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WHY I BELIEVE THAT CHRIST IS GOD

firedragon

firedragon

Veteran Member
cOLTER said:
The Trinity is fixed in its eternal place, Jesus the Creator Son is a creation of the Trinity. But they are all indistinguishable unified in spirit. We can only know them as One.
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Since Jesus is one of the Trinity, how could he be a creation of the trinity?
 
Colt

Colt

Well-Known Member
firedragon said:
Where does it say that the woman was on earth?

As far as I know, ereemon means an empty, desolate, uninhabited land. Thats not referring to earth. One can never mean "earth". Also, even if you wish this desert to be earth, yet, this is after the birth of her child. The birth takes place in heaven. If this child is Jesus, the war in heaven occurs. How could Michael in this war with all his angels fighting with this dragon with all his angels be the same child? It says "Kai", which means it is concurrent or immediate events.

With all of this, how could this Michael and Jesus be the same person?
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The war `in heaven broke out looooong ago, before Adam and Eve arrived. It was terminated when Michael was incarnate on earth.

It says after her child was born she fled to the wilderness, that's not some other place out in space.

5And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

6And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.




Joseph, Mary, and Jesus Escape to Egypt
13 Now after they had gone away, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared in a dream to Joseph, saying, “Get up, take the child and his mother and flee to Egypt, and stay there until I tell you. For Herod is about to seek the child to destroy him.”

thousand two hundred and threescore days.= 3 1/2 years ;)

When Jesus said "The kingdom of heaven is within you" did he mean you've gone off the planet to another place???
 
firedragon

firedragon

Veteran Member
cOLTER said:
The war `in heaven broke out looooong ago, before Adam and Eve arrived. It was terminated when Michael was incarnate on earth.

It says after her child was born she fled to the wilderness, that's not some other place out in space.
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If the war happened "long ago before Adam", then that happened after this woman, the birth, and the so called "wilderness" episode. So if this woman was Mary, she "according to you" lived before Adam.

Thanks for your engagement. There is no logical basis, nor are there any scriptural basis for your Jesus=Michael theology. I find it strange that you ignored what I said about this things happened one after another and your own Bible says "and" which does not mean "years before".

So I believe that's the end of discussion. Thank you very much COLTER. Cheers.
 
Colt

Colt

Well-Known Member
firedragon said:
If the war happened "long ago before Adam", then that happened after this woman, the birth, and the so called "wilderness" episode. So if this woman was Mary, she "according to you" lived before Adam.

Thanks for your engagement. There is no logical basis, nor are there any scriptural basis for your Jesus=Michael theology. I find it strange that you ignored what I said about this things happened one after another and your own Bible says "and" which does not mean "years before".

So I believe that's the end of discussion. Thank you very much COLTER. Cheers.
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Revelation is very symbolic, poetic. If you take everything so literally in the Bible then it will be a mess. Besides, I don't believe the Book of Revelation is what was originally revealed to John on Patmos. Its been compromised by apocalyptic writers.
 
Colt

Colt

Well-Known Member
firedragon said:
Since Jesus is one of the Trinity, how could he be a creation of the trinity?
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Jesus isn't one of the Trinity, he's is one in spirit with God. 1/3 of a Trinity cant leave and become a Baby. It would no longer be a Trinity.
 
firedragon

firedragon

Veteran Member
cOLTER said:
Jesus isn't one of the Trinity, he's is one in spirit with God. 1/3 of a Trinity cant leave and become a Baby. It would no longer be a Trinity.
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You said Jesus was a creation "of the trinity". So if he is, then how could he be one with God?

Thats an oxymoron.
 
firedragon

firedragon

Veteran Member
cOLTER said:
Revelation is very symbolic, poetic. If you take everything so literally in the Bible then it will be a mess. Besides, I don't believe the Book of Revelation is what was originally revealed to John on Patmos. Its been compromised by apocalyptic writers.
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I dont take any of them literally.

But you have taken most of these verses quite literally, but when it comes to the word "and", only that is symbolic?

Is the word and symbolic, or does it mean "prior to this" in your simple vocabulary? In order to confirm your theory that Michael was Jesus, and Mary was the woman who gave birth, since it happened before Michaels fight with the dragon, and you claiming this happened before Adam, then Mary was alive before Adam and gave birth to Jesus before Adam and Eve.

I am saying this for the second time explicitly because it is obvious you ignored this simple logic.
 
Colt

Colt

Well-Known Member
firedragon said:
You said Jesus was a creation "of the trinity". So if he is, then how could he be one with God?

Thats an oxymoron.
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Unified in spirit, "I am in the Father and the Father is in me" "If you have seen me you have seen the Father".
 
Colt

Colt

Well-Known Member
firedragon said:
I dont take any of them literally.

But you have taken most of these verses quite literally, but when it comes to the word "and", only that is symbolic?

Is the word and symbolic, or does it mean "prior to this" in your simple vocabulary? In order to confirm your theory that Michael was Jesus, and Mary was the woman who gave birth, since it happened before Michaels fight with the dragon, and you claiming this happened before Adam, then Mary was alive before Adam and gave birth to Jesus before Adam and Eve.

I am saying this for the second time explicitly because it is obvious you ignored this simple logic.
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I didn't happen before Michaels fight with the dragon. Its a prose concerning a long period of time beginning before Adam even came to earth.
 
Colt

Colt

Well-Known Member
firedragon said:
Then how could Jesus be a creation of the trinity?

Do you understand this question?
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Because Jesus is of Trinity origin as a divine Son. Jesus or Christ Michael bad a beginning at some point in the eternal past. He is very much like the Father.
 
firedragon

firedragon

Veteran Member
cOLTER said:
I didn't happen before Michaels fight with the dragon. Its a prose concerning a long period of time beginning before Adam even came to earth.
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Even if all of this happened before Adam, the mother and childbirth happened before Michaels war.

Please read that episode again.
 
Colt

Colt

Well-Known Member
firedragon said:
Even if all of this happened before Adam, the mother and childbirth happened before Michaels war.

Please read that episode again.
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If the women referred to in the narrative is Mary then the war in heaven happened long before Mary.
 
firedragon

firedragon

Veteran Member
cOLTER said:
If the women referred to in the narrative is Mary then the war in heaven happened long before Mary.
Click to expand...

You are directly contradicting the episode as written in Revelations.

Anyway, thanks for making me get your theological beliefs. Cheers.
 
firedragon

firedragon

Veteran Member
cOLTER said:
No, the Trinity is the source of Sons, but to us they are all just God.
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1. The trinity has only two? Thats the question. Is it two or three? Is the Holy Ghost also part of it?

2. And if Jesus was a creation of the trinity, including the Holy Ghost, then how could Jesus be part of the same trinity? Impossible. Its an oxymoron.

Simple questions brother.
 
Colt

Colt

Well-Known Member
firedragon said:
1. The trinity has only two? Thats the question. Is it two or three? Is the Holy Ghost also part of it?

2. And if Jesus was a creation of the trinity, including the Holy Ghost, then how could Jesus be part of the same trinity? Impossible. Its an oxymoron.

Simple questions brother.
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The Trinity has Father, Son and Spirit, all of which are a the I AM. That Trinity created Jesus who is our Creator Son. His Father is our Grandfather. All of these divine beings are unified indistinguishably as One in spirit, they are God to us. Its non-understandable to the finite mind.
 
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