And if it wasn't for the variant that arose *after* the vaccine came out, we would not need masks again.
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Why the angst when
- Thread starter Evangelicalhumanist
- Start date
And if it wasn't for the variant that arose *after* the vaccine came out, we would not need masks again.
It's better to follow the facts.
Please continue thinking. It's a good exampe for the rest of us.
Kind of sucks when people don't do what is required for the optimistic estimates to become true, huh?
So, we 'deflate expert testimony' by not following their advice and complaining things went worse than expected? Really?
stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
firedragon
Veteran Member
So you found an opportunity in some episode to bring up religion and make some comments about it.
Did you just make that up or did you study "religion" in order to make this case? Can you provide evidence?
Brian2
Veteran Member
The media likes to do stuff like that.
Wandering Monk
Well-Known Member
That would be equivalent to everyone who was died in WWII.
Yes, early on in the pandemic, the advice given was different than it is today. Let me try to explain -- this is the result of LEARNING NEW THINGS about a novel (that means "new") coronavirus. Sometimes, when we learn new things, they are different than what we knew before. I hope that doesn't overly confuse either of you.
Yes, well I was being facetious.
stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
No, that does not overly confuse me, that is very clear
Something else is now also very clear. This just means that I am smarter than those scientists, because I could clearly see they made mistakes there. I just could not imagine that they made such huge mistakes. I need to accept the fact (proven now) that I am way smarter than them when it comes to this kind of knowledge.
Daemon Sophic
Avatar in flux
Sooooo…. You knew back in March 2020 the vaccine would come out and be highly effective both against the alpha strain of Covid as well as mutant strains that would come out later?
Also you knew that an overly large portion of the population would be willfully resistant to getting the protective vaccination and therefore act as a gigantic culture medium for growing variants like the Delta strain, which is even more infectious than the alpha variant?
And you knew that the vaccine, while being protective against even the Delta variant, would still be unaccepted by a large portion of the purposely mislead and gullible portion of the population in the United States; leading to a higher than normal infection and death rate compared to other nations in the late summer of 2021? And because of the folly of this naïve section of the population, for their own safety, the rest of us would be asked to return to wearing masks, since the scientists had not accounted for the unbelievable fear and gullibility of the naïve?
Wow! You are amazing!
There are problems with science....
1) It doesn't have all the answers.
2) Answers take time.
3) There are mistakes & corrections.
4) It has been ignored & misused by politicians.
So people reject science in favor of...uh....
What's the better alternative?
It appears to be personal feeling & impression.
They Spurned the Vaccine. Now They Want You to Know They Regret It.
Excerpted (underlining added)...
PROVO, Utah — As Mindy Greene spent another day in the Covid intensive care unit, listening to the whirring machines that now breathed for her 42-year-old husband, Russ, she opened her phone and tapped out a message.
“We did not get the vaccine,” she wrote on Facebook. “I read all kinds of things about the vaccine and it scared me. So I made the decision and prayed about it and got the impression that we would be ok.”
They were not.
Her husband, the father to their four children, was now hovering between life and death, tentacles of tubes spilling from his body. The patient in the room next to her husband’s had died hours earlier. That day, July 13, Ms. Greene decided to add her voice to an unlikely group of people speaking out in the polarized national debate over vaccination: The remorseful.
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stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Yes, amazes me even
Nothing was known about COVID. As we learned, information was revised. Many forums banned any talk about COVID, fearing dissemination of false info that could harm people or deter them from vaccines. Suspending free press (and other Constitutional freedoms) is not necessary. A political leader is supposed to use facts, logic, and, most of all, charisma, to make changes. For example, JFK didn't ask "why go to the moon," he asked "why not." He had the charisma to convince a nation, and the world gained a great deal of knowledge from the attempt and achievement (flat screen cameras and rocketry, for example).
Hillary Clinton and Biden want internet bans, while Trump is still miffed that his ill-informed posts got him banned (following an angry mob storming Congress at his behest). I don't think that injecting lysol into our veins is the right idea to eliminate COVID. Nor does pushing bacterial cure for a viral infection (hydroxychloroquine), until it is vetted through the FDA without using political pull to force it to be vetted.
Shakeel
Well-Known Member
Okay, but everybody knew that all along, right? I must be missing something here.
ecco
Veteran Member
For some people, it is really hard to understand. It must be so confusing to them to accept that science learns and science changes its recommendations based on new knowledge.
Imagine if that kind of process were applied to the Bible? One day they would be saying that the earth was created 6000 years ago. Then they would be saying the earth was created millions of years ago. There wouldn't even be any consensus. People reading the same few verses would argue about when the earth really was created. Phew. It's good that nonsense like that can never happen with God's Unchanging Word!
ecco
Veteran Member
Once again you get a Gold Star for being right! We were told that if we got vaccinated we would be 94% safe from getting infected by the Covid virus. The experts in virology believed people would be rational and figure a 6% chance of getting infected was much better than a 94% chance and all people would get vaccinated. However, the experts in virology are not experts in human nature. They are also not experts in politics.
They didn't take into account that state governors would immediately lift all restrictions. They didn't take into account the many people who resisted getting inoculated.
When they saw what was happening, they changed the guidance once again.
Now, if I had been in charge, no restrictions would have been lifted until 95% of the population was fully vaccinated. The unvaccinated would have quickly found out what public pressure meant. Imagine the rath of millions of business owners knowing they cannot reopen their business until all the idiots came around? Imagine, once we got to 85% vaccinated, publishing the names, addresses, and phone numbers of the remaining 15%.
ecco
Veteran Member
It probably has mutated into several less harmful variations just as it has mutated into several more harmful variations.
So what. The less harmful variations die out relatively quickly. The more harmful variations make more bodies (humans) available for breeding and mutating.
In 1918 there were less than two billion people in the world. Today it is eight billion. In 1918, excepting for the war, few people traveled very far. Today it is literally one world.
More hosts, more contacts.
The "Spanish Flu" took 75 million lives. With today's population that comes to 300,000,000. We're only at 4 million now. Should just sit back and let Covid do its thing?
Wandering Monk
Well-Known Member
The 94% effectiveness against infection rates were against the Alpha variant. Israeli studies show 39% against Delta. Israel and the US used the same protocols for the Pfizer vaccine: 3 weeks between doses.
The UK used a different protocol: 8 to 12 weeks between doses for Pfizer. BUT their effectiveness against infection rates are nearly 90%.
The UK used a different protocol: 8 to 12 weeks between doses for Pfizer. BUT their effectiveness against infection rates are nearly 90%.