Believing that Bahulllah is the Messiah isn't much different from believing in Messiah Ben Joseph and Messiah Ben David. The Bible never mentions Bahulllah coming because Jesus Christ fulfilled all of the messianic prophecies. Jesus said in Matthew 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
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How can a Jew reject Jesus as the Messiah?
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Believing that Bahulllah is the Messiah isn't much different from believing in Messiah Ben Joseph and Messiah Ben David. The Bible never mentions Bahulllah coming because Jesus Christ fulfilled all of the messianic prophecies. Jesus said in Matthew 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Believing that Jesus is the Messiah of the end times isn't much different from believing in Messiah Ben Joseph and Messiah Ben David. Jesus did not fulfill ANY of the Messianic prophecies and that is one reason Jews did not recognize Jesus as the Messiah. Baha'u'llah was the Messiah of the end times because He either fulfilled the prophecies or they will be fulfilled during the Messianic Age, which has a long way to go because it is only in the beginning stages.
Jesus said in Matthew 24:5 "For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many" because many men have come claiming to be Christ and deceived many. Baha'u'llah never came in the name of Christ,. He came with a new name.
Revelation 2:17 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.
Revelation 3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
The sceptre shall not depart from Judah, nor a lawgiver from between his feet, until Shiloh come; and unto him shall the gathering of the people be. Genesis 49:10
Predictions about the coming Messiah are peppered throughout the Old Testament. This one in Genesis 49:10 is striking because it told God's people, all the way back in Genesis, that the Messiah would come through the lineage of Judah, one of Jacob's twelve sons.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I already told you I believe that Jesus was 'a Messiah' but Jesus was never slated to be the Messiah of the latter days. That was Baha'u'llah.
26: THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST AND THE DAY OF JUDGMENT
From Matthew 25:31-46, we see that Jesus will one day preside over all the nations, and everyone will acknowledge his authority (Isaiah 9:6 and Philippians 2:9-11). This has not happened yet, but it's important to remember that some of the prophecies point to the first visit of the Messiah, and some point to his return. Some people confuse those prophecies to mean that there are two Messiahs.
Jesus Christ was not Anglo-Saxon nor Roman, but Christianity became an Anglo-Saxon Roman Religion and the image and identity of Jesus Christ is more like a Roman God than a Hebrew Messiah.
Jesus was God incarnated not the offspring of a god and a wife.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
This is never going to happen because there is not going to be a return of Jesus.
What don't you understand about the following verses? Why do you ignore them as if they don't exist?
Jesus is NEVER coming back to this world. His work was finished here.
(John 14:19, John 17:11, John 17:4, John 19:30, John 18:36)
There were going to be two Messiahs. Jesus was the first, Baha'u'llah was the second.
Baha'u'llah was the Son of man who came in His glory, with all the holy angels, and He sat upon the throne of His glory.
Baha'u'llah gathered all nations and He is dividing the sheep from the goats.
Matthew 25:31-46 King James Version (KJV)
31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
A very Roman Anglo-Saxon belief.
The Old Testament prophesies that this Messiah, this Son who would be "Immanuel, God with us," would truly be the incarnation of Almighty God
For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The Mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. (Isaiah 9:6)
People confuse the two visits of Jesus with there being two Messiahs. The first visit was when Jesus came as our suffering servant to give his life "as a ransom for many" (Mark 10:45). The triumphant return of the Messiah is when Jesus will come to judge the earth and to establish his kingdom-when "the obedience of the nations shall be his" (Genesis 49:10). Jesus fulfilled all of the messianic prophecies. The prophecy in Genesis clearly points to the future, everlasting kingdom of a son of Judah. Jesus fits this description perfectly.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
This Messiah was a Manifestation of God, God with us. His name was Baha'u'llah, which means the Glory of God.
Isaiah 9:6-7 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.
Baha’u’llah was the Prince of Peace because world peace will be established during His religious dispensation. Baha’u’llah set up a system of government and it has already been established among the Baha’is. The institutions of that government are fully operational, but still in their infancy. They will be more developed in the future as the prophecy says (increase in government).
These prophecies cannot refer to Jesus because Jesus disclaimed being the Mighty God when He called Himself “the Son of God” (John 5:18-47) and in those verses Jesus repudiates the charge that He claimed equality with God. Jesus disclaimed being the everlasting Father when He said, “my Father is greater than I” (John 14:28) and Jesus disclaimed being the Prince of Peace when He said, “I came not to send peace, but a sword” (Matthew 10:34). Jesus disclaimed bearing the government upon His shoulder when He said to “rend onto Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's” (Mark 12:17, Matthew 22:21). Jesus disclaimed that He would establish a kingdom where he would rule with judgment and justice forever when He said, “My kingdom is not of this world” (John 18:36).
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
This is never going to happen because there is not going to be a return of Jesus.
What don't you understand about the following verses? Why do you ignore them as if they don't exist?
Jesus is NEVER coming back to this world. His work was finished here.
John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.
John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.
John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.
John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.
These two verses in John 18 completely negate that Jesus is the King of this world or that Jesus will ever come to this world to rule it, and they fit perfectly together with John 17:4 and John 17:11. Jesus came into this world to bear witness unto the truth about God. He did that so there is no more reason for Jesus to come back to this world again. That is why Jesus said “I am no more in the world.”
The prophecy in Genesis 49:10 was echoed throughout the Old Testament-predicting not only that the Messiah would come from the tribe of Judah, but more specifically that he would come through the house of David (who was an earlier descendant of Judah, mentioned in 2 Samuel 7:12-13). This was finally fulfilled in the New Testament. When we look at the genealogies of Jesus in Matthew 1:1-17 (the line of Joseph, Jesus' legal father) and Luke 3:23-38 (commonly believed to be the line of Mary, Jesus' mother), we discover that Jesus did indeed descend from the family of Judah as well as the house of David.
Poisonshady313
Well-Known Member
You seem to believe everything that comes out of gotquestions.org.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
1559. Bahá’u’lláh was a Descendent of Abraham Through Both Katurah and Sarah—Jesse, Son of Sarah, was the Father of David and Ancestor of Bahá’u’lláh
"Regarding your question concerning the Jesse from whom Bahá’u’lláh is descended: The Master says in 'Some Answered Questions', referring to Isaiah, chapter 11, verses 1 to 10, that these verses apply 'Word for word to Bahá’u’lláh'. He then identifies this Jesse as the father of David in the following words: '…for Joseph was of the descendants of Jesse the father of David…', thus identifying the Jesse of Isaiah, chapter 11, with being the father of David. Bahá’u’lláh is thus the descendant of Jesse, the father of David.
"The Guardian hopes that this will clarify the matter for you. It is a tremendous and fascinating theme, Bahá’u’lláh's connection with the Faith of Judaism, and one which possesses great interest to Jew and Christian alike." (From a letter written on behalf of Shoghi Effendi to an individual believer, July 11, 1942)
12: COMMENTARY ON THE ELEVENTH CHAPTER OF ISAIAH
Genealogy of Baha’u’llah Genealogy of The Báb and Bahá'u'lláh
There's only one Savior. He's the Lord Jesus Christ, not any replacement. What would the need be for a Christ like figure to return in the end times? That sounds like the Antichrist.
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Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I never said that there is any other Savior, but why can't Christians be satisfied that Jesus was the one Savior? Why do you have to try to make Jesus MORE than that, something He is not, the Messiah of the latter days? Jesus was not and never will be that.
As I have told you many times before, we needed another Messenger of God to bring the teachings and laws we humans would need to build the Kingdom of God on earth, the new world order. We can see that process unfolding right now, as the old world order comes crashing down and humanity is struggling to build a new one, all over the world. Politics, economies, social systems, it's all changing.
“This is the Day in which God’s most excellent favors have been poured out upon men, the Day in which His most mighty grace hath been infused into all created things. It is incumbent upon all the peoples of the world to reconcile their differences, and, with perfect unity and peace, abide beneath the shadow of the Tree of His care and loving-kindness. It behoveth them to cleave to whatsoever will, in this Day, be conducive to the exaltation of their stations, and to the promotion of their best interests. Happy are those whom the all-glorious Pen was moved to remember, and blessed are those men whose names, by virtue of Our inscrutable decree, We have preferred to conceal.
Beseech ye the one true God to grant that all men may be graciously assisted to fulfil that which is acceptable in Our sight. Soon will the present-day order be rolled up, and a new one spread out in its stead. Verily, thy Lord speaketh the truth, and is the Knower of things unseen.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 6-7
Rabbis used to wonder if there would be two Messiahs because He was spoken of as both a Suffering Servant, coming to remove the barrier of sin from between people and God, and as a Conquering King, coming to deliver His people from worldly oppression. But they were reading about two visits of the same Messiah.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
No, they were reading about two visits from two different Messiahs.
The Bible does not support ANYTHING you believe about Jesus returning as a Conquering King, coming to deliver His people from worldly oppression.
John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.
All the Bible verses about building a Kingdom refer to Baha'u'llah, but Christians mistakenly believed they were about Jesus. You can can keep believing that Jesus is coming, but believing won't make Him come. It seems to me it is a waste of time to keep waiting for something that is never going to happen, just as it is a waste of my time to keep posting the same verses over and over and over again, since they fall on deaf ears.
John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.
John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.