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Trinitarians will win anyway?

Psalm23

Psalm23

Well-Known Member
Conscious thoughts said:
Does not how a persons action, words and thoughts have anything to say about if this person get to heaven or not?
As long a person believe in God, they have a free pass in to heaven? :confused: Sound to easy
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I see salvation as both believing on Jesus and receiving/accepting him. I think that love for God, faith and commitment to him are intertwined. Faith may show through love. Commitment is an act of love and faith. It is not a matter of earning approval for Psalm 37:24: “ Though he fall, he shall not be utterly cast down: for the LORD upholdeth him with his hand.”
 
Teritos

Teritos

Active Member
lostwanderingsoul said:
Still does not make it a separate person.
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So someone who is sent, speaks, teaches and can be lied to is not a separate person? What then defines a person?
lostwanderingsoul said:
John 4:24 dsys that God IS a spirit not God has a spirit.
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Are you trying to say that the Father is the Holy Spirit? So does the Father send Himself?
But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and remind you of everything I have told you. John 14:26
 
Psalm23

Psalm23

Well-Known Member
Teritos said:
I don't know what you are trying to say. A Christian naturally lives a moral life.

The criminal on the cross went to paradise without doing anything, he just believed Jesus.
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Meaning if someone says they have faith in Jesus but it doesn’t show in life. Can someone believe in the mind all the right things about Jesus but not be committed to him?

I believe that the thief on the cross was saved.
 
Teritos

Teritos

Active Member
Psalm23 said:
Meaning if someone says they have faith in Jesus but it doesn’t show in life. Can someone believe in the mind all the right things about Jesus but not be committed to him?
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A serial killer believes in the Bible 5 minutes before he dies. Will he go to paradise according to the Bible? I say yes, what do you say?
 
Psalm23

Psalm23

Well-Known Member
Teritos said:
A serial killer believes in the Bible 5 minutes before he dies. Will he go to paradise according to the Bible? I say yes, what do you say?
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If he believes on Jesus and has love for Jesus in him then I believe he is saved.
 
Teritos

Teritos

Active Member
Psalm23 said:
If he believes on Jesus and has love for Jesus in him then I believe he is saved.
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Of course he is saved. Only believing in the right thing saves you. He could have believed in Allah, or Buddha, or anything else, but he chose Jesus. That alone is very remarkable. It doesn't matter what kind of life one has led, in truth all Christians are sinners, Paul himself said that. Because sin is in the flesh. No one can live as Jesus demands, every Christian often betrays Jesus. But faith and faith alone justifies the Christian.
 
Psalm23

Psalm23

Well-Known Member
Teritos said:
Of course he is saved. Only believing in the right thing saves you. He could have believed in Allah, or Buddha, or anything else, but he chose Jesus. That alone is very remarkable. It doesn't matter what kind of life one has led, in truth all Christians are sinners, Paul himself said that. Because sin is in the flesh. No one can live as Jesus demands, every Christian often betrays Jesus. But faith and faith alone justifies the Christian.
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I know someone who told me she believes pretty much what I believe about Jesus but she rejects him. In order to be saved, one must receive Jesus.

I tend to see love, faith and commitment intertwined with each other. Faith showing through love. Commitment is a form of love and can also be act of faith.

If one has faith in God, it would seem to follow that love would be there too. Hatred for God seems tied to unbelief.
 
TheWingMan

TheWingMan

Christian Evolutionist
Teritos said:
I believe that the Trinitarians will win even if the Trinity were not true. The Trinity is of course true, but assuming only that it is wrong, I would say that Trinitarians will still go to paradise. For what does the Father want to say? Does he really want to say to a Trinitarian at the end, "Wait, you believed that my only begotten Son and my Spirit are God as I am? You wicked man! To hell with you!" Never would he say that. He would love it if someone honored his beloved son and spirit like that. But what about Unitarians? If the Trinity is true, then it is a very serious sin not to believe in it, because you would be denying God His deity. Jesus himself said, "If you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins"
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I typically go to this passage: "As he is, so are we" 1 John 4:17

and also Psalms 82

Psalm 82 KJV + Strong's

The State of Hell and Heaven

The above might help a little
 
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Teritos

Teritos

Active Member
1213 said:
In Bible eternal life is promised for righteous.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23

Righteous person is loyal (faithful) to God.

... the righteous will live by faith. If he shrinks back, my soul has no pleasure in him.
Hebrews 10:38

Do you think you are loyal to God, or Jesus, if you ignore what Jesus said?

This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
John 17:3

…the Father is greater than I.
John 14:28

And also, Paul confirms what Jesus said.

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5

Can a righteous person reject what Jesus said and replace it with his own doctrines?
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You take single verses to explain the concept of God. I take the whole bible. The wisdom of God in me showd me that trinity is true. You can only see it if you have it in you too.
 
L

lostwanderingsoul

Well-Known Member
Teritos said:
So someone who is sent, speaks, teaches and can be lied to is not a separate person? What then defines a person?

Are you trying to say that the Father is the Holy Spirit? So does the Father send Himself?
But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and remind you of everything I have told you. John 14:26
Click to expand...
Yes, the Father sends his own spirit. When God's spirit lives in you, you can learn and be guided by it.
 
L

lostwanderingsoul

Well-Known Member
Teritos said:
So someone who is sent, speaks, teaches and can be lied to is not a separate person? What then defines a person?

Are you trying to say that the Father is the Holy Spirit? So does the Father send Himself?
But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and remind you of everything I have told you. John 14:26
Click to expand...
In Luke 1:35 an angel tells Mary the Holy Spirit shall come upon her and she will be overcome by the power of the Highest. This is not two separate things. The Holy Spirit IS the power of the Highest. The verse could say the Holy Spirit wil come upon you and you will be overcome by the Holy Spirit. Or it could say the power of the Highest will come upon you and you will be overcome by the power of the Highest. And the child would be the Son of God.
 
Neuropteron

Neuropteron

Active Member
Teritos said:
I believe that the Trinitarians will win even if the Trinity were not true. The Trinity is of course true, but assuming only that it is wrong, I would say that Trinitarians will still go to paradise. For what does the Father want to say? Does he really want to say to a Trinitarian at the end, "Wait, you believed that my only begotten Son and my Spirit are God as I am? You wicked man! To hell with you!" Never would he say that. He would love it if someone honored his beloved son and spirit like that. But what about Unitarians? If the Trinity is true, then it is a very serious sin not to believe in it, because you would be denying God His deity. Jesus himself said, "If you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins"
Click to expand...


Hi,
Christ promised that "the truth would set us free" The doctrine of the Trinity is the opposite of the truth.
Jehovah allows "an operation of error" to go to persons who prefer falsehood "that they may get to believing the lie" rather than the good news about Jesus Christ.

Since the father of the lie is Satan, believing and following it can never be of any benefit to us.
 
C

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
Teritos said:
I believe that the Trinitarians will win even if the Trinity were not true. The Trinity is of course true, but assuming only that it is wrong, I would say that Trinitarians will still go to paradise. For what does the Father want to say? Does he really want to say to a Trinitarian at the end, "Wait, you believed that my only begotten Son and my Spirit are God as I am? You wicked man! To hell with you!" Never would he say that. He would love it if someone honored his beloved son and spirit like that. But what about Unitarians? If the Trinity is true, then it is a very serious sin not to believe in it, because you would be denying God His deity. Jesus himself said, "If you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins"
Click to expand...

The Jewish faith went from polytheism, spinning off Christianity and Muslim religion, including trinitarians. If they made a few extra Gods, they'd have circled their faith back to the beginning.
 
C

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
Neuropteron said:
Hi,
Christ promised that "the truth would set us free" The doctrine of the Trinity is the opposite of the truth.
Jehovah allows "an operation of error" to go to persons who prefer falsehood "that they may get to believing the lie" rather than the good news about Jesus Christ.

Since the father of the lie is Satan, believing and following it can never be of any benefit to us.
Click to expand...

Obviously one Christian group snipes at another (talking about falsehoods). Surely this is not the way God taught us to treat his children and loyal supporters.
 
C

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
Psalm23 said:
I see salvation as both believing on Jesus and receiving/accepting him. I think that love for God, faith and commitment to him are intertwined. Faith may show through love. Commitment is an act of love and faith. It is not a matter of earning approval for Psalm 37:24: “ Though he fall, he shall not be utterly cast down: for the LORD upholdeth him with his hand.”
Click to expand...

In ceremonies, they eat the pretend flesh and drink the pretend blood of Jesus. But, that's more like salivation than salvation.
 
C

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
Teritos said:
I don't know what you are trying to say. A Christian naturally lives a moral life.

The criminal on the cross went to paradise without doing anything, he just believed Jesus.
Click to expand...

Jesus said that if you believe in him, you'll have eternal life (not life in heaven). Belief, alone, is not enough to get into heaven. Otherwise, a lot of murderers and rapists would be in heaven, and that would make it hell.
 
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