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Nutters?

Heyo

Veteran Member
I guess I am just being too nice here.

I'm talking about these guys:

I get why this isn't legitimate, you get why this isn't legitimate, why isn't it though, when they're doing what the scripture tells them to do and why is stuff like this not a Catholic or Orthodox practice?

It is the same. You either believe in magic or you don't. When a catholic travels to Lourdes instead of to a faith healer, all s/he's saying is "my magic is stronger than your magic". That's why other theists may not look favourable towards faith healer but they leave seriously critiquing them to the atheists.
 

oldbadger

Skanky Old Mongrel!
Most Christians are not literalists.
Hello again..... :)
I think that Christians are literalists..... when it suits them.
After all, they do quote chapter and verse quite a lot.

I think many of us are sceptical that these things happened in quite the way the bible writers portray them. Given the lack of scientific and medical knowledge at the time, it would not be surprising if these accounts were a bit fanciful.
A bit fanciful.....ok, fair enough. But those described in G-Mark are mostly true, I think. The way that they are written just shows how they were perceived by witnesses at that time.

Some are 'a stretch' to support, but they are all supportable.

Have you ever heard of Harry Edwards, Leatherhead, Kent...back in the 60s and 70s? My late wife had petit and grand mal epilepsy and her daily seizures were very bad. We went to see Mr Edwards in (circa) 1973 and immediately afterwards her seizures stopped...they just stopped. In (circa) 1975/6 her seizures returned so I tried to make contact with Mr Edwards again. He had just died.

I had a healing experience at 1330hrs, 16/10/17' at a Spiritualist Chapel in Tankerton, Kent. Equally amazing.
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
Hello again..... :)
I think that Christians are literalists..... when it suits them.
After all, they do quote chapter and verse quite a lot.


A bit fanciful.....ok, fair enough. But those described in G-Mark are mostly true, I think. The way that they are written just shows how they were perceived by witnesses at that time.

Some are 'a stretch' to support, but they are all supportable.

Have you ever heard of Harry Edwards, Leatherhead, Kent...back in the 60s and 70s? My late wife had petit and grand mal epilepsy and her daily seizures were very bad. We went to see Mr Edwards in (circa) 1973 and immediately afterwards her seizures stopped...they just stopped. In (circa) 1975/6 her seizures returned so I tried to make contact with Mr Edwards again. He had just died.

I had a healing experience at 1330hrs, 16/10/17' at a Spiritualist Chapel in Tankerton, Kent. Equally amazing.
Quoting bible verses does not equate to taking the words 100% literally.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Many Christians like to make fun of those Evangelicals who purport to do faith healing and consider them crazy
They do have a point IF the Evangelical "claims" he does the healing, because in fact He (God) does the healing
But, I only met Evangelicals who were very well aware that they were not doing the healing
They usually claim even "I don't do the healing, it's God who does the healing, give all praise to Him, and Him along
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
How would you view Elijah, Jesus, Peter, Paul, and others who also engaged in faith healing (for ex. Peter healing the cripple, Paul healing Eutychus)? They were doing the same thing. Alright, granted, in your faith you believe these things actually happened. This passage in James also seems to suggests faith healing on the part of Preists,

Are any among you suffering? They should pray. Are any cheerful? They should sing songs of praise. Are any among you sick? They should call for the elders of the church and have them pray over them, anointing them with oil in the name of the Lord. The prayer of faith will save the sick, and the Lord will raise them up; and anyone who has committed sins will be forgiven. Therefore confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, so that you may be healed. The prayer of the righteous is powerful and effective.


I'm genuinely wondering how Catholics, Orthodox and other non-Evangelicals understand this and how they differentiate between historical faith healers and modern ones?
God is the same, now and in the past, AND God does the "faith healing", hence, naturally I see no difference there
 

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Not too far off, actually. But the question is, do the Scriptures support such a view, right?
I’m sorta busy, right now, but read 1 Corinthians 13:8-12….gifts of the spirit would be “done away with”; “will cease”. When? “When that which is complete* arrives”.

*= the Bible.
That is an odd interpretation because one of the gifts of the spirit listed is knowledge. Why would knowledge cease when the Bible arrived some 55 years after the crucifixion?

In my opinion.
 

Samantha Rinne

Resident Genderfluid Writer/Artist
Mainly aimed at Christians, but possibly also at Jews as well regarding the general concept of faith healing. I've not heard of this within Islam and Baha'iism.

Many Christians like to make fun of those Evangelicals who purport to do faith healing and consider them crazy. How would you view Elijah, Jesus, Peter, Paul, and others who also engaged in faith healing (for ex. Peter healing the cripple, Paul healing Eutychus)? They were doing the same thing. Alright, granted, in your faith you believe these things actually happened. This passage in James also seems to suggests faith healing on the part of Preists,

Are any among you suffering? They should pray. Are any cheerful? They should sing songs of praise. Are any among you sick? They should call for the elders of the church and have them pray over them, anointing them with oil in the name of the Lord. The prayer of faith will save the sick, and the Lord will raise them up; and anyone who has committed sins will be forgiven. Therefore confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, so that you may be healed. The prayer of the righteous is powerful and effective.


I'm genuinely wondering how Catholics, Orthodox and other non-Evangelicals understand this and how they differentiate between historical faith healers and modern ones?

Thanks.

I don't care if you are a staff member, it takes alot of nerve to trash other religions like this. There is no cause for calling people "nutters" for believing that faith is able to make people well. And as a staff member, you have a responsibility to set a positive example.

Btw, faith is able to make people well. On the most level, cells are made of atoms. Atoms are not able to get sick. And there is no reason why a cell should break down either, not from bacteria or viruses. Sickness or wellness is really about belief. You see this alot, a chronically depressed person actually gets physical pain from their ailment. A person who is in debt and working three jobs gets a bad illness from all their stress.
Can Stress Actually Make You Sick? Here's What 4 Different MDs Have To Say
These are negative feelings, the antithesis of faith. Yet, posirive feeling can't make people well? You're kidding right? It happens all the time. People have had their cancer literally disappear.
'I Believed God Would Heal Me, and He Did,' Says Man Cured of 'Inoperable Cancer' (VIDEO)
Either Tarceva is so effective at curing cancer that it should be recommended everywhere (it isn't, other people haven't had the same success) or faith healing works. Now does it work all the time? Probably not. And some people try to faith heal and do a poor job of it, but in worst cases, nothing happens (versus with medicine, actually making things worse).

Islam and Bahai have their own issues.
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
I don't care if you are a staff member, it takes alot of nerve to trash other religions like this. There is no cause for calling people "nutters" for believing that faith is able to make people well. And as a staff member, you have a responsibility to set a positive example.

Btw, faith is able to make people well. On the most level, cells are made of atoms. Atoms are not able to get sick. And there is no reason why a cell should break down either, not from bacteria or viruses. Sickness or wellness is really about belief. You see this alot, a chronically depressed person actually gets physical pain from their ailment. A person who is in debt and working three jobs gets a bad illness from all their stress.
Can Stress Actually Make You Sick? Here's What 4 Different MDs Have To Say
These are negative feelings, the antithesis of faith. Yet, posirive feeling can't make people well? You're kidding right? It happens all the time. People have had their cancer literally disappear.
'I Believed God Would Heal Me, and He Did,' Says Man Cured of 'Inoperable Cancer' (VIDEO)
Either Tarceva is so effective at curing cancer that it should be recommended everywhere (it isn't, other people haven't had the same success) or faith healing works. Now does it work all the time? Probably not. And some people try to faith heal and do a poor job of it, but in worst cases, nothing happens (versus with medicine, actually making things worse).

Islam and Bahai have their own issues.
I didn't call them nutters. I placed a question mark after it then clarified in the OP that this is what others tend to call them. My title was actually meant to imply the opposite, based on my OP, that if a Christian thinks these people are nutters then what must they think of people like Eliyahu and Peter, who also faith healed.
 

loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
Mainly aimed at Christians, but possibly also at Jews as well regarding the general concept of faith healing. I've not heard of this within Islam and Baha'iism.

Many Christians like to make fun of those Evangelicals who purport to do faith healing and consider them crazy. How would you view Elijah, Jesus, Peter, Paul, and others who also engaged in faith healing (for ex. Peter healing the cripple, Paul healing Eutychus)? They were doing the same thing. Alright, granted, in your faith you believe these things actually happened. This passage in James also seems to suggests faith healing on the part of Preists,

Are any among you suffering? They should pray. Are any cheerful? They should sing songs of praise. Are any among you sick? They should call for the elders of the church and have them pray over them, anointing them with oil in the name of the Lord. The prayer of faith will save the sick, and the Lord will raise them up; and anyone who has committed sins will be forgiven. Therefore confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, so that you may be healed. The prayer of the righteous is powerful and effective.


I'm genuinely wondering how Catholics, Orthodox and other non-Evangelicals understand this and how they differentiate between historical faith healers and modern ones?

Thanks.

If you look at the passage it indicates spiritual illness such as being sinful, so the healing involves spiritual medicines such as prayer whereas physical illness requires herbs and other physical remedies. But the illnesses Jesus came to heal were spiritual as what use is bringing a person physically alive from the dead only for him to die at a later time?
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
If you look at the passage it indicates spiritual illness such as being sinful, so the healing involves spiritual medicines such as prayer whereas physical illness requires herbs and other physical remedies. But the illnesses Jesus came to heal were spiritual as what use is bringing a person physically alive from the dead only for him to die at a later time?
Paul literally brought a dead man back to life and Peter healed a cripple. These clearly aren't spiritual ailments.
 

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
Mainly aimed at Christians, but possibly also at Jews as well regarding the general concept of faith healing. I've not heard of this within Islam and Baha'iism.

Many Christians like to make fun of those Evangelicals who purport to do faith healing and consider them crazy. How would you view Elijah, Jesus, Peter, Paul, and others who also engaged in faith healing (for ex. Peter healing the cripple, Paul healing Eutychus)? They were doing the same thing. Alright, granted, in your faith you believe these things actually happened. This passage in James also seems to suggests faith healing on the part of Preists,

Are any among you suffering? They should pray. Are any cheerful? They should sing songs of praise. Are any among you sick? They should call for the elders of the church and have them pray over them, anointing them with oil in the name of the Lord. The prayer of faith will save the sick, and the Lord will raise them up; and anyone who has committed sins will be forgiven. Therefore confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, so that you may be healed. The prayer of the righteous is powerful and effective.


I'm genuinely wondering how Catholics, Orthodox and other non-Evangelicals understand this and how they differentiate between historical faith healers and modern ones?

Thanks.
Reverend Peter Popoff is a debunked faith healer. Many others have been debunked. This is why many modern faith healers are not believed.

God doesn't want genuine faith healers to be ostentatious. God wants to have the fame and respect.
 

Kelly of the Phoenix

Well-Known Member
Many Christians like to make fun of those Evangelicals who purport to do faith healing and consider them crazy. How would you view Elijah, Jesus, Peter, Paul, and others who also engaged in faith healing (for ex. Peter healing the cripple, Paul healing Eutychus)? They were doing the same thing. Alright, granted, in your faith you believe these things actually happened.
I now see the same red flags in the Bible that I see on TBN.
 

alypius

Active Member
I'm genuinely wondering how Catholics, Orthodox and other non-Evangelicals understand this and how they differentiate between historical faith healers and modern ones?

If some books of the Bible have a historic character, could they provide testimony of authentic acts of healing by, say, Paul or Peter in the New Testament?
 

loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
Paul literally brought a dead man back to life and Peter healed a cripple. These clearly aren't spiritual ailments.

When Christ said we needed to be reborn some guy said did that mean we had to enter our mother’s womb again? Then there is the passage where Jesus said to let the dead bury the dead.

All depends upon ones interpretation of terms such as life, death, rebirth and crippled mentioned in the Bible.
 

Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
When Christ said we needed to be reborn some guy said did that mean we had to enter our mother’s womb again? Then there is the passage where Jesus said to let the dead bury the dead.

All depends upon ones interpretation of terms such as life, death, rebirth and crippled mentioned in the Bible.
Eutychus fell out of a window and Paul restored him.
 
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