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Why religion?

Secret Chief

nirvana is samsara
I would have thought who/what we are is what affects the world.
Indeed. And some of who/what some of us are includes religious beliefs. And some of these people make laws.

There is the belief of what reality is, and there is the actuality of what reality is.

I agree.

There is a difference between religiosity and a religious mind

Care to distinguish? (and "religiosity" can mean "being religious" or "being excessively religious" - which one had you in mind?)
 

The Hammer

[REDACTED]
Premium Member
Psychology is around to tell that unverifiable personal claims are part of schizoid disorders, divorced from reality. But perhaps more so it's there as a cash cow.

Well, there is some bias present here in your view of reality then (individual interpretation perhaps).

Your perspective on psychology appears skewed.
 

TSTS

Member
@The Hammer

When reason and logic gets defeated emotions take over. The beginnings of this disorder is observed in the shift from the topic to the person, as in personal attacks, like your latest comment. It's wise to stop at that point and i would be a fool not to stop now. Thank You.
 

The Hammer

[REDACTED]
Premium Member
@The Hammer

When reason and logic gets defeated emotions take over. The beginnings of this disorder is observed in the shift from the topic to the person, as in personal attacks, like your latest comment. It's wise to stop at that point and i would be a fool not to stop now. Thank You.

Pointing out your bias, and skewed opinion "But perhaps more so it's there as a cash cow."

Is not an ad hominem attack in itself. There are billions of individual interpretations of reality around, none more or less important than the other. We also can't shoehorn psychology as for only dealing with schizoid disorders, it's a massively broader field than that.

Edit: Psychology deals with subjective experience as seen through the scientific method. Ergo subjective experience is an important part of Reality. Religion is another method for dealing with subjective experience, therefore it's an important aspect of reality.
 
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Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
Is religion important? Why do people follow it?
Hmmm....interesting question. Welcome to RF BTW. (Beware of those offering food....it has no substance) :p

IMO, religion is the creation of man, which became necessary when he invented other gods who were more accommodating to his wants and desires.....and others who were persuaded to follow those gods also desired to worship them, so they created rituals and gatherings to reinforced their collective desire to worship, which I believe is innate in all humans. It’s just that “worship” can take many forms and even unbelievers can perform “devotion” to various things like....sport....entertainment figures....physical training....academic pursuits etc. in a fairly predictable way, so that even non-religious people can do things “religiously” by following the pattern that is so ingrained in human behavior.

When you step back and look at the big picture, humans behave the way they were designed.....it’s just that the original object of their devotion got morphed into a variety of other things.....all the creation of human imagination.

Can’t you see the “idols”.....the “scripture” and the “temples” where they gather? It’s all there....just sometimes called by another name. :shrug:
 

TSTS

Member
Welcome to RF BTW.

Thanks ;-)
(Beware of those offering food....it has no substance)
lol. Time will tell after i have digested it ;-)
and even unbelievers can perform “devotion” to various things like....sport....entertainment figures....physical training....academic pursuits etc. in a fairly predictable way, so that even non-religious people can do things “religiously” by following the pattern that is so ingrained in human behavior.
True. Therefore i have been stressing on an unbiased look at the issue. The issue is subjective.

Edit: For the record i do not consider "devotion" "wrong". I have my own understanding of devotion, which may be different from the traditional usage of that word.
 
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TSTS

Member
I don't believe so. From someone looking outside it, it definitely does. However, I believe each person has their personal relationship or experience with or in the unknown and whether they chant, do the rosary, or dance, when you're fully involved its spirituality in itself. For example, if you have a passion-say painting-one doesn't ask why do you keep painting the same thing or paint every other hour of the day. We see it as that person's passion and he's improving and making things congruent with maybe his thoughts, creativity, and just like to paint. It's the same with religion. It's really an individual person's decision whether ritual works for them or not. Regardless, though, I don't see either as right or wrong.

I mean, take someone who reads the bible everyday, have conventions about the bible, spend two hours studying the bible, and quote nothing but the bible. It's ritualistic and does have spiritual value to the people involved just as much so as someone without those means and show spirituality by their actions without needing to speak a word of scripture.

I think they each have their place.
Please take some time to ponder on the questions that were posted.
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
True. Therefore i have been stressing on an unbiased look at the issue. The issue is subjective.

Edit: For the record i do not consider "devotion" "wrong". I have my own understanding of devotion, which may be different from the traditional usage of that word.
Looking forward to an interesting discussion then.....:)

What does "devotion" look like to you...?
 

TSTS

Member
What does "devotion" look like to you...?
I will approach it via negations. It's not emotional and it can't be a practice. It 's more of a state rather than directed at something or someone. If it's contained within a definition and within localization then it isn't devotion. And so on....
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
I will approach it via negations. It's not emotional and it can't be a practice. It 's more of a state rather than directed at something or someone. If it's contained within a definition and within localization then it isn't devotion. And so on....
OK, so it does not involve emotion.....? Its a state of what exactly? Who or what can become the object of this devotion since its pretty much useless unless it is expressed...?
 

TSTS

Member
OK, so it does not involve emotion.....? Its a state of what exactly? Who or what can become the object of this devotion since its pretty much useless unless it is expressed...?

Useless? ;-) Haven't you ever been taken over by the beauty and majesty of a mountain when the morning sun's rays start illuminating portions of it? Or marvelled at the force of a tornado when it's destroying everything in it's path? Or the laughter of a content baby?

I could spell out the state but i won't as we are exploring together. Isn't one state that of quietness and another of wonder? And so on?

Why would devotion need an object when the nature/quality of it is simply the outpouring?
 
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Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
The questions weren't asking for answers. Those are unanswerable questions. But thank you. I like what you have contributed so far. They are detailed.

Use periods instead of question marks or say it's rethorical. If not, readers will read it in the context of question. Your previous posts were questions too so you have to differientiate the pattern.

Just a tip.
 

TSTS

Member
readers will read it in the context of question.

Even if readers read it in context of a question, but still, one has to ponder a bit right? For example, if we admit that the final reality (whatever that maybe) is of a unknown /unknowable/unnameable nature, then logically there can be no practicing "towards" it. You cannot map a practice or a way when you don't know where the destination is. If one is doing this then it's simply an operation of belief and hope, not facts, reality or truth. This is going back to why i sad what i did at # 68.

Thanks for the tip.
 

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
Is religion important? Why do people follow it?
If you can't figure out what's going on, and don't know how to find out -- but really want "an answer" --the only thing left is to "believe" something. For a lot of people, it doesn't matter if it's correct, or even makes sense. It just has to be comfortable.

That's religion.
 
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