Simulation

SalixIncendium · May 10, 2021

There are theories that suggest the reality that we perceive is a simulation.

But a simulation, by definition, is an imitation of something else.

If we are, indeed, experiencing reality as a simulation, and this simulation has existed as long as this reality has, what is it that's being imitated?

Altfish · May 10, 2021

SalixIncendium said:
There are theories that suggest the reality that we perceive is a simulation.

But a simulation, by definition, is an imitation of something else.

If we are, indeed, experiencing reality as a simulation, and this simulation has existed as long as this reality has, what is it that's being imitated?

I don't think there are any such theories.

There is at best speculation based on Matrix type ideas that we could be a simulation.

Eddi · May 10, 2021

SalixIncendium said:
what is it that's being imitated?

Some say a simulated world would be run as an "ancestor simulation", to simulate the past of those who created the simulation.

I like to imagine that this reality is simulated, and that the whole point of this simulation is to re-create Homo Sapiens - who have now gone extinct in the real world outside of the simulation.

Brickjectivity · May 10, 2021

SalixIncendium said:
There are theories that suggest the reality that we perceive is a simulation.

But a simulation, by definition, is an imitation of something else.

If we are, indeed, experiencing reality as a simulation, and this simulation has existed as long as this reality has, what is it that's being imitated?

Maybe its a Klein bottle kind of thing, where we are simulating them while they are simulating us. It could be that they are in our fiction, and we are in their fiction. They control our universe while we control theirs.

ameyAtmA · May 10, 2021

SalixIncendium said:
There are theories that suggest the reality that we perceive is a simulation.

But a simulation, by definition, is an imitation of something else.

If we are, indeed, experiencing reality as a simulation, and this simulation has existed as long as this reality has, what is it that's being imitated?

The POTENTIAL , CREATIVE POTENTIAL of MahA-VishNu who dreams up this world. The simulation is a product of His infinite potential.

SalixIncendium · May 10, 2021

ameyAtmA said:
The POTENTIAL , CREATIVE POTENTIAL of MahA-VishNu who dreams up this world. The simulation is a product of His infinite potential.

What is he imitating?

Revoltingest · May 10, 2021

SalixIncendium said:
There are theories that suggest the reality that we perceive is a simulation.

But a simulation, by definition, is an imitation of something else.

If we are, indeed, experiencing reality as a simulation, and this simulation has existed as long as this reality has, what is it that's being imitated?

Simulation....it's.just.a.not.even.wrong.speculation.
BTW,simulations.needn't.simulate.anything.from.reality.

ameyAtmA · May 10, 2021

SalixIncendium said:
What is he imitating?

He is not necessarily imitating. He has potential, He is using it to spin up the world because that is natural to Him.
Calling it a simulation is a matter of semantics.
Also, the repeated abiding of natural laws in potentially the same way, is coming due to a blue-print He prefers to follow,
simply because that is Nature of Brahman.

What we call "nature" here, is essentially Brahman's Nature. To be that way.

Also, because He is God, merely dreaming manifests reality. That is His-Their omnipotence.
This is His icchhaa Shakti - WILL.

So , the result of Maha-VishNu's dream is this reality -- which is not necessarily a simulation at a level, but can be called as such.

It is actually a transformation of the potential (muLa prakruti) into manifest forms. PariNAmvAda without violation of the law of Thermodynamics - again Nature of Brahman;

Things manifest by Brahman's sheer WILL because Brahman is extremely pure and no selfish or local agendas exist.

sun rise · May 10, 2021

A song I quite like has the line "I saw the universe as God's great dream"

George-ananda · May 10, 2021

SalixIncendium said:
There are theories that suggest the reality that we perceive is a simulation.

But a simulation, by definition, is an imitation of something else.

If we are, indeed, experiencing reality as a simulation, and this simulation has existed as long as this reality has, what is it that's being imitated?

Perhaps the grand thought-form of Brahman's creative aspect is being played out/imitated.

The Hammer · May 10, 2021

SalixIncendium said:
If we are, indeed, experiencing reality as a simulation, and this simulation has existed as long as this reality has, what is it that's being imitated?

I am less concerned about what exactly is being imitated, and more concerned with the workings of what is operating the simulation.

To me it seems that if it is a simulation, then the Universe is essentially a computer, running billions of programs simultaneously. So, is it possible to introduce a bug or glitch that would cause the Simulation/Computer to crash?

Could We Force the Universe to Crash?

"The question is: how do you bring down a simulation of reality from inside it? The most obvious strategy would be to try to cause the equivalent of a stack overflow—asking for more space in the active memory of a program than is available—by creating an infinitely, or at least excessively, recursive process. And the way to do that would be to build our own simulated realities, designed so that within those virtual worlds are entities creating their version of a simulated reality, which is in turn doing the same, and so on all the way down the rabbit hole. If all of this worked, the universe as we know it might crash, revealing itself as a mirage just as we winked out of existence."

Heyo · May 10, 2021

SalixIncendium said:
There are theories that suggest the reality that we perceive is a simulation.

But a simulation, by definition, is an imitation of something else.

If we are, indeed, experiencing reality as a simulation, and this simulation has existed as long as this reality has, what is it that's being imitated?

A long, long time ago I posted an OP about a different question regarding simulations and it doesn't answer your question but it contains informations about what a simulation is and how people think about it:
Are the Programmers Gods?

Heyo · May 10, 2021

The Hammer said:
To me it seems that if it is a simulation, then the Universe is essentially a computer, running billions of programs simultaneously.

No. The universe is the program that is running on a computer outside of our universe. Like Civilization is a program that runs on your computer. The "Civilization universe" is virtual in our reality.

So, is it possible to introduce a bug or glitch that would cause the Simulation/Computer to crash?

Depends on the stability of the framework and if you mean if it is possible to create that bug within the simulation or outside.

The Hammer · May 10, 2021

Heyo said:
No. The universe is the program that is running on a computer outside of our universe. Like Civilization is a program that runs on your computer. The "Civilization universe" is virtual in our reality.

Depends on the stability of the framework and if you mean if it is possible to create that bug within the simulation or outside.

"The question is: how do you bring down a simulation of reality from inside it? The most obvious strategy would be to try to cause the equivalent of a stack overflow—asking for more space in the active memory of a program than is available—by creating an infinitely, or at least excessively, recursive process. And the way to do that would be to build our own simulated realities, designed so that within those virtual worlds are entities creating their version of a simulated reality, which is in turn doing the same, and so on all the way down the rabbit hole. If all of this worked, the universe as we know it might crash, revealing itself as a mirage just as we winked out of existence."

I like this idea of a stack overflow. Even if the Universe is also a program, my point still stood, can a bug be introduced to force a malfunction.

I've never met a video game that couldn't be glitched in some manner as to break it's physics.

Heyo · May 10, 2021

The Hammer said:
"The question is: how do you bring down a simulation of reality from inside it? The most obvious strategy would be to try to cause the equivalent of a stack overflow—asking for more space in the active memory of a program than is available—by creating an infinitely, or at least excessively, recursive process. And the way to do that would be to build our own simulated realities, designed so that within those virtual worlds are entities creating their version of a simulated reality, which is in turn doing the same, and so on all the way down the rabbit hole. If all of this worked, the universe as we know it might crash, revealing itself as a mirage just as we winked out of existence."

I like this idea of a stack overflow. Even if the Universe is also a program, my point still stood, can a bug be introduced to force a malfunction.

I've never met a video game that couldn't be glitched in some manner as to break it's physics.

The idea of a stack overflow is to write into memory that doesn't belong to your program, e.g. system memory. That assumes a von Neumann architecture. In a robust framework, data would be separated from program.

The Hammer · May 10, 2021

Heyo said:
The idea of a stack overflow is to write into memory that doesn't belong to your program, e.g. system memory. That assumes a von Neumann architecture. In a robust framework, data would be separated from program.

Interesting

I Wouldn't know.

I know as much about computers as I care too, which is rather limited to operations.

Edit: Do you think it is more plausible it runs on a Harvard (style) Architecture?

https://www.educba.com/types-of-computer-architecture/

Heyo · May 10, 2021

The Hammer said:
Interesting

I Wouldn't know.

I know as much about computers as I care too, which is rather limited to operations.

Edit: Do you think it is more plausible it runs on a Harvard (style) Architecture?

https://www.educba.com/types-of-computer-architecture/

Yes. Harvard architecture (I know it as Turing Machine) lends itself to simulation style programs. It is easy to parallelize at any scale with very robust instruction sets. Unless you want to cut corners for speed, the program for our universe would fit in a few hundred lines of code you could verify by hand.

SalixIncendium · May 11, 2021

ameyAtmA said:
He is not necessarily imitating. He has potential, He is using it to spin up the world because that is natural to Him.
Calling it a simulation is a matter of semantics.
Also, the repeated abiding of natural laws in potentially the same way, is coming due to a blue-print He prefers to follow,
simply because that is Nature of Brahman.

What we call "nature" here, is essentially Brahman's Nature. To be that way.

Also, because He is God, merely dreaming manifests reality. That is His-Their omnipotence.
This is His icchhaa Shakti - WILL.

So , the result of Maha-VishNu's dream is this reality -- which is not necessarily a simulation at a level, but can be called as such.

It is actually a transformation of the potential (muLa prakruti) into manifest forms. PariNAmvAda without violation of the law of Thermodynamics - again Nature of Brahman;

Things manifest by Brahman's sheer WILL because Brahman is extremely pure and no selfish or local agendas exist.

Your two statements which I highlighted in red are pretty much the point of this thread. Why do we call it a simulation when it isn't imitating anything? There should be a better word to describe it. Sanskrit has one. But I honestly can't think of an English one. Some people use "illusion," but given transactional reality appears quite real from the perspective of vyavaharika, that word doesn't quite work either.

SalixIncendium · May 11, 2021

George-ananda said:
Perhaps the grand thought-form of Brahman's creative aspect is being played out/imitated.

Imitating what?

SalixIncendium · May 11, 2021

The Hammer said:
"The question is: how do you bring down a simulation of reality from inside it?

You would have to be contacted by someone that is already aware of the simulation that has created a way to hack in to set you free, gain the ability to read the "coding" so you can mold the simulation as you see fit, eliminate a program only to have that program become your opposite, and have an epic battle with your opposite in which you allow that opposite to merge with you, then fry the both of you into oblivion.

Well, it wouldn't bring down the simulation exactly, but it would bring peace between its creators and mankind.

Someone should make a movie trilogy about that. Oh wait...

Simulation

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