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The Greater Insult

Nimos

Well-Known Member

Up for discussion, if anyone cares to.
Interesting video, but also a slightly weird depiction of God, I would assume that an atheist made it? :)

The issue with it, is that God in the video just as in the religious texts offers nothing. He is shown as a judge, creator and an "im better than you" type of entity. He point his fingers at the three humans as if they did something wrong. He save the atheist for not knowing him as if he made the correct choice simply by doing that.

He is annoyed or angry with the muslim and christian for fearing him and believing in old scriptures, which according to him is not what he is like.

But this is also where the nonsense obviously comes into the video and why I would assume that it is created by an atheist or at least someone that haven't given the idea of God nor Christianity or Islam a whole lot of thoughts. Because the person making the video, don't really seem to understand the issue in the first place in my opinion. It doesn't matter whether its an atheist, christian or muslim in front of God. Because the issue is God himself.

If all people in the world were atheists, God would be lonely and meaningless as no one would believe in him anyway. So him saving the atheist as if he made the correct choice, only serves as an demonstration of his incompetence and meaningless purpose.

Pointing fingers at the muslim and christian people for fearing God and following the teachings of those before them, even though God in the video know they are wrong. He apparently take no blame for not having set things straight, but allowed false teachings to be taught about himself, for him to then at the end times appear as the "wise old man" judging them for not knowing better. When what he should do is to fall on his own knees and apologize to them, for his own incompetence and wickedness.

Neither of the humans in the video have done anything wrong, the only one to blame is God. And clearly the person that made the video, did not understand that as far as I see it.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Interesting video, but also a slightly weird depiction of God, I would assume that an atheist made it? :)

The issue with it, is that God in the video just as in the religious texts offers nothing. He is shown as a judge, creator and an "im better than you" type of entity. He point his fingers at the three humans as if they did something wrong. He save the atheist for not knowing him as if he made the correct choice simply by doing that.

He is annoyed or angry with the muslim and christian for fearing him and believing in old scriptures, which according to him is not what he is like.

But this is also where the nonsense obviously comes into the video and why I would assume that it is created by an atheist or at least someone that haven't given the idea of God nor Christianity or Islam a whole lot of thoughts. Because the person making the video, don't really seem to understand the issue in the first place in my opinion. It doesn't matter whether its an atheist, christian or muslim in front of God. Because the issue is God himself.

If all people in the world were atheists, God would be lonely and meaningless as no one would believe in him anyway. So him saving the atheist as if he made the correct choice, only a demonstration of his incompetence and purpose.

Pointing fingers at the muslim and christian person, for fearing God and following the teachings of those before them, even though God in the video know they are wrong. He apparently take no blame for not having set things straight, but allowed false teachings to be taught about himself, for him to then at the end time to appear as the "wise old man" judging them for not knowing better. When what he should do is to fall on his own knees and apologize to them, for his own incompetence and wickedness.

Neither of the humans in the video have done anything wrong, the only one to blame is God. And clearly the person that made the video, did not understand that as far as I see it.

Do you believe everyone would be saved despite their beliefs and actions?

It's kind of the same argument anticatholics pose on catholics when it comes rituals making God angry.
 

Nimos

Well-Known Member
Do you believe everyone would be saved despite their beliefs and actions?

It's kind of the same argument anticatholics pose on catholics when it comes rituals making God angry.
That is the whole problem with God.

Assuming I was God and I told you what I was and wanted you to spread the teachings of love, harmony and my wisdom to other people. So I give you a lot of information and you believe me and you follow me as if you were Moses or something and spread my message.

Both of us are happy, you for finally having a relationship with me as God, and im happy because I want what is best for you as my subject or creation.

You spend your whole life teaching what I have taught you to others and eventually you die. As time passes im watching from above as things unfold, and I see the teaching you told people, gets changed as others start to write them down. They start adding stuff like I killed a lot of people, I sacrificed you, because you defied me etc.

I don't like it, but you are not there to correct things and I do nothing to make sure that other people are made aware of it being false and that it is not what I want. Rather I wait for people to die, when it is to late, so I can tell them that they just wasted their whole life believing in something that I did not plan or wanted them to. Despite me having all the power with no effort to make them aware. Seeing how all this slowly spread with one wrong teaching after another and do nothing to stop it.

Either I would be incompetence or not really caring about my subjects, or I really just like being able to point fingers at people when they finally realize that they got it all wrong.

And again, at no point have I revealed what the purpose of it all is, what I want with this creation of mine? Why I want you to live in a certain way? Why I correct you when you finally die and I point my fingers at them for being wrong?

Therefore the issue is not with humans, it's the lack of purpose of God for humans and his guidance.
 

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
Well, as everyone here knows, I am an atheist. (Not in the sense of absolutely denying the existence of gods, just not believing in them). But something else I've often mentioned on this site is that, if it turned out that I was wrong, and there was something that I thought might qualify as God, I would not fear it.

Nor would I believe any of what humans have written about it, because if I don't know, they don''t know.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
It does reflect on the problem of believing in ancient tribal religions that believe in exclusive salvation for their on belief system. A more universal approach to God if God exists. I believe in a universal 'Source' some call God(s), The many atheists and agnostics do have logical rational universal view of the nature of our physical reality without clinging mindlessly to ancient paradigms.
 
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Dave Watchman

Active Member
Well, as everyone here knows, I am an atheist. (Not in the sense of absolutely denying the existence of gods, just not believing in them). But something else I've often mentioned on this site is that, if it turned out that I was wrong, and there was something that I thought might qualify as God, I would not fear it.

Nor would I believe any of what humans have written about it, because if I don't know, they don''t know.

I did watch the video.

I did find it interesting.

It allowed me more insight into the Atheist mind.

It confirms many of my previous observations.

Most Atheists know God exists, but He's not the God they want.

They would like to manufacture, like in the video, how they would like God to be.

Do you think that's how it's going to be?

God lets the Atheist go?

Not to fall into judgement like the Christian and Muslim?

What if that Atheist was Richard Ramirez, the night stalker?

richard-ramirez-wife-1608672657.jpg


You think the god of that video will let him go?

Go Richard, peace to you.

Rather than worship the Creator, they would worship the created.

"So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen. - Romans 1:25​

Jesus said that the Father wants worshipers in spirit and in truth.

"Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. - John 4:23​

I fear God.

I fear an electrical box that reads 600 VOLTS.

Fear also means respect.

The Bible says fear of God is the beginning of wisdom.

"The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom, and the knowledge of the Holy One is insight. - Proverbs 9:10​

The Bible is too elaborate to have been penned by just an assortment of human authors.

If you believe that God will be like the authors of this video are representing, and it gives you peace at this time, enjoy yourself.

There were too many erroneous assumptions and false specifications in the video for me to have the time to address them all.

I would stick with Scripture for now, because it's all we have.

Peaceful Sabbath.
 

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
I did watch the video.

I did find it interesting.

It allowed me more insight into the Atheist mind.

It confirms many of my previous observations.

Most Atheists know God exists, but He's not the God they want.

They would like to manufacture, like in the video, how they would like God to be.

Do you think that's how it's going to be?

God lets the Atheist go?

Not to fall into judgement like the Christian and Muslim?

What if that Atheist was Richard Ramirez, the night stalker?

richard-ramirez-wife-1608672657.jpg


You think the god of that video will let him go?

Go Richard, peace to you.

Rather than worship the Creator, they would worship the created.

"So they worshiped and served the things God created instead of the Creator himself, who is worthy of eternal praise! Amen. - Romans 1:25​

Jesus said that the Father wants worshipers in spirit and in truth.

"Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. - John 4:23​

I fear God.

I fear an electrical box that reads 600 VOLTS.

Fear also means respect.

The Bible says fear of God is the beginning of wisdom.

"The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom, and the knowledge of the Holy One is insight. - Proverbs 9:10​

The Bible is too elaborate to have been penned by just an assortment of human authors.

If you believe that God will be like the authors of this video are representing, and it gives you peace at this time, enjoy yourself.

There were too many erroneous assumptions and false specifications in the video for me to have the time to address them all.

I would stick with Scripture for now, because it's all we have.

Peaceful Sabbath.
The video, I think you must admit, did not suggest that any of the 3 people were guilty of anything like that which Ramirez was guilty, agree? Now, I personally think that when we are guilty of heinous acts, there ought to be consequences -- at the very least aimed at protecting society from anything further and attaining some sort of reparation, though I don't pretend to know what to do when reparations can''t be made. (I don't think killing is the answer though, since it doesn't achieve anything except to make us suppose that killing is not always quite so bad.)

But what God does accuse the Muslim and Christian of is being inauthentic, of believing on authority rather than listening to their own hearts. And scripture (and religious "teachers") are a form of authority, and must be questioned just as easily as anything else when they appear to violate our conscience, or are inconsistent.

Yet, for reasons we can't quite agree on, Christians, for most of the history of the religion, could not find any reason not to own other people as slaves, and to force their children to be likewise enslaved. Their religious texts, and their "teachers," were not up to the task of teaching that rather simple moral precept. Nor have most religions, their scriptures and "teachers," been able to convince us that making war and killing in the thousands and millions for territory, or for political disagreement, are wrong.

And even today, how many Muslims, how many Christians, would agree that God intends to send me to hell simply for loving another man, of caring for him when he's ill (so the state doesn't have to), and loving him physically when he is well. The atheist in me can tell with ease that this is RIGHT, just as easily as I can see that sexually abusing children, or those over whom I have power, is WRONG. I know this from examining my own authentic conscience. Religion, far too often, is incapable of that. Jews (and many Christians and Muslims) insist, for example, on mutilating the penises of their infant sons (and sometimes the clitoris and labia minora of young girls). I, as an atheist, can see the wrongness in that without even trying.

Scripture isn't all you have. You have your mind and conscience.
 

Nimos

Well-Known Member
So then, why blame someone, to begin with?

"what you see in others is in you", a wise man has taught

Why not drop this whole blaming thing?
In this video we assume that God exist and that he is passing judgement on those three people. Blaming the christian and muslim for not being as clever and brave as the atheist, that despite standing in front of God, does not kneel or changes his view. Whereas the believers are portrayed as weak and scared.

However the religious people did get one thing right that the atheist didn't, which is that there is a God, they simply weren't guided towards the correct one. But who other than God can you blame for not reacting or correcting the false teachings?

So when talking blame, if God allow all religious people to live by certain rules which he did not care to correct or help them avoid. Which then result in them wasting their lives with pointless rules, then I would blame him. If no blame should fall on him and he does not want people to live by the rules as they do, as they are clearly wrong according to the movie. Then what God is actually trying to teach people is to just make up their own ideas of what God is and that these should be positive or simply do as the atheists and simply say that they don't know God. Which again would make the whole idea of God, religions, scriptures and teachings completely pointless.

If you are to just make up your own idea of what God is, then what is the need for religion? religious teachers? preachers? etc.

Even as an atheist I wouldn't buy that, if it turned out that God existed, I don't think I would be able to not laugh :D
 
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stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Then what God is actually trying to teach people is to just make up their own ideas of what God is and that these should be positive or simply do as the atheists and simply say that they don't know God. Which again would make the whole idea of God, religions, scriptures and teachings completely pointless.
Not true. There is another scenario possible, where God does not judge, and still the whole idea of God, religion, scripture has importance

If you are to just make up your own idea of what God is, then what is the need for religion? religious teachers? preachers? etc.

Even as an atheist I wouldn't buy that, if it turned out that God existed, I don't think I would be able to not laugh :D
For me it's easy to see the value of religion, religious teachers etc, even if you are also free to make your own idea of God

Just has to do with being creative....:D
 

Dave Watchman

Active Member
The video, I think you must admit, did not suggest that any of the 3 people were guilty of anything like that which Ramirez was guilty, agree? Now, I personally think that when we are guilty of heinous acts, there ought to be consequences -- at the very least aimed at protecting society from anything further and attaining some sort of reparation, though I don't pretend to know what to do when reparations can''t be made. (I don't think killing is the answer though, since it doesn't achieve anything except to make us suppose that killing is not always quite so bad.)

Nope, I don't agree.

God is in charge of the repatriations.

It's not our decision.

Leave room for God's Wrath.

The god of the video told the Christian and the Muslim that they would be judged, but then he let the Atheist go.

"Your lives will come with consequences and you WILL be judged.​

But then he lets the Atheist go:

"Samuel I like you, be at peace.
LOL

But what God does accuse the Muslim and Christian of is being inauthentic, of believing on authority rather than listening to their own hearts. And scripture (and religious "teachers") are a form of authority, and must be questioned just as easily as anything else when they appear to violate our conscience, or are inconsistent.

Listening to our own hearts?

Gimme a break.

There has to be a criteria for judgement.

And so there has to be a form of Authority.

Otherwise a chaotic universe would be the rule.

Richard Ramirez listened to his heart.

Adolph Hitler listened to his heart.

"The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? - Jeremiah 17:9​

Listening to our hearts is the same as worshiping the created instead of the Creator.

That word "worship" comes from the Greek "proskuneo." It can also mean to show respect and to OBEY.

People "worship" the dragon when they follow the beast.

"Men worshiped the dragon because he had given authority to the beast, and they also worshiped the beast and asked, "Who is like the beast? Who can make war against him? - Revelation 13:4​

These guys are following, obeying, their hearts.

They make the erroneous decision because they use the wrong metric for measurement.

Their hearts.

Yet, for reasons we can't quite agree on, Christians, for most of the history of the religion, could not find any reason not to own other people as slaves, and to force their children to be likewise enslaved. Their religious texts, and their "teachers," were not up to the task of teaching that rather simple moral precept. Nor have most religions, their scriptures and "teachers," been able to convince us that making war and killing in the thousands and millions for territory, or for political disagreement, are wrong.

This also confirms my previous observations.

After the Atheist finishes their condemnation of the God of Abraham, they often will shift gears and focus their attack on the Christians themselves.

This is what the Dragon did when he couldn't get Christ.

He focused his attack on God's People, and the Dragon chased the Woman through the Foxe Book Days of Europe during the dark ages.

“If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you. - John 15:18​

Revelation mentions slavery right up until the end.

"It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, - Revelation 13:16​

We're all slave to something.

I'd rather be a servant of the Lord.

And even today, how many Muslims, how many Christians, would agree that God intends to send me to hell simply for loving another man, of caring for him when he's ill (so the state doesn't have to), and loving him physically when he is well. The atheist in me can tell with ease that this is RIGHT, just as easily as I can see that sexually abusing children, or those over whom I have power, is WRONG. I know this from examining my own authentic conscience. Religion, far too often, is incapable of that. Jews (and many Christians and Muslims) insist, for example, on mutilating the penises of their infant sons (and sometimes the clitoris and labia minora of young girls). I, as an atheist, can see the wrongness in that without even trying.

Are you talking about circumcision?

I'll have to skip that one for now.

I can't control all the denominations of the world.

And, based on my read, I don't think anyone burns in hell for infinity.

The Christians who understand hell lasting forever, can't imagine infinity.

The smoke from their torment will rise forever and ever, but the lost will be annihilated. They will be ash, dust, under the feet of the elect.

"Then you will trample on the wicked; they will be ashes under the soles of your feet on the day when I act," says the LORD Almighty. - Malachi 4:3​

Scripture isn't all you have. You have your mind and conscience.

In a way this could have been true.

IF the Bible, the Gospel, had not been preached to the ends of the Earth.

Those guys on North Sentinel Island might have been a type of Gospel unto themselves.

"For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. - Romans 2:14​

Previously, I've experimented with comparing the Atheist's argument with Elisabeth Kubler Ross's five stages of grief:
  • denial.
  • anger.
  • bargaining.
  • depression.
  • acceptance.
Denial. The Atheist says in their heart that there is no God.

Anger. If there is a God, I want to know why He lets little kids get leukemia.

Bargaining. Tell ya what, show us proof, and WE will be the deciders if God exists.

Depression. Quiet time, the Atheist goes on a break from posting.

Acceptance. When the Atheist reaches acceptance on a global scale, they will seek to kill God. Satan will gather them for that great battle in the valley that is symbolically called Megiddo. When the world is at war with God. Like it is right now.

It sounds like you're still mostly in the anger/resentment stage.

I don't know how long until the bargaining stage begins.

But I hope you can meet the god of your video.

I KNOW that I will meet the real One.

Peaceful Sabbath.
 
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Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
Peaceful Sabbath.
There's not much peace in your post, however. Nor much to give one joy in the believing of it, so I leave that to you.

As I told you, I have accepted that there is no God, and no afterlife, but I don't seek (as you put it) "to kill God." In fact, I said that if it turns out that I am wrong, I would not fear the God that I was wrong about.
 

Dave Watchman

Active Member
There's not much peace in your post, however. Nor much to give one joy in the believing of it, so I leave that to you.

Sorry about that.

I read it again, it looked too long.

I think I spaced the sentences out too far.

I wish I could think of a more joyful solution, a more palatable read.

As I told you, I have accepted that there is no God, and no afterlife, but I don't seek (as you put it) "to kill God." In fact, I said that if it turns out that I am wrong, I would not fear the God that I was wrong about.

There is no afterlife for the lost.

That is the joy in this, that is the mercy.

The God that put us here is not going to punish people for infinity, for the things done in this short life.

The serpent said you shall not surely die.

But he lied.

We are not immortal.

We HAVE a spirit, but we are not A spirit.

The spirit we have will return to the God Who gave it.

God breathed into the man's nostrils the breath of life and he became a living soul, a living "nephesh."

Nephesh (נֶ֫פֶשׁ‎ nép̄eš) is a Biblical Hebrew word which occurs in the Hebrew Bible. The word refers to the aspects of sentience, and human beings and other animals are both described as having nephesh. Plants, as an example of live organisms, are not referred in the Bible as having nephesh.​

It means a living creature.

The animals are also described as living nephesh.

The soul that sinneth, it shall die.

"The soul that sinneth, it shall surely die. - Ezekiel 18:20​

Talk is cheap, my read is that everyone will fear God on judgement day, every knee will bow when they see God.

“As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.” - Romans - 14:11​

I also read two times, the people in opposition to God, spurred on by Satan, will attempt to kill God.

And then attempt to kill God AND His People.

First at Armageddon at the second coming of Christ, and secondly, after the thousand years are finished when the dead march across the broad plain of the earth and attempt to rush the holy city.

In the second example the lost are also going after God's People inside the Beloved City.

None of that sounded too peaceful either.

But I'm told that in this life we WILL have tribulation.

Even so, come Lord Jesus.

Peaceful Sabbath.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Sorry about that.

I read it again, it looked too long.

I think I spaced the sentences out too far.

I wish I could think of a more joyful solution, a more palatable read.



There is no afterlife for the lost.

That is the joy in this, that is the mercy.

The God that put us here is not going to punish people for infinity, for the things done in this short life.

The serpent said you shall not surely die.

But he lied.

We are not immortal.

We HAVE a spirit, but we are not A spirit.

The spirit we have will return to the God Who gave it.

God breathed into the man's nostrils the breath of life and he became a living soul, a living "nephesh."

Nephesh (נֶ֫פֶשׁ‎ nép̄eš) is a Biblical Hebrew word which occurs in the Hebrew Bible. The word refers to the aspects of sentience, and human beings and other animals are both described as having nephesh. Plants, as an example of live organisms, are not referred in the Bible as having nephesh.​

It means a living creature.

The animals are also described as living nephesh.

The soul that sinneth, it shall die.

"The soul that sinneth, it shall surely die. - Ezekiel 18:20​

Talk is cheap, my read is that everyone will fear God on judgement day, every knee will bow when they see God.

“As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.” - Romans - 14:11​

I also read two times, the people in opposition to God, spurred on by Satan, will attempt to kill God.

And then attempt to kill God AND His People.

First at Armageddon at the second coming of Christ, and secondly, after the thousand years are finished when the dead march across the broad plain of the earth and attempt to rush the holy city.

In the second example the lost are also going after God's People inside the Beloved City.

None of that sounded too peaceful either.

But I'm told that in this life we WILL have tribulation.

Even so, come Lord Jesus.

Peaceful Sabbath.
Context matters. The Serpent told the truth. Have you read the myth? If you did you would know that God told Adam and Eve that they would die that day. The Serpent told Eve that she would not. Nor did she. There was no implication that she would never die. In fact if you read the myth and understood it you would know that eternal life was never part of the deal. You forgot that there were two trees in the Garden. They were not banned from eating from the other one but they never did. In fact that was one of the reasons that they were driven from the Garden. If they ate from the Tree of Life then they would have lived forever and would have become like gods themselves according the story.

It was never about a spiritual death. That was a later added interpretation when it was clear that a literal translation did not look good for God.
 

Dave Watchman

Active Member
Context matters. The Serpent told the truth. Have you read the myth? If you did you would know that God told Adam and Eve that they would die that day. The Serpent told Eve that she would not. Nor did she. There was no implication that she would never die. In fact if you read the myth and understood it you would know that eternal life was never part of the deal. You forgot that there were two trees in the Garden. They were not banned from eating from the other one but they never did. In fact that was one of the reasons that they were driven from the Garden. If they ate from the Tree of Life then they would have lived forever and would have become like gods themselves according the story.

I thought you were Atheist.

If you don't believe in God, why would you be so concerned with His tree of life?

It was never about a spiritual death. That was a later added interpretation when it was clear that a literal translation did not look good for God.

I don't think it meant a spiritual death either.

God said on the day that you eat thereof, you shall surely die.

"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.” - Genesis 2:17​

The penalty for sin is death.

"For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. - Romans 6:23​

Sin is transgression of the law.

"Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. - 1 John 3:4​

So why didn't Adam and Eve die that day?

Because Jesus stood in the way, in between God's Wrath, and fallen humanity.

If He didn't, we wouldn't be here.

This is what I think Paul was talking about with the restrainer.

Until He who now restrains it is taken out of the way.

Jesus is still holding it back, standing in between humanity, and the wrath of God.

"For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming. - 2 Thessalonians 2:7​

And even today, how many Muslims, how many Christians, would agree that God intends to send me to hell simply for loving another man, of caring for him when he's ill (so the state doesn't have to), and loving him physically when he is well.

I found a video for you guys, it's pretty corny.

And it's long.

And it's SDA.

And I don't agree with it all, but they get some things right.

Check out the five minutes from 32:00 to 38:00.

Just that five minutes looks fairly accurate to my read on the chronology of judgement day after the thousand years are finished.

 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
I thought you were Atheist.

If you don't believe in God, why would you be so concerned with His tree of life?

Some versions of God can be shown not to exist. The one that you appear to believe in for example. People that follow evil Gods, like the God of the Old Testament sometimes do evil acts.

I don't think it meant a spiritual death either.

God said on the day that you eat thereof, you shall surely die.

"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.” - Genesis 2:17​

The penalty for sin is death.

"For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. - Romans 6:23​

Sin is transgression of the law.

"Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. - 1 John 3:4​

So why didn't Adam and Eve die that day?

Because Jesus stood in the way, in between God's Wrath, and fallen humanity.

Wow!! Just wow!. Now that is totally unsupported by the Bible. So Jesus, who was not to be born for quite a while, got in the way of God somehow. Interesting. Still, God lied according to you.

If He didn't, we wouldn't be here.

I am sorry to interrupt so soon, but no. That is not the case. The story is a myth so it has nothing at all to do with whether we are here or not.

This is what I think Paul was talking about with the restrainer.

Until He who now restrains it is taken out of the way.

Jesus is still holding it back, standing in between humanity, and the wrath of God.

"For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way. And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming. - 2 Thessalonians 2:7​

So Jesus stands between man and God's unjustified wrath. Why is God mad at humans? According to the myth he was the one that screwed up.
 

Nimos

Well-Known Member
Not true. There is another scenario possible, where God does not judge, and still the whole idea of God, religion, scripture has importance
So if there is no judgement in the video.

Why does the atheist go straight to heaven, is saved or where ever he goes, while the muslim and christian does not?

For me it's easy to see the value of religion, religious teachers etc, even if you are also free to make your own idea of God

Just has to do with being creative....:D
I would disagree, again im speaking about the video. If God does not approve of the muslim or the christian person's understanding of him, then clearly they must be wrong as he take the time trying to make them understand all the errors they made, while the atheist flies right through simply for not believing in him at all. At least the religious people tried or saw something beyond themselves. That God is unable to give them correct guidance and completely failed with the atheist, is no one's fault except his.

Religion or a religious teacher would have no value in this scenario, because neither the christian or the muslim were apparently aware of whether they were right or wrong. So even if a religious teacher had taught them something, either they wouldn't know which teacher was right or clearly it must have been a teacher teaching the wrong things, since God tells them that they are wrong.

Either way, that makes it pointless as they would never know which of these would be the case before they stand before God. They might as well roll a dice or choose a random teacher and hope that one is the real deal. Or even better become an atheist, as that is clearly the win-win situation based on the video :)
 
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