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Jewish interpretation of Ezekiel 37:24, please

rosends

Well-Known Member
That was a question asking you what you think. Thank you for answering. As I said, I went to synagogue for many years, never once heard anything about Ezekiel and his prophecies. I won't go any further with this now. Thank you.
Did you ever go on the holiday of Shavuot? Or on shabbat during the intermediate days of Pesach? Or on the shabbat when they read the portion of Tetzaveh? There are a number of weeks on which parts of Ezekiel are read
https://ffoz.org/downloads/files/Torah_Portions_5781.pdf
 

RabbiO

הרב יונה בן זכריה
Certainly better than the KJV.
Mechon Mamre uses the old (1917) Jewish Publication Society translation. It is used because the copyright on the translation lapsed and it is now in the public domain. If I remember correctly the Hertz Chumash uses the translation as well, with Rabbi Hertz offering his own translation, in the notes, in those instances where he felt the JPS fell short in some regard.
 
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Rival

Si m'ait Dieus
Staff member
Premium Member
Mechon Mamre uses the old (1917) Jewish Publication Society translation. It is used because the copyright on the translation lapsed and it is now in the public domain. If I remember correctly the Hertz Chumash uses the translation as well, with Rabbi Hertz offering his own translation, in the notes, in those instances where he felt the JPS fell short in some regard.
It does, with minor changes where necessary iirc. I own it but am too half dead in bed right now to double check.

Edit: I checked, it does use the JPS 1917.
 
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BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
I would appreciate how a Jew well trained in the scriptures interprets Ezekiel 37:24 which says: (King James Version) - "And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, and do them."
No arguments here, just would like some sort of authoritative answer from a person well versed possibly in Judaism, or Jewish thought and interpretation. Thank you. My question is: how would David be servant over the Jews?

David is the servant of God.

David and other OT patriarchs will resurrect to live in the Millennium that was prophesied.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
David is the servant of God.

David and other OT patriarchs will resurrect to live in the Millennium that was prophesied.
Just wondering, do you consider yourself "well versed [...] in [...] Jewish thought" as the OP wrote?
 

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
David (s) means beloved of God, and that is one of the titles of Mohammad (s) (habeeballah).

To me, perhaps this is saying "The beloved of God, my servant..." and is about the Mahdi.
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
Just wondering, do you consider yourself "well versed [...] in [...] Jewish thought" as the OP wrote?

No, as a Jew who reads an entire book of Jewish scriptures that you don't read--and as one who sees Messiah in the scriptures you don't understand--I'm not well versed.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
No, as a Jew who reads an entire book of Jewish scriptures that you don't read--and as one who sees Messiah in the scriptures you don't understand--I'm not well versed.
So in your view, Jewish thought narrows down to the Bible?
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
No, as a Jew who reads an entire book of Jewish scriptures that you don't read--and as one who sees Messiah in the scriptures you don't understand--I'm not well versed.
To be honest, BB, I wanted the Jewish (not Christian Jew type thing or what they call Messianic Jew) understanding of this. But thanks for offering your opinion.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
It does, with minor changes where necessary iirc. I own it but am too half dead in bed right now to double check.

Edit: I checked, it does use the JPS 1917.
I check sometimes online with the mechon mamre translation -
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Did you ever go on the holiday of Shavuot? Or on shabbat during the intermediate days of Pesach? Or on the shabbat when they read the portion of Tetzaveh? There are a number of weeks on which parts of Ezekiel are read
https://ffoz.org/downloads/files/Torah_Portions_5781.pdf
Yes, we (my family and I) went to synagogue regularly and observed some of the holidays. I went along with them until I went to college in another area and stopped regular attendance at a synagogue. Neither my mother nor father understood Hebrew, so they joined a reform synagogue.. I was not well versed in the Bible at that time, although I would read it at home but did not understand it much at all (in English, of course), and neither was the congregation taught much about it. There were formalities and rituals observed there on a regular basis, including recitation from the siddur we chanted from, but I remember the holidays such as Purim when we dressed up in costumes. Played games. Since I didn't (and still do not for the most part) understand Hebrew (neither did my parents and relatives who went to that synagogue), anything said in Hebrew beyond the Shema was not understood by me, and little was said in Hebrew. I studied more about Judaism and the Talmud after those years. Of course, in English. So if Ezekiel and its interpretation of that verse about David was read, I don't remember it. The books themselves were never discussed at length, and as I said, Ezekiel as well as Isaiah were like foreigners to me. David -- yes, I knew about David. Also Saul. And Daniel. But not Ezekiel.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Well, to begin with, we wouldn't normally use the KJV.
OK, I quoted from that because I think it's a good translation, although old English. I do not always use the KJV but felt it was close enough for this discussion. Can you quote in English a translation closer to your understanding of the scripture?
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
OK, I quoted from that because I think it's a good translation, although old English. I do not always use the KJV but felt it was close enough for this discussion. Can you quote in English a translation closer to your understanding of the scripture?
I brought two examples here:
One possibility:
"And My servant David shall be king over them, and they all shall have one shepherd; they shall also walk in Mine ordinances, and observe My statutes, and do them." (Mechon Mamre)
Another:
"My servant David shall be king over them; there shall be one shepherd for all of them. They shall follow My rules and faithfully obey My laws." (Sefaria)

As far as I can tell, the variances between the translations in this verse's case aren't critical, but we do make it a point to not use the Christian translations in any case. I mean, why would we?
The differences are not significant in this case, but as there are significant differences elsewhere, Jews tend to prefer Jewish translations over the KJV and other non-Jewish translations.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
I brought two examples here:

The differences are not significant in this case, but as there are significant differences elsewhere, Jews tend to prefer Jewish translations over the KJV and other non-Jewish translations.
And I would think, under the circumstances, that is right. Just like Catholics consider their approved translations correct also.
 

BilliardsBall

Veteran Member
So in your view, Jewish thought narrows down to the Bible?

No, in my thought, you are ignoring a large volume of Jewish thought--the most important thoughts a person can think.

I remember my revulsion at the thought of becoming a follower of Yeshua. But it was worth all the tsuris.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
No, in my thought, you are ignoring a large volume of Jewish thought--the most important thoughts a person can think.
I was thinking more in the direction of מורה נבוכים, כוזרי, הקדמות הרמב"ם למשנה, כתבי הראי"ה, דרשות הר"ן, etc, but sure, whatever you say.
צורית? I'm guessing you probably meant צרות, which could be transliterated as tzarot, tzaros, tzorot or tzoros.
I don't know why you bother with this Jewishy shtick stuff. We're talking about a culture that developed from an anti-Christian mindset, over a period of nearly 2000 years of people doing their best to ward off Christian influence. One of the reasons Yiddish was even developed. It's a culture that really has nothing to do with you.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
I was thinking more in the direction of מורה נבוכים, כוזרי, הקדמות הרמב"ם למשנה, כתבי הראי"ה, דרשות הר"ן, etc, but sure, whatever you say.

צורית? I'm guessing you probably meant צרות, which could be transliterated as tzarot, tzaros, tzorot or tzoros.
I don't know why you bother with this Jewishy shtick stuff. We're talking about a culture that developed from an anti-Christian mindset, over a period of nearly 2000 years of people doing their best to ward off Christian influence. One of the reasons Yiddish was even developed. It's a culture that really has nothing to do with you.
If I understood BB correctly, it seems he was saying he was Jewish without belief in Jesus as the Messiah and later came to believe something else. Not sure, though, maybe he can say to set things straight in that area, though. Meantime, maybe back to how a traditionally Jewish person would interpret that scripture in Ezekiel. But I do think I got enough answers. Since this can become contentious in reference to that scripture, I won't continue in this thread. Maybe another thread.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
If I understood BB correctly, it seems he was saying he was Jewish without belief in Jesus as the Messiah and later came to believe something else. Not sure, though, maybe he can say to set things straight in that area, though
I definitely got that. It's just not what my question was about.
But anyway, back to the topic at hand.
 
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