metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
What you don't seem to realize is that Islam is far more diverse than what you're posting here. Same with Christianity.
BTW, the Bible is not at all tolerant of other faiths if one takes what it says literally.
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Persecution of Christians
- Thread starter Teritos
- Start date
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- Tags
- bible christians god jesus
BTW, the Bible is not at all tolerant of other faiths if one takes what it says literally.
Orbit
I'm a planet
You are cherry picking to stir up hate.
Teritos
Active Member
Rape means forced sex, this is not described in this passage.
Leviticus 18
exchemist
Veteran Member
Ah, so you are relying on the context to interpret the instruction to kill. Very good. Now can we please have some context for the passages from the Koran that you are concerned about?
For instance, I've looked briefly at the second quote and found this, which says idolators not disbelievers: Why does the Quran say that infidels should be killed?
So at the very least there may be translation issues that complicate the picture, just as we find with biblical interpretation.
stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
When our Law Books change, do you still use the old rules given previously, or do you stick to the new rules?
Or to make it more easy:
1) At first W.H.O. and/or presidents advised not to bother about distance and/or masks etc., but when they got smarter, they changed their advise
2) Do you stick with Windows 95 or XP, or do you grow along with new knowledge and move on to Windows 7 or even Windows 10?
Maybe Windows 10 is also 15% of all the previous operating systems, but still I ignore the old ones now
Teritos
Active Member
There is no difference between an idolater and a disbeliever, these are words that mean the same thing.
An idolater is always a disbeliever.
The definition of rape is complex and differs from country to country and dictionary to dictionary. They all have one thing in common though. "... without the consent of the victim"
That passage is clear that the women were captive and to be used for sex whether they consented of not and i very much doubt that a woman taken captive after seeing her family slaughtered is going to consent... Do you?
You keep on about Leviticus 18. What has this to do with anyone who does not follow your god? And of course, it does not answer the question "what is sexual immorality? "
exchemist
Veteran Member
But a disbeliever is not necessarily an idolator. Rather obviously.
stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Translation and interpretation usual is a problem indeed. Even more blindly following, when not fully enlightened.
But "killing idolators" does not make it better than "killing disbelievers"
It would be much clearer if he had said something like "kill those who try to kill you"
So, I would not be surprised that this "killing instruction" easily gets misinterpret and ends up in extra killings, esp. when people are not educated well. We have seen plenty of this happening in name of the Bible too (double the amount of violent verses as compared to Koran).
And who were well educated in those years, let alone be able to read such Scriptures (even I find it hard to read/understand cerrtain Koran verses now)? So, from an educational POV, it does not seem like the smartest 'choice of words' in my opinion; unless the purpose was to test people if they use "common sense" above "divine scriptural instructions" (with the goal that common sense is more important than blindly trust others)
I'm almost through reading it. It's just a few verses though, but they are critical scriptures.
Riders
Well-Known Member
I am in the USA. Christians are not persecuted very much in the USA. statistics say Jewish folks are persecuted most in the USA with more bombing of Jewish temples than any other religion.
I live in Texas and have been harassed and seen Christians harass non-Christians out here a lot. So in countries where Christians is persecuted, I have no answer because I don't know anything about those countries.
I know the USA is not on your list. I think it's the other way around here where Christians persecute non-christians.
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Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
Rape is nonconsensual sex. And the verse does describe that.
Do you do a series of these on other beliefs and non-beliefs, or is your analysis of persecution globally focused solely on Christians?
Perhaps a more interesting question for Christians is in how many Christian countries have Jews been persecuted?
lukethethird
unknown member
Oh brother.
QuestioningMind
Well-Known Member
Who is the 'Left' you speak of?
firedragon
Veteran Member
Ah the internet cherry picking has begun. Lets see who could do cherry picking better. What you say? Lets play that Childs game.
Kill People Who Don’t Listen to Priests
Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12)
Kill Witches
You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17)
Kill Homosexuals
“If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abomile deed; they have forfeited their lives.” (Leviticus 20:13)
Kill Fortunetellers
A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27)
Death for Hitting Dad
Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15)
Death for Cursing Parents
1) If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. (Proverbs 20:20)
2) All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20:9)
Death for Adultery
If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10)
Death for Fornication
A priest’s daughter who loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father also, shall be burned to death. (Leviticus 21:9 )
Death to Followers of Other Religions
Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 )
Kill Nonbelievers
They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 )
Kill False Prophets
If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, “You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord.” When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through. (Zechariah 13:3 )
firedragon
Veteran Member
Hahahahaha. This is one of the most stupendous false interpretations I have heard done as arbitrarily as only one could achieve.
Tell me mate. Since you are such an expert in the subject enough to reinterpret them, is this a mathrook hadith or Sarih?
And is there any Kiyas or linguistic analysis to your interpretation that "Pig" or Hinzeer means "Christians" or "Annasaara"?
Will be waiting.
Samael_Khan
Goosebender
The Mosaic Law had similar rules persecuting others in Israel so I don't know why you are getting so upset about it. When the Israelites conquered other nations God told them to even slaughter the women, children and animals. Your God said that.