nPeace
Veteran Member
Just like having a head... but having a big head, is the problem.
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Ego
- Thread starter nPeace
- Start date
nPeace
Veteran Member
No, not really.
What do you mean?
I was not asking myself. What made you assume I was.
It's a thread open to everyone.
If I wanted to know something, I was not sure of, I would PM, @Deeje, @Hockeycowboy, @URAVIP2ME, and a few others, and ask them, because I trust them to give me a correct answer, based on more than their own thinking.
Can you give an example of what you mean, with regard to how it affects others and to what degree?
Any reason why you singled out my ego?
Understood. So I think you are agreeing that it's a good thing to ask someone how you are doing in this matter, especially if no one mentions it to you. Am I right?
Thanks.
nPeace
Veteran Member
So you are saying this based on your belief that there is no one way, or one God. Am I right?
However, are you also saying that stating certain facts that someone disagrees with, or thinks it's wrong to say, is pride, or egotism?
I disagree, as there is a difference between boasting and stating a fact, and it's dependent on the circumstances, or context.
nPeace
Veteran Member
Thanks.
I totally agree 100%. To feel you are worth more as a human being, is to think that you deserve what the other person does not.
That is to decide that someone is unworthy, and we do not decide that.
Jesus shed blood is the price that brought persons, so he decides people's worth. Not us.
Why is feeling morally superior to others arrogance.
A feels proud that his way of life is not deplorable. A feels proud that his way of life is superior to decadent society. Why is A's view of their esteem arrogance?
Someone praises A for living their life different to the world, and commends A. Why should A not feel proud about their worth, as one not living as the world does... but keeping themselves chaste?
If there is nothing to measure up to, how does one know their worth (not human worth), in regard to good and bad, right and wrong?
nPeace
Veteran Member
Does that fear have a root cause?
Fallen Prophet
Well-Known Member
I believe that fear and pride go hand in hand.
We can overcome our fear by being humble.
I am not saying that. I am saying nobody can decide superiority, and to feel one can is arrogance.
One is free to believe that to the best of his her knowledge this or that is the correct set of facts or the correct way of life. But one cannot say one's life or belief system is superior simply he or she believes it to be true. That is simply hubris. Everyone believes that which he believes to be true. It would be laughable if that makes every person on earth feel his way of life and path and belief to be superior to others.
One simply should not go around comparing and ranking each other's beliefs and lives in terms of superiority and inferiority. Focus on what you are doing, not what others are doing.
joe1776
Well-Known Member
That most of us are morally superior to serial killers is a fact. But when Christians feel morally superior to atheists, there's no evidence to support their position. It's this group of Christians, maybe 10%, that earns the negative stereotype for their group: sanctimonious Christians.
About the same 10% of atheists are afflicted with a similar problem. Their claim is that, as a group, they are smarter than Christians. They earn the negative stereotype for their group: arrogant atheists.
It's my position that ten percent of both groups are highly arrogant and earn the negative stereotypes for their groups.
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Psychologists use the term "ego" differently, with a different definition.
https://www.simplypsychology.org/psyche.html
Link above: "According to Freud psychoanalytic theory, the id is the primitive and instinctual part of the mind that contains sexual and aggressive drives and hidden memories, the super-ego operates as a moral conscience, and the ego is the realistic part that mediates between the desires of the id and the super-ego."
There is a connection to everything (to be one with the universe). Thus, there is a connection between ego and kindness (kind to help someone to see things our way).
It is possible to be angry at a situation and not at a person.
We must not judge others, but some angry people judge others. Yet, if we don't judge Satan, we might accidentally follow Satan. For example, if we don't judge the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan as Satanic (as the bible insists that they are), we can't ask others to stop fighting.
wellwisher
Well-Known Member
The human psyche has two centers of consciousness, the inner self and the ego. The inner self is much older and is connected to DNA and natural instinct. The consciousness of natural animals is based on the inner self. The lion or wolf in the wild are driven by their inner self mediating instincts as they interact with the environment.
The ego center is much newer in terms of history and is only found in humans. Animals do not have an ego. However, domesticated animals can develop a virtual ego, programmed by the ego of the owner. The owner may treat their little dog, like a baby, and the dog will learn to play this role; virtual ego, apart from its own natural instincts. Dogs can be trained to be service dogs to the blind via a virtual ego.
The human ego or the true secondary center in humans appears to have formed within the human brain near the beginning of civilization. It allowed for choices that were different from eons of previous instinctive behavior associated with eons of migratory herding and gathering.
Adam and Eve symbolically developed the first human egos. The bible dates the ego at about 6000 years. They were the first two modern humans in the sense of having two stable centers of consciousness and not just one like all the other natural animals in paradise. The first two humans of the bible were not about human DNA, and the human inner self, which is over a million years old. The ego, as a secondary center, is able to make choices apart from the inner self and instinct. Civilization required new choices and the will to make such choices apart from instinct.
Adam and Eve were the only two people in the bible not formed via DNA and biological means. They were created from the outside, instead of from the inside via DNA and fertilized ovum. Jesus was from a fertilized ovum using Mary's DNA. This symbolism was the ancient way of distinguishing the new ego center as being different from the biological inner self. The New Testament calls the difference the inner and outer man. The inner man is formed from DNA; tree of life, while the outer man is more of a cultural induction; from the outside; tree of knowledge. Many religions attempt to sacrifice the ego, so one can become united as an inner self. The inner self is way better, since it has access to a much higher percent of the brain; higher human potential.
If you were to map the human psyche, starting on the surface of a person, their outermost psyche begins with the persona, which is the mask of the ego. The persona is what you show strangers; your dress, attitude, etc. Decorations like tattoos, makeup, body piercing and now even gender are part of the mask of the ego. One is often pigeon holed, by causal acquaintances, based on this mask of the ego, since many people think the mask is the entire ego, since this is the data they can see in others.
Below the mask or persona is the ego proper. The ego proper, is the real ego. This can be seen by those who are close to you. They can see the you below the mask. A mother can see through the mask of her high profile celebrity child, and see the ego proper of that little boy or girl that hides below that social mask. Below the ego proper, also connected to the ego, is the personal unconscious. This is a collection of all our unique memories, that entered our brain through our sensory systems, or were induced through the imagination and thinking; personal memories. The personal unconscious can include memories which may be forgotten or repressed. These can be retrieved with hypnosis.
Below the personal unconscious of the ego, is the shadow. The shadow is the interface between the conscious and collective unconscious minds and it begins where the ego ends. Freud called the shadow the id, since the shadow is often how the unconscious mind beyond the ego, becomes conscious to the ego. Like a shadow, the shadow follows the ego around.
As an analogy, the light of the sun will illuminate an object while also casting a shadow that follows and reflects the movement and shape of the object. The inner self is symbolic of the sun, that shines on the ego; source of its energy, making a shadow in the process. The shadow provides a barrier to the even deeper layers of the unconscious, so the ego, via will and choice, does not mess with the programming and create bugs. The nightmare will often reach consciousness via the shadow.
Below the shadow, as we go even deeper, are the archetypes of the collective unconscious. This is where the ego ends and where ollective human propensity begins; human nature. The archetypes are similar to personality firmware, connected to our human DNA, which define us as a species. We are all human because of this firmware, with similar propensities that define us as a unique species.
There are three basic levels of archetypes. These levels are staggered in males and females. The staggering is designed so they can mesh like gears and complement each other; the team becomes more than the sum of its parts. Falling in love causes the gears to attempt to mesh so the male and female can cross program each other until "us" appears. Falling in love can be scary, since the ego can lose control as the inner selves, dance and download data, through an ego choice interface; bugs can appear. Without the ego this cross programming would be much more efficient.
The lowest level firmware are connected to natural male and female instinct. When one falls in love or desire, the spontaneous passion comes from this firmware. Males are more visual, while females are more verbal. This will be reflected in this firmware and exchanged via cross programming.
The next level are firmware of relationship. This level of firmware is based on how things relate to each other. One does not need understand how and why things relate, to observe that they relate in a certain way. We know that Santa Claus has a white beard and a red suit and comes on Christmas Eve. This is how Santa relates within western culture. The whys of these details are not part of the middle level firmware.
Conformity to traditions is instinctively driven by the middle level firmware. Music is based on how the sounds of the instruments, voices and lyrics relate. It is not about the whys. The arts, in general, come from the middle level firmware. This level of firmware is very creative since it can shuffled and then relates things in new ways; innovation. A new song has not logic in terms of how all things relate but it can have an impact on our emotions.
The upper level firmware are firmware of meaning. These firmware are connected to understanding why things are as they are. Reason and intuition are both connected to this level of firmware. The middle level firmware allows us to can see how the planets and sun relate in the sky each year. The upper level firmware seek str explain how and why this occurs; science. But even science uses middle level firmware, to relative variables to other variables when proof is lacking; dark energy and primordial atom.
Below the upper level firmware is the inner self. The inner self uses the firmware to help process and cyclically exercise all the natural needs of the human animal. The ego, through willpower and choice, acts like a wild card. It is compelled both inside by the inner self and outside by the needs of culture. The goal in most religions is for the ego to align with the inner self; inner voice, so they can work as a team. The pride of the ego often puts the ego at odds with the inner self.
The ego center is much newer in terms of history and is only found in humans. Animals do not have an ego. However, domesticated animals can develop a virtual ego, programmed by the ego of the owner. The owner may treat their little dog, like a baby, and the dog will learn to play this role; virtual ego, apart from its own natural instincts. Dogs can be trained to be service dogs to the blind via a virtual ego.
The human ego or the true secondary center in humans appears to have formed within the human brain near the beginning of civilization. It allowed for choices that were different from eons of previous instinctive behavior associated with eons of migratory herding and gathering.
Adam and Eve symbolically developed the first human egos. The bible dates the ego at about 6000 years. They were the first two modern humans in the sense of having two stable centers of consciousness and not just one like all the other natural animals in paradise. The first two humans of the bible were not about human DNA, and the human inner self, which is over a million years old. The ego, as a secondary center, is able to make choices apart from the inner self and instinct. Civilization required new choices and the will to make such choices apart from instinct.
Adam and Eve were the only two people in the bible not formed via DNA and biological means. They were created from the outside, instead of from the inside via DNA and fertilized ovum. Jesus was from a fertilized ovum using Mary's DNA. This symbolism was the ancient way of distinguishing the new ego center as being different from the biological inner self. The New Testament calls the difference the inner and outer man. The inner man is formed from DNA; tree of life, while the outer man is more of a cultural induction; from the outside; tree of knowledge. Many religions attempt to sacrifice the ego, so one can become united as an inner self. The inner self is way better, since it has access to a much higher percent of the brain; higher human potential.
If you were to map the human psyche, starting on the surface of a person, their outermost psyche begins with the persona, which is the mask of the ego. The persona is what you show strangers; your dress, attitude, etc. Decorations like tattoos, makeup, body piercing and now even gender are part of the mask of the ego. One is often pigeon holed, by causal acquaintances, based on this mask of the ego, since many people think the mask is the entire ego, since this is the data they can see in others.
Below the mask or persona is the ego proper. The ego proper, is the real ego. This can be seen by those who are close to you. They can see the you below the mask. A mother can see through the mask of her high profile celebrity child, and see the ego proper of that little boy or girl that hides below that social mask. Below the ego proper, also connected to the ego, is the personal unconscious. This is a collection of all our unique memories, that entered our brain through our sensory systems, or were induced through the imagination and thinking; personal memories. The personal unconscious can include memories which may be forgotten or repressed. These can be retrieved with hypnosis.
Below the personal unconscious of the ego, is the shadow. The shadow is the interface between the conscious and collective unconscious minds and it begins where the ego ends. Freud called the shadow the id, since the shadow is often how the unconscious mind beyond the ego, becomes conscious to the ego. Like a shadow, the shadow follows the ego around.
As an analogy, the light of the sun will illuminate an object while also casting a shadow that follows and reflects the movement and shape of the object. The inner self is symbolic of the sun, that shines on the ego; source of its energy, making a shadow in the process. The shadow provides a barrier to the even deeper layers of the unconscious, so the ego, via will and choice, does not mess with the programming and create bugs. The nightmare will often reach consciousness via the shadow.
Below the shadow, as we go even deeper, are the archetypes of the collective unconscious. This is where the ego ends and where ollective human propensity begins; human nature. The archetypes are similar to personality firmware, connected to our human DNA, which define us as a species. We are all human because of this firmware, with similar propensities that define us as a unique species.
There are three basic levels of archetypes. These levels are staggered in males and females. The staggering is designed so they can mesh like gears and complement each other; the team becomes more than the sum of its parts. Falling in love causes the gears to attempt to mesh so the male and female can cross program each other until "us" appears. Falling in love can be scary, since the ego can lose control as the inner selves, dance and download data, through an ego choice interface; bugs can appear. Without the ego this cross programming would be much more efficient.
The lowest level firmware are connected to natural male and female instinct. When one falls in love or desire, the spontaneous passion comes from this firmware. Males are more visual, while females are more verbal. This will be reflected in this firmware and exchanged via cross programming.
The next level are firmware of relationship. This level of firmware is based on how things relate to each other. One does not need understand how and why things relate, to observe that they relate in a certain way. We know that Santa Claus has a white beard and a red suit and comes on Christmas Eve. This is how Santa relates within western culture. The whys of these details are not part of the middle level firmware.
Conformity to traditions is instinctively driven by the middle level firmware. Music is based on how the sounds of the instruments, voices and lyrics relate. It is not about the whys. The arts, in general, come from the middle level firmware. This level of firmware is very creative since it can shuffled and then relates things in new ways; innovation. A new song has not logic in terms of how all things relate but it can have an impact on our emotions.
The upper level firmware are firmware of meaning. These firmware are connected to understanding why things are as they are. Reason and intuition are both connected to this level of firmware. The middle level firmware allows us to can see how the planets and sun relate in the sky each year. The upper level firmware seek str explain how and why this occurs; science. But even science uses middle level firmware, to relative variables to other variables when proof is lacking; dark energy and primordial atom.
Below the upper level firmware is the inner self. The inner self uses the firmware to help process and cyclically exercise all the natural needs of the human animal. The ego, through willpower and choice, acts like a wild card. It is compelled both inside by the inner self and outside by the needs of culture. The goal in most religions is for the ego to align with the inner self; inner voice, so they can work as a team. The pride of the ego often puts the ego at odds with the inner self.
nPeace
Veteran Member
I wouldn't say they go hand in hand.
The angel that challenged God, did not have fear. Selfish, but not fearful.
However, the root cause of fear can be pride. Moreso in cases you described earlier... fear of losing something, for example. as in the case of the religious leaders.
(John 11:48) If we let him go on this way, they will all put faith in him, and the Romans will come and take away both our place and our nation.. . .
Humility certainly is a beautiful quality, which enables us to overcome many negative traits.
nPeace
Veteran Member
Seems you are referring to boasting. That's different to stating a fact.
Simply base on belief is opinion.
For example, a person can disbelieve something, even though it is true.
You may say this in the case of science, and certain beliefs.
You may call it a fact, while someone else calls it, your belief.
Will that cause you to say, you cannot say it is a fact?
Likewise, a person who knows the truth, will state what is the truth. Because persons disagree, or don't believe, does not render the statement a belief, so that the person does not have the right to state the fact.
They don't go around boasting, although they could, and that could indeed be pride, but not necessarily so, depending on the situation.
Here are a few examples...
Elijah boasted and mocked - the situation called for it. Sometimes it depends on whom you are dealing with. -1 Kings 18:21-40
The apostle Paul boasted. - 2 Corinthians 11:18, 19
Why? The situation called for it, but it always is with one focus...
(1 Corinthians 1:31) . . .“The one who boasts, let him boast in Jehovah.”
This kind of boasting is not a negative pride, or egotism, but taking pride in the fact that one has God's approval, and backing, and exalting God - not themselve.
(2 Corinthians 10:17, 18) 17 “But the one who boasts, let him boast in Jehovah.” 18 For it is not the one who recommends himself who is approved, but the one whom Jehovah recommends.
(Jeremiah 9:24) “But let the one boasting boast about this: That he has insight and knowledge of me, That I am Jehovah, the One showing loyal love, justice, and righteousness in the earth, For in these things I take delight,” declares Jehovah.
So in effect, the humble, or lowly person, is exalted by Jehovah.
(1 Corinthians 1:26-29) 26 For you see his calling of you, brothers, that there are not many wise in a fleshly way, not many powerful, not many of noble birth, 27 but God chose the foolish things of the world to put the wise men to shame; and God chose the weak things of the world to put the strong things to shame; 28 and God chose the insignificant things of the world and the things looked down on, the things that are not, to bring to nothing the things that are, 29 so that no one might boast in the sight of God.
The apostle John stated a fact.
He said, "We know that we originate with God, but the whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one." (1 John 5:19)
There is no need for him to retract it, because someone does not believe it. They will have their opinion.
Thus, there is a level where ego and pride are acceptable. If it is all about me, then we know we have exceeded that level, and headed for a crash.
Pride is before a crash, And a haughty spirit before stumbling. Better to be humble among the meek Than to share the spoil of the haughty. (Proverbs 16:18, 19)
nPeace
Veteran Member
I see no reason to boast about being better than someone else, since we cannot judge that person.
(Luke 18:9-14)
9 He also told this illustration to some who trusted in their own righteousness and who considered others as nothing: 10 “Two men went up into the temple to pray, the one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood and began to pray these things to himself, ‘O God, I thank you that I am not like everyone else - extortioners, unrighteous, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week; I give the tenth of all things I acquire.’ 13 But the tax collector, standing at a distance, was not willing even to raise his eyes heavenward but kept beating his chest, saying, ‘O God, be gracious to me, a sinner.’ 14 I tell you, this man went down to his home and was proved more righteous than that Pharisee. Because everyone who exalts himself will be humiliated, but whoever humbles himself will be exalted.”
nPeace
Veteran Member
I understand that. Thank you for sharing it.
nPeace
Veteran Member
I read about half of it, but it all seems like something coming from your head, and I see no references from which I can take it as factual, so you will have to provide references to show that any of it is true.
I like reference.
Thanks for sharing though.
I have stayed what my opinions are on this matter. You are free to believe differently. Quoting the Bible is not very useful here. I can quote the Gita to support my views and then we will be back to square one.
nPeace
Veteran Member
Thank you for your opinion.
Bird123
Well-Known Member
Can anger really be righteous or justified? If one is not trying to control the actions of others, what is there to be angry about?
In a multilevel classroom, one can see others learning lessons one has already learned. Instead of anger, teach and point them in the right direction. Instead of getting angry, Work at fixing the real problems.
Anger can generate so many other petty things like Hate or Disgust. There are so many better things to value than those petty things. Unconditional Love, Kindness, Striving to Help, Educate and Solving the Real Problems will supply much better results than mere anger, deemed justified or not.
That's what I see. It's very clear!!
nPeace
Veteran Member
You sound like a teacher.
Have you ever seen someone torture and abuse a little child?
Do you feel happy, sad, calm, or angry... or something else?
Fallen Prophet
Well-Known Member
I actually believe that the angel that challenged God was very fearful.
I believe that all human beings lived with God as His spirit sons and daughters before coming to this world.
Our participation in mortality is a crucial test to help us determine who and what we want to be throughout eternity.
I believe that the angel that challenged God - the devil/Satan/Lucifer/whatever - was among us along with the Lord Jesus Christ.
In fact - the Lord Jesus Christ volunteered to be our Advocate and Mediator - in order for the Plan to succeed.
After this plan was explained to us - along with the risks involved - I believe that the angel that challenged God was both afraid and jealous.
He was jealous of the authority and position given to the Lord Jesus Christ over himself and he was afraid of the risks involved with entering into mortality.
I believe that these two things - jealousy and fear - fuel his pride.