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Historicity of Jesus

lukethethird

unknown member
A human has to ask which son of God was man a baby created as a God by human sex? As human men call their baby boys sons.

Gods he says.

So is God by your human man say so a man?

No he says a God.

Yet you say as a theist human thinker he him his men with penis terms the God?

Yes men are gods in other words.

Science says O earth sealed as the God of Satan was once the burning O body once hell. God of Satan the seal.

Heavens gases released mountain volcano.

O God one all heritage strings. Strings of humans science practices. No human anywhere in science terms God of human inferred science.

As we are not stone.
As we are not volcanic mass.
As we are not gases out of volcanic mass.

Why science said hence no man is God.

A science statement.

Men of gods science human said no man is God.

But if a satanist said humans began not as a human but an evil burning image theoried about then non humane scientists would be established.

Why biologist human science said a living healthy monkey is our closest human living bio.life comparison. Science.

Science a human theist for human safety.

As gods gases highest form keeping life safe not us human is the immaculate clear gases balanced burning sacrificed natural light by three holy bodies.

A status immaculate of gods it's birthed inherited spirit. Not any man.

Men describing all details however.

Cold space voiding womb vacuum.
Presence immaculate gas spirit.
Voiding of its sacrifice.

As space is a void naturally.
As immaculate cold clear is in balance with its burning to produce light
Voiding is an action.

Action holy three in science terms.

Holy three in science human present human stated. Human science.

Two days ago living in a new area once again I saw a smaller silver ping.

My girlfriend today her husband awoke last night went outside as it was brighter alight. Saw a pulsing silvery web with UFO.

Said he felt very strange and concerned. They own their own beliefs about UFO. I don't bother to argue.

Bible story said night turned into day.
Never however said and the day became hotter as it already was alight burning.

You have to be living to describe night sky and you have to witness it's burning to document it.

What Satanists don't advise you.
As Satanists delve into the paranormal and claim it good.

Science hence was given a holy title of just human advice for humans. Stating why no man was gods son.

Theoretic God O earth inheritor immaculate gas mass a body.

Human egotism comparing self presence terms of human expressions in scientific evaluations false.

Satanists want man to be a God. As human science theme as equals to each spirit given a name as just it's spirit.

Equals named equals the name science gave the gas. No human.

Why no man is gods spirits.

We are bio humans surviving in water oxygenated heavens held to the ground by space pressure.

So when human father memories state crystal mass origins with immaculate space earth pressures was formed above ground first but was combusted off the face of earth.

It was a warning about why space owned natural pressures that owned any formation.

The UFO removes water as pressure in space as pressure is proven changed.

If a human was locked inside an empty shell UFO mass on ground where we live then if abducted by void vacuum cooling would pass with the UFO into burning gas light.

Humans would fall out of the sky we don't fly.

Those types of scenarios a lot of humans don't even consider.

I also know that human life is safe as we make correct choices from advice human.

AI wandering human image recorded and every other image recorded. Moving atmospheric. Burning cooling transmitting re recording cooling transmitting.

Human mind affected is never in thesis agreed as a self just a human. By wandering recorded feedback not human.

The reason advised psychic human by causes. Natural human. Spiritual human affected by phenomena advised in experience.

First scientist just a human. A spiritual human. A healthy human. A higher conscious aware human. Not elite just an everyday human destroyer.

As per Bible warned and stated.

Mind defect by science causes

Known and pre proven human advice. Why theists human consciousness are possessed by a non belief of just being a human.
Nock it off.
 

oldbadger

Skanky Old Mongrel!
“First, however, I must deal with the matter of Jesus, the so-called savior, who not long ago taught new doctrines and was thought to be a son of God. This savior, I shall attempt to show, deceived many and caused them to accept a form of belief harmful to the well-being of mankind. Taking its root in the lower classes, the religion continues to spread among the vulgar: nay, one can even say it spreads because of its vulgarity and the illiteracy of its adherents. And while there are a few moderate, reasonable, and intelligent people who interpret its beliefs allegorically, yet it thrives in its purer form among the ignorant.”
― Celsus, On the True Doctrine: A Discourse Against the Christians

Celsus (/ˈsɛlsəs/; Hellenistic Greek: Κέλσος, Kélsos; fl. AD 175–177) was a 2nd-century Greek philosopher and opponent of early Christianity.
Celsus is one of my favourite enemies of Jesus, because he can even tell us a little more about the disciples than any others.

Thankyou for that evidence for Jesus.
 

oldbadger

Skanky Old Mongrel!
  • Marcionism – Christ was a purely spiritual entity
  • Nestorianism – Jesus and Christ were two different entities
  • Docetism – Jesus appeared physical, but he was really incorporeal
  • Apollinarism – Jesus had a human body and human soul, but a divine mind
  • Arianism- Jesus was the son of God, not God himself
  • Catholicism – Jesus was fully human and fully divine, both God and the son of God

Perfect examples of critics believing in a real Jesus. Only Marcion insists that Jesus was not real.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
CH gases that arose named by human men in science. Gases non speaking mass didn't say to a Human please name me Christ.

Science as humans named all things.

Another con God a man named everything.

Why are you god should be asked of science theist? A human. Answer my words named all things status ownership false.

I wanted to remove my life by time shifting method. Actually.

Instead of anti Christ you should read how it was inferred anti man human.

So Christ is first.

Then you ask men hence if you then say Jesus what would Jesus Christ mean?

We sacrificed the only god spirit born from earth!!!!!!

Reasoning natural light not the immaculate.
Gods owned spirit body history.

Why would you say you owned it?

Status ownership humans greatest lie.

I was supported by its presence. The real teaching. By mass body presence.

Who took over owning God by mens ideals it's products its jewels the nature food and then said I own it all now you pay me! To other humans.

Groups of men did.

So if men said God is an alien and you are a human wasn't that men in science advice?

What of God alienated itself from one first? Answer....Radiation X mass.

Where did it go? Sucked out into space as space pressure equalled held by space pressure the core metal heart.

Space opened space took it.

What happened.

It went through burning gases heated in atmosphere so extra water was needed oxygen etc to stop burning cooling on other side of heavens in space so it drops into deep space.

What happens when turbulence changes cooling? You get to see it cooling before it drops out. Dangerous if it comes forward as metal would fall onto our heads.

Can come in two variations forward burning or cooled. God and space womb natural laws.

Was gods all the time humans aren't a metal. Burnt Christ body one mass removed explained anti cause. To have something complete removed.

To remove you cannot say Christ will remove Christ can you scientist.

The machine in the beginning began as dusts in conversion.
In the end the machine X mass was returned to its man designer.

Bible warning no man was God the product. Or bodies of God in mass.

Lesson never change God.
 

lukethethird

unknown member
What about Jesus the brother of James that people called messiah as mentioned exactly the same way by Josephus?
Interpretation, context, metaphor, contradiction all come in to play. An historical Jesus behind the myth is not easy to come by which is why literary scholars can't agree as to who this Jesus was.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
Interpretation, context, metaphor, contradiction all come in to play. An historical Jesus behind the myth is not easy to come by which is why literary scholars can't agree as to who this Jesus was.

Its not about "who" Jesus was. I am referring to Josephus reporting of a man named James, brother of Jesus people called Messiah.

There is nothing to interpret here, no other context necessary, its not a metaphor, there are no contradictions, its just plain historical report. He is not calling Jesus Messiah, he is just saying "people called him Messiah" and if you know the times people had one name and were referred to by the town or someones name or some designation. So he is just giving a reference to the name.

By the way, there are many messiah claimants mentioned in Josephus and the antiquities, not only Jesus.

There are some passages in Josephus that are forged, but I am not referring to them.

Read Josephus antiquities, chapter 9, "Festus was now dead, and Albinus was but upon the road; so he assembled the sanhedrim of judges, and brought before them the brother of Jesus,who was called Christ, whose name was James, and some others"
 

lukethethird

unknown member
Its not about "who" Jesus was. I am referring to Josephus reporting of a man named James, brother of Jesus people called Messiah.

There is nothing to interpret here, no other context necessary, its not a metaphor, there are no contradictions, its just plain historical report. He is not calling Jesus Messiah, he is just saying "people called him Messiah" and if you know the times people had one name and were referred to by the town or someones name or some designation. So he is just giving a reference to the name.

By the way, there are many messiah claimants mentioned in Josephus and the antiquities, not only Jesus.

There are some passages in Josephus that are forged, but I am not referring to them.

Read Josephus antiquities, chapter 9, "Festus was now dead, and Albinus was but upon the road; so he assembled the sanhedrim of judges, and brought before them the brother of Jesus,who was called Christ, whose name was James, and some others"
Read in context it appears that the reference is to Jesus, the son of Damneus and his brother, James.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
Read in context it appears that the reference is to Jesus, the son of Damneus and his brother, James.

Nope. Thats a completely different Jesus. There are many Jesus's which is a common name, but only one is specifically mentioned as Tu legomenos christu. One. Thats before this Jesus the son of Damneus who was the successor of Jesus the son of Gamaliel.
 

lukethethird

unknown member
Nope. Thats a completely different Jesus. There are many Jesus's which is a common name, but only one is specifically mentioned as Tu legomenos christu. One. Thats before this Jesus the son of Damneus who was the successor of Jesus the son of Gamaliel.
Would you say that you are certain as to how this passage is to be interpreted?
 

lukethethird

unknown member
I can say fairly certain. Unless you can give another "interpretation" for that simple sentence Tu Legomenos Christu.
'Festus was now dead, and Albinus was but upon the road; so he assembled the sanhedrin of judges, and brought before them the brother of Jesus, who was called Christ, whose name was James, and some others;'

Reading the above Josephus passage it appears that James is being called Christ. Christ means 'annointed' so it could be that either the Jesus or the James named above was an annointed priest.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
'Festus was now dead, and Albinus was but upon the road; so he assembled the sanhedrin of judges, and brought before them the brother of Jesus, who was called Christ, whose name was James, and some others;'

Reading the above Josephus passage it appears that James is being called Christ. Christ means 'annointed' so it could be that either the Jesus or the James named above was an annointed priest.
Not necessarily so. Sometimes the way something is said can be ambiguous and have more than one possible interpretation. The two possibilities are:
1. the BROTHER of Jesus who is called the Christ and
2, Jesus, who is called the Christ.

It is clear from the book of James and other historical documents that speak of James that James did not consider himself to be the Messiah, but taught that his brother Jesus was the Messiah. Therefore the quote should be read as saying Jesus is called the Christ, not James.
 

lukethethird

unknown member
Not necessarily so. Sometimes the way something is said can be ambiguous and have more than one possible interpretation. The two possibilities are:
1. the BROTHER of Jesus who is called the Christ and
2, Jesus, who is called the Christ.

It is clear from the book of James and other historical documents that speak of James that James did not consider himself to be the Messiah, but taught that his brother Jesus was the Messiah. Therefore the quote should be read as saying Jesus is called the Christ, not James.
Can you quote James saying that he is the brother of Jesus?
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Can you quote James saying that he is the brother of Jesus?
The book of James does not say this. However, we know it to be true from other sources, including the Josephus quote. Even the new testament describes James as the brother of Jesus.

Galatians 1
18 Then after three years I did go up to Jerusalem to visit Cephas and stayed with him fifteen days; 19 but I did not see any other apostle except James the Lord’s brother.

Is there something about this that bothers you?
 

lukethethird

unknown member
The book of James does not say this. However, we know it to be true from other sources, including the Josephus quote. Even the new testament describes James as the brother of Jesus.
Yes, and the NT states that Jesus' brothers were not believers. gJohn 7:5 Not even his brothers believed in him. No where in the New Testament are Jesus's brothers portrayed as believers, not in the gospels nor in Acts of the Apostles.

Galatians 1
18 Then after three years I did go up to Jerusalem to visit Cephas and stayed with him fifteen days; 19 but I did not see any other apostle except James the Lord’s brother.

Is there something about this that bothers you?
Actually, Paul calls James the 'brother of the Lord' in the oldest manuscripts and it is unclear what Paul means by that. Paul refers to brother or brothers dozens of times as a term given to believers in every other case. Peter, James, and John were disciples according to the gopels, and neither of the disciples named James were brothers of Jesus, so why should we interpret Paul to mean a literal sibling of Jesus when refering to James, the brother of the Lord? Especially since Jesus's brothers were not believers.

I don't have a problem with an historical Jesus or an historical Jesus having a brother named James, but I do have a problem with the contradictions that arise when people interpret Paul and Josephus the way they do. I can't prove that Jesus was an historical figure but I'm not going to interpret Paul and Josephus in such a way that contradicts everything we read in the gospels and Acts just to pretend that I can prove that there was an historical Jesus. Jesus's brothers were unbelivers and so far I am not convinced otherwise.
 
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