against Heresies 3, 3, 3). Not that Peter and Paul actually got along, but that is the story by Irenaeus. Apparently Peter was bishop of Antioch, and went to Rome, and was supposedly hung from a tree/cross, and he was apparently "cursed" for hanging on a tree into the night (Deut 21:23). Isaiah 22:18 prophesizes of the death of Peter in a "vast country"/Rome. The real first pope, Pontifex Maximus, of the Roman Catholic church, was Constantine, as that position was historically the leader of the pagan church, and as Caesar Augustus, Constantine was the Pontifex Maximus, and head of the state and church. As for your "all Christians", that is probably not true, but the "many" of Matthew 7:13, would apply, and they are destined for "destruction". The Catholic church snuffed out any dissenters, except for those who were given two wings to fly into the wilderness, to escape from the serpent (Revelation 12:14). The "serpent"/dragon would be representative of the devil, who gives his power to the beast (Revelation 13:4). The Roman church would be described as the women (Babylon the Great), sitting on the "beast:" with seven heads.

2ndpillar · Sep 14, 2021

Dogknox20 said:
2ndpillar Your quoted scripture is NOT scripture.. It is clearly made up phony scripture! You have been deceived believing these lies!
If you want to talk to me then you will have to post scripture from the bible!

I am a Christian! Christians believe and teach "Jesus is God"!
Christians believe the scriptures!

Thomas the Apostle is a Christian he tells us "Jesus is his God"!

You use Thomas as the basis of your Trinity hypothesis, yet you reject quotes from what is taken from the gospel of Thomas. Your "scripture" does not match the "scripture" described by Yeshua in John 10:35, or what Paul referred to in 2 Timothy 3:15, in which he referred to as holy writings read from his childhood, which would not include your canon, which has not been universal accepted throughout the "Christian" sphere, and your canon was only first put in order in 367 AD, well after the falling away of the church (Matthew 24:10). Your term "Christian", is not a shield, and it will not save you from the coming Great Tribulation based on justice and truth, with respect to the judgment of God, not back stories from "fat" "shepherds" (Ezekiel 34), who are looking at their own judgment (Ezekiel 34:16).

2ndpillar · Sep 14, 2021

Soapy said:
Why isn’t there a Gospel of Thomas?

‘You believe I am god because you have seen me…’?

Which Bible is that written in?

Anyway, please re-examine your belief and turn to believe in the true God: the Father… and in Jesus Christ, the Lord.

Please remember that ‘Christ’ means:

“Anointed one”

Please remember that it was GOD who anointed Jesus… to make him ‘Christ/Messiah’:

“Therefore let all Israel be assured of this: God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Messiah.” (Acts 2:36)

Who did God make to he Lord, and Christ?

Also:

“God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.” (1 Cor 5:21)

Who is that had no sin…, in whom we might become the righteousness of God?

Who is it that GOD madd to be sin … for righteousness sake?

There is a gospel of Thomas. Its full form was not found until around 1945 in Egypt. Prior to that, all you had were bits and pieces. The fact it put a negative light on Mary, as she was a women, would not be well accepted by the Roman Catholics, who have put her in heaven by decree of their pope. Mary is not in heaven, nor is Peter standing by some gate. There is very little of any truth that can be found in the dogmas of the Roman Catholic church. That is why the Catholic church fought so long and hard to keep the bible out of the hands of the peasants. There isn't much good to say about Martin Luther, except that he helped get the bible, as imperfect as it is, into the hands of the unwashed in a language they could understand. Apparently, the Amish are the only ones using that bible in old German. Now the Amish forbid any bible that isn't written in old German, a language which very few even speak or read. They elect their pastors by lot, so don't be surprised to find their pastors/leaders, unable to read their own bible, and would be excommunicated if they used another bible which they could actually read. Not to say that the Amish are allowed to take a bible from their church to read at home. From there, anyone with a bible will have to separate the chaff from the wheat on their own, or seek the help of the Comforter.

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