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Proof Jesus Wasn't God

EiNsTeiN

Boo-h!
sonflour_2001 said:
Furthermore, as for Jesus being God...yeah...he was. The remarkable thing is that he told us that we would do even greater things in his name. Jesus' purpose was to show us the potential that lies in all of us...to transcend our humanity and grasp that seed of righteousness within: obtain full unity with God.
Christ came and suffered and did that, but he didn't cut us off from that legacy. Instead he modestly opened the door wide open and exhorted us to "partake in our divine union with God."
This isn't so different from what many in the Sufi tradition of Islam believed.

Dee
Why does God has to send his son to sacrify for our sins??
If God can do anything, he could simply forgive us without sacrifice or any other drama event..
God is the most powerfull, most mercifull, who doesnt even let sins go on with inheritance...
If I had done a sin, why will God ask my son about it??...this is not justice I guess
 
EiNsTeiN said:
Why does God has to send his son to sacrify for our sins??
If God can do anything, he could simply forgive us without sacrifice or any other drama event..
God is the most powerfull, most mercifull, who doesnt even let sins go on with inheritance...
If I had done a sin, why will God ask my son about it??...this is not justice I guess

You are right, God can do anything. Even be able to visit his people and give his life for the randsom of many. This is what everything is, this is His everything. Because we are away from God in our own free will. We sin, we are not worthy to remove the sandles of His feet. In order for us to be set free from death (sin) He had to come and live a perfect life sinless. He is infinately Holy and righteous and innocent and died for our sake. His love so powerful, His grace and Divine Mercy is incredible. No one could set us free from death but God, who sacrificed His perfect self for us.

this is it here, He offered Himslef to be tortured and killed for us! Do you believe the people on this earth are worthy enough to enter the kingdom of heaven without Love, Grace and Divine Mercy from God? Becasue he is perfect and sinless he conqured death for us. We could not do this on our own!! No way, that is why He had to come for us.
 

Dirty Penguin

Master Of Ceremony
there will be many who say he was even though he wasn't. he said god was in him... the father was with him... All that was is annd will be is the the creation of god. It could mean that he realized that everything is connected.. All i know is that he cried like a baby when he knew he was to be dealt with. that means he feared what was about to happen with him. Are you telling me your god is capable of fear. God fears that which he created? don't knock the qur'an and the muslim way of life. it is a fact that the qur'an makes reference to Jesus (ISA) more times then it doe Muhammed.

Jesus was not God or the son of God. This is what he said and his actions proved that. Father why has thou forsaken me?

Who was he crying to. Are there two Gods????
 

Navigator

Member
I believe you would have more success proselytising by showing the positives in your belief instead of your negative perception of theirs.

Being critical, negative, often shows insecurity, while being supportive, positive shows security.
 

sister M

Member
Hema said:
I'm not a Christian neither am I Muslim, I am Hindu which means that I see all paths as leading to God. You say Jesus is not the son God, so who put him on earth? We are all sons and daughters of God. To me, it sounds like Jesus was being humble when he said that do nothing by himself. None of us can do anything by ourselves. It is God who gives us the ability to do everything.
You have an interesting point.
True if it would not be for the will of Allah SWT/God/G-d we would not be here, neither would we be able to do what we do. Of course, that is common sense, at least to a believer.

So why would God put Himself on earth? To prove what? We don't need Him to be around us in flesh to believe in Him. People have all the gone generations believed in Him without Him being among us. What changed only 2000 years ago?
 

EiNsTeiN

Boo-h!
No one could set us free from death but God, who sacrificed His perfect self for us.
And that is what I want to say....Why would God sacrify himself for us?...this way at least?

Is God not capable to forgive our sins?....
If you spend 100 years of sinful life, God can forgive all these sins in no time...
It's God's will that can rule the whole universe, and no one will ask him to sacrify himself for humans
He is the one who recorded the sins, and the one who can simply erase them..
 

Snowbear

Nita Okhata
sister M said:
Could it then be interpreted that love needs a sacrifice?
Obviously, this thread proves that you can interpret things any way you want to make them fit what Islam says you must believe.
 

sister M

Member
Snowbear said:
Obviously, this thread proves that you can interpret things any way you want to make them fit what Islam says you must believe.
Could we leave Islam out of this just for the moment? I think it will be easier. :yes:

Let's use logic or common sense instead. And I repeat my question - 'Does love need a sacrifice?'
 

Snowbear

Nita Okhata
sister M said:
Could we leave Islam out of this just for the moment? I think it will be easier. :yes:

Let's use logic or common sense instead. And I repeat my question - 'Does love need a sacrifice?'
Leave Islam out of this... use common sense instead... now THAT was a good one :biglaugh: :biglaugh:

Frubals for making me laugh :biglaugh:
 

sister M

Member
Snowbear said:
Leave Islam out of this... use common sense instead... now THAT was a good one :biglaugh: :biglaugh:

Frubals for making me laugh :biglaugh:
You're welcome. :yes:

If you now have stopped laughing, can you answer the question please?
Repeat it, just in case,
''Does love need a sacrifice''? Meaning must God make a sacrifice to be able to love?
 

Dirty Penguin

Master Of Ceremony
I can't believe we are all still debating this dead question. Jesus was not God. His actions proved it. Jesus was a man born from man. Jesus was not the son of God. Heck...in Luke 18:19 Jesus said Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.

If he was God why would he say that? Why would God confuse his creation by talking about himself in the third person?

If he was God he wouldn't have said this. Look in many other postings I have said time and time again If this all powerful God was as you say he/she/it is then this God would have no need for any of its creations respect, love, prayers etc. This all powerfull, All knowing, All hearing, all seeing God would already know all there is to know about its creation. In fact, This God, being so powerfull would have been the one who created every decision, thought, action etc... that its creation made or would make. I didn't say it GOD said it in Isa 45:7 that he created evil.

I saw the comment about Satan or at that time he was known as Lucifer. I take the position that he did not lie. he told eve the truth. eat from this tree and you will know good and evil. Well, didn't she?

We can keep going on pulling out countless chapters and verses, sura after sura and it will not change the fact that Jesus was simply a man. Not God.

God is not even sure he is God. Refer to Gen 3:9 - 3:13....... So you mean to tell me this omnipotent God has to search for his creation ask it questions as if he didn't know? Don't you think God would have known where his creation was and what they were doing or did before he created them?

Do you see what I mean? the book ain't event got good with all thr wrath, plauge and slavery and God has been reduced to an earthly father looking for his children behind the house eating from the fruit tree that he told them not to eat.
 

Navigator

Member
sister M said:
You're welcome. :yes:

If you now have stopped laughing, can you answer the question please?
Repeat it, just in case,
''Does love need a sacrifice''? Meaning must God make a sacrifice to be able to love?

Love does not need a sacrifice, but one was needed to bring in the new covenant.

Love can be measured by the extent of sacrifice we are willing to give to show love.
 

XAAX

Active Member
Gota love those religious fanatics....YAYAYAYAYA...Like Muhammad was more than a man either. Does it really matter. The message was oneness in God. Not the son of a carpenter, or a dude on a white horse...I didn't even know they had horses in those areas back then...I guess since I've never seen a white camel...lol...just kidding
 

may

Well-Known Member
Islam said:
So He isnt God and isnt the son of God!
As the bible tells me Jesus is Gods only -begotten son .
For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life John 3;16 .but this does not mean that Jesus is God , Jesus did not teach us that he was God ,that is false . Jesus was the only-one created by his Father , everything else was created through Jesus , so Jesus was only- begotten because he was the only one created by Jehovah alone , and because he was the first-born he was in the beginning with God.
In [the] beginning the Word was, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god. 2 This one was in [the] beginning with God. John 1;1-2 ...,
 

sister M

Member
Navigator said:
Love does not need a sacrifice, but one was needed to bring in the new covenant.

Love can be measured by the extent of sacrifice we are willing to give to show love.
Ok.

But then we are not talking about a human innocent sacrifice in the second case, right? It is sacrificing on another way. Like we all do, some way or another, for example to be able to follow our faith.
 

sister M

Member
PREACH THE NETT said:
Gota love those religious fanatics....YAYAYAYAYA...Like Muhammad was more than a man either. Does it really matter. The message was oneness in God. Not the son of a carpenter, or a dude on a white horse...I didn't even know they had horses in those areas back then...I guess since I've never seen a white camel...lol...just kidding
Sorry to be one...;)
The prophet Muhammad pbuh was only a man. Just like Jesus pbuh. To my belief.
But both were prophets sent by Allah SWT/God/G-d. :yes:
 
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