I've never met another Christian of any kind that didn't have what they considered evidence.
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I just can't believe it.
How does a person believe in something for which they have no evidence?
How can one just believe in a god, when they have absolutely no evidence?
I don't get it.
To me, that's like one standing on the edge of a mountain, without any glider, singing, "I believe I can fly. I believe I can touch the sky. I dream about it every night and day. Spread my wings and fly away."
(Cliff picture)
Then jumps.
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. SPLAT
Is that not idiotic?
That's not faith either. It's stupidity, imo.
The Bible does not even support such an absurd idea.
If Jesus just wanted people to have faith without evidence, he would have simply walked around; looked people in the face; smiled, and said, "Hey. I'm the Messiah. Believe it. "
However, Jesus performed great signs, and used the scriptures to teach with authority, giving people evidence - reason to believe, and exercise faith. Is that not so?
So can someone help me out here. How does a person believe in a god, without evidence? I know there are quite a number of those who call themselves Christians, who think this way. Blind faith, they call it.
9Then the devil led Him to Jerusalem and set Him on the pinnacle of the temple. “If You are the Son of God,” he said, “throw Yourself down from here. 10For it is written:
‘He will command His angels concerning You
to guard You carefully; 11and they will lift You up in their hands,
so that You will not strike Your foot against a stone.’d” 12But Jesus answered, “It also says, ‘Do not put the Lord your God to the test.’e”
What evidence is there that Jesus performed signs?What "evidence" do you have for this claim?
Very nice Samantha. Are you sure you got the right guy? Did you read the OP? Because oddly enough you agree with the OP, but got your targets confused.They're not blind at all.
You're blind.
You have evidence all around you, yet you declare there isn't any evidence because it doesn't meet some kind of standard of yours.
Golly, I don't see ANY evidence of a Creator. You know, because there aren't atomic and subatomic particles, a universe, DNA for not just one life form but literally thousands or millions of unique life, and an entire world of rocks/trees/oceans/etc.
There is certainly evidence of a Creator. It's called having created things.
You can compare faith in God to jumping off a cliff all you want, but the two are not comparable. A theist loses very little for their belief aside from their materialism (which actually is the absence of something not something lost, as it is still very much possible to still accept science, but now you believe in God). However, an atheist comes to the end of their life and realizes they've spent most of it working, that they haven't done enough, that they aren't enough. They are a loser who didn't get the girl or are still living with their parents. And they are trapped in a world of no hope. So who has been talked into jumping off a cliff here? This is a very picture of being stuck on a spiritual ledge.
Btw, Jesus explicitly spoke against jumping off cliffs.
Luke 4 BSB
On these forums, there are many who claim to believe in God, but say there is no evidence. Is that not evidence-less "faith" - blind faith? One person actually told me their faith is blind, and call themselves Christian.I was just saying that I have yet to meet a person who has the kind of evidence-less faith you seem to describe in your OP. I know no-one who believes in God 'just because'.
What evidence is there that Jesus performed signs?
For one thing, about the same evidence we have that the Egyptians employed medical practices, and "magic".
Magic in Ancient Egypt
It is recorded, as with the case of all historical documents which record the practices, and events of ancient people... recorded by people who were actually there - a primary source.
They wrote things. That's what people do, evidently - write.
Can we trust what is writen?
The evidence shows we can. What evidence?
There are secondary sources, and also other sources of information which can verify those sources.
Then there is the candor of the writers, and the confirmation of much of what was thought by critics to be "made up".
To mention just a few... Hezekiah; The record on Sargon, the Assyrian; Daniel... The list is long.
Some events are confirmed also.
Then along with that there is the overall harmony related to the overall message of the collection of documents; the historical, scientific, and prophetic accuracy, that leaves no doubt as to the authenticity of the texts.... and lots more.
Giving us much evidence of the trustworthiness of the eyewitness and secondhand recordings of the accounts related to Jesus performing powerful works.
You can read more, in this document - The Miracles of Jesus - Fact or Fiction?
Does everyone need to believe it, in order for it to be evidence?
No. People don't have to believe anything, and evidence is not determined as reliable, by those who call themselves experts.
Since faith is based on evidence, to have faith one must first come to an accurate knowledge of truth, but they must also value truth. Only then will onr be motivated to exercise true faith - that is, to act in harmony with the truth.
A person who does not appreciate the truth, will reject even convincing evidence because he stubbornly holds to preconceived ideas or seeks to excuse his fleshly desires.
This is seen in the fact that eve though many saw Jesus' powerful works, they did not develop faith.
According to the Bible, faith is a product of God's spirit. Galatians 5:22
God question Ken.In principle I totally agree... but I do have one question...
What evidence did Abraham have to believe and take up his family and start heading to a destination that he didn't know about?
Are you making jokes?So your evidence that Jesus performed miracles is "Egypt".
Are you making jokes?
Can you please listen, and try for one moment to let go of trying hard to argue for your disbelief.Yes, but this are all nice stories in a book. That would be like me telling you that wooden boys exist whose nose grows when they lie.
Do you have something more than that?
Ciao
- viole
I answered, and if you read it's Egypt, then you must be joking.No I am not.
I am asking you what evidence do you have that Jesus performed miracles since your whole OP was about evidence.
I have no idea where that came from, or why you said it, except that maybe you just wanted to.Exemplary Christians would work.
So, contemporary Christians have nothing to offer themselves?
I don't understand anything you are saying here. You lost me.They disagree because they don't have evidence. Having a "smoking gun" is not always possible. So they are left to rely on testimony from eyewitness & experts. And a lost of mistakes, injustices occur because of a lack of evidence.
Because they have no evidence to support what is being claimed.
So, if there is no evidence for us today then you are left to rely on faith. OK, the OP implied this was a bad idea.
I tend to agree but you don't have to. I'd say your argument was with the OP.
And where does God say Jesus is not the messiah now?
The contents of the Bible can and do serve as evidence. I never mentioned it though, because I don't need to, as there is evidence besides what the Bible contains... which is what I had in mind.We are on page 4 and the topic has had 66 posts. I suppose someone or the other must have mentioned that the stories in scriptures cannot be taken as evidence.
.and you are not so generous in sharing? I don't want to be selfish. I want to hear from you. Can you answer my questions?Feel free to offer an example of any objective thinker who came to a conclusion that a God exists via facts and data.
True that.A picture says 1000 words.
But very few words from an alleged christian speak volumes ^_^
You also???Why would you think think there's no evidence? Why would you think faith is blind?
It's just not proven beyond doubt.
Nothing is wrong with the book. I just didn't want that to be the focus of the arguers. As there is so much more for one to see evidence of God, besides religious connections.Faith is built on the Word from God, a Message for humanity, that Message is recorded in a Book for those that did not see the Messenger while upon this Earth, the Book remains as proof.
That Word is our Faith, as the One that brought it was the first to live it.
Regards Tony
.. and what is that if you could mention?The contents of the Bible can and do serve as evidence. I never mentioned it though, because I don't need to, as there is evidence besides what the Bible contains .. which is what I had in mind.
Kindly mention some from this 'so much'.As there is so much more for one to see evidence of God, besides religious connections.
Proof of 'God', proof that this entity sent any message and proof that a particular person was the messenger. That is what is lacking in these stories.Faith is built on the Word from God, a Message for humanity, that Message is recorded in a Book for those that did not see the Messenger while upon this Earth, the Book remains as proof.
Understanding the Miracles of the BibleNot simply no evidence, but no coherent concept of what is said to be believed in, no definition appropriate to an entity with objective existence.
If you believe Jesus performed magic ─ exercised supernatural powers ─ then you accept that magic is possible and that all the other claims of all the other magicians in history are equally valid. Asklepios in ancient Greece raising the dead, or statues of Ganesha drinking milk just a couple of decades back, the roll has many, many names on it.
So why single out Jesus?