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Why is salvation the ultimate goal of so many Christians?

Terrywoodenpic

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
We are all pilgrims on a journey through life. Jesus taught us the way, and we should follow that path because it is not only the best one for us, but for all creation. it is not about salvation or rewards or punishment if we fail. It is about doing what we know to be right. Maybe people who do not follow that path steadfastly do not end up where they hope.

We have no Idea, where either path leads, no one has come back to tell us.
We only know what we have been told, by people who came before us, who also had no more idea than us.
At the start of "Christianity" some of them wrote the books of the Bible and still others compiled it.

There is no certainty, only Faith and Hope.
The fruits of the various religions are very strange indeed, none are consistently Good, nor wholly Evil.
But guided by the Holy Spirit and the teachings of Jesus, we have a head start to the right direction.
In the end it is between God and each of Us... Just as it is now.
 
P

pearl

Well-Known Member
Katzpur said:
. Becoming such a person isn’t automatic, and it doesn’t happen at the moment you declare yourself to have been “saved.” It’s a lifelong process, facilitated by the grace of His beloved Son, Jesus Christ. It's recognizing that He has promised you so much more than the avoidance of eternal punishment.
Click to expand...

And that's why when a Catholic is asked 'are you saved' the typical answer is 'I don't know'. Some of the denominations will answer 'yes', like its a done deal.
 
Katzpur

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
pearl said:
And that's why when a Catholic is asked 'are you saved' the typical answer is 'I don't know'. Some of the denominations will answer 'yes', like its a done deal.
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I know they do and it kind of bugs me. As a Mormon, I have a firm conviction that Jesus Christ's atoning sacrifice will save me, provided I remain faithful to Him, in order words, as the Bible says, "endure to the end." But that's still not why I asked the question I did in my OP, although it's mostly to those people that my question was directed.

To those who do believe that you are "saved" at a specific moment in time, what's next? Have you done all that God wants from you? Is there any other reason for you to be here on earth once you've checked off that box?
 
Katzpur

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
passerby said:
Maybe in the end it is not just our love of God, but the love of our fellow man, creation etc, that will redeem us. This is Christian teaching.
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I agree 100%. This is NOT saying (and I suspect that you'll agree) that we are "saved by works," because we're not. But I believe that whether a person believes he "is saved" or that he "will be saved" in the end, God really does want more from us that "belief in Christ." He wants us to be true followers of Christ, meaning that we should be striving every day to be the best children of God we can possibly be. Life is (or at least should be) about self-improvement. That's what we're here for.
 
Terrywoodenpic

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
Barry Johnson said:
That's not what the bible says . But your entitled to your opinion.
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The Bible is pretty unclear about "hell" or even if it exists. Marginal books of the Bible like Revelation make a big deal about it , but the Gospels do not. Jesus message does not really give it any more credence than do other Jews of his time. It has developed as a "Christian" adoption from the ancient Greeks rather than part of Jesus teaching.
 
J

John1.12

Free gift
Terrywoodenpic said:
The Bible is pretty unclear about "hell" or even if it exists. Marginal books of the Bible like Revelation make a big deal about it , but the Gospels do not. Jesus message does not really give it any more credence than do other Jews of his time. It has developed as a "Christian" adoption from the ancient Greeks rather than part of Jesus teaching.
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Jesus speaks on hell more than anyone else in the bible.
 
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J

John1.12

Free gift
Terrywoodenpic said:
The hell referred to by Jesus was an actual place outside the city. used for burning refuse, He use it in a figurative way.
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Yes its better to pluck out your eye than get Chucked on a rubbish dump when you die. Nonsense . Where does it say he used it aa a figure ?
 
J

John1.12

Free gift
Katzpur said:
This is a same faith debate -- Christians only:

Why is it always about “Salvation”? The idea that from the moment we are born, we are condemned by default to everlasting torment is so abhorrent to me. I find it so hard to accept the notion that to so many Christians, “salvation” means having escaped the otherwise inevitable punishment that comes with “unbelief.” And that reprieve is all that matters. You believe in Jesus Christ and nothing more matters. When you die, you will be received into God’s love and, and… well, I don’t know. What happens next? You sit around throughout eternity, praising Him for His grace in not torturing you?

Why do people see “belief” as some kind of an insurance policy which assures them that they will be plucked from eternal torture in some fiery pit. If we believe because we’re afraid of what our destiny will be otherwise, how is that a good thing at all? It’s nothing more than checking off a box!

Life isn’t supposed to be about finding the secret to avoiding hellfire. It’s not about saying, “God, I’m a sinner. I believe in Jesus. Please save me!” Life is about learning to love as God loves. It’s about wanting to become someone that God is proud to call His son or daughter. It’s not about making it to our heavenly home. It’s about being the kind of person who will feel “at home” in God’s presence. Becoming such a person isn’t automatic, and it doesn’t happen at the moment you declare yourself to have been “saved.” It’s a lifelong process, facilitated by the grace of His beloved Son, Jesus Christ. It's recognizing that He has promised you so much more than the avoidance of eternal punishment.
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Yes this is the fanciful idea of western ,American privileged ' christianity ' . But its not the biblical picture at all . Notice in the bible the intense persecution ,slaughter and attacks the Believers are under. Most would not have lived long after . All round the world, in certain places its similar persecution and attacks. You may be slaughtered and your whole family killed. This is not the ' home ' for us believers. The bible says that heaven is our home. The devil is taking people captive here . Were supposed to look above not below.
phil
3:20–21 “For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.”

2 Thessalonians 1:7–9 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

John 14:2 In my Father’s house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
 
sojourner

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
Barry Johnson said:
Yes this is the fanciful idea of western ,American privileged ' christianity ' . But its not the biblical picture at all . Notice in the bible the intense persecution ,slaughter and attacks the Believers are under. Most would not have lived long after . All round the world, in certain places its similar persecution and attacks. You may be slaughtered and your whole family killed. This is not the ' home ' for us believers. The bible says that heaven is our home. The devil is taking people captive here . Were supposed to look above not below.
phil
3:20–21 “For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.”

2 Thessalonians 1:7–9 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

John 14:2 In my Father’s house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
Click to expand...
Yet feeding the hungry, loving one’s neighbor, welcoming the stranger, spreading the Gospel, doing what Jesus did and commanded, are all done here, in this world. The “goal” of the Christian is to love in this life.
 
J

John1.12

Free gift
sojourner said:
Yet feeding the hungry, loving one’s neighbor, welcoming the stranger, spreading the Gospel, doing what Jesus did and commanded, are all done here, in this world. The “goal” of the Christian is to love in this life.
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Doing what Jesus did? Only preaching to Israel ( primarily ) , Turning water into wine , multiplying loafs and fishes , walking on water , healing the deaf , blind and mute , raising the dead , dying on a cross,being buried and the resurrection? Do as Jesus did ? really ?
 
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Katzpur

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
Thief said:
though I hesitate to use the label.....Christian
the Carpenter is my Inspiration

and if we are NOT ......salvaged

what then?
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I don't believe we are "salvaged" because I don't believe we're the completely depraved creatures Protestant Christianity paints us as. In the earliest years of Christianity, our sins were seen as wounds and Jesus was the one sent to heal those wounds. He was the one we were supposed to be looking to as our model, as the perfect example of the love God has for all of His children. We were to try to emulate His mercy, forgiveness and compassion in our interactions with others, and when we failed to do, we became wounded as needed a Healer.
 
passerby

passerby

Member
Salvation came about through the sin of Adam and Jesus, often termed the second Adam saved us from that sin by sacrificing Himself on the cross. This is Christian teaching. Salvation means achieving entry to God's presence and damnation the opposite.
The wounds of Christ did save us,yes, but we cannot re-wound Christ, as His sacrifice on the cross was a one-off event.
We offend God,yes, and that is our inescapable sin and broken nature.
 
Katzpur

Katzpur

Not your average Mormon
passerby said:
Salvation came about through the sin of Adam and Jesus, often termed the second Adam saved us from that sin by sacrificing Himself on the cross. This is Christian teaching. Salvation means achieving entry to God's presence and damnation the opposite.
The wounds of Christ did save us,yes, but we cannot re-wound Christ, as His sacrifice on the cross was a one-off event.
We offend God,yes, and that is our inescapable sin and broken nature.
Click to expand...
So are you saying that the ultimate goal should be avoiding damnation?
 
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