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Another thread on Islam, Muslims and terrorism, because its needed for some

firedragon

Veteran Member
Yes. Below video is only 2 minutes but makes clear why people get such thoughts

The Paris Charlie Hebdo killer's family is proud of their son to kill the people who blasphemed Islam in Paris. Peace be upon them. So sick.

So you think "MUSLIMS" are more terrorists than any other theology or movement? Really? I understand this guy mad, but I really thought that you had more sophistication.

Its because of you that I would answer this question this way. Lets take all religions and all of their battles. I mean it, all of them. Throughout history there were thousands of wars fought by people, and according to an extensive research based book called the encyclopaedia of wars by Charles and Allen, only 7% of all of them wars had any relationship to motivation of theology. Do you understand? Which means directly and very plainly 93% of all wars they recorded were due to political agenda, property, territory, power, money etc. So what ever evidence one could provide against any religion, it immediately fails in this demonisation.

The most dangerous terrorist group in the world was the LTTE, and they killed 180k innocent people. They grandfathered the suicide belt. But you seem to have missed them. You see brother, what do you think their motivation was? Was it Hinduism? Because they were predominantly Hindus. Was it Christianity? Because the leader and his family were Christians. His son was Charles Anthony. Was it Leninism? Because the views were leninist. What are you gonna blame it on?

You are contending that Muslims are more inclined to terrorism because of people like this. Well, there are idiots all over the place, but its not very well researched a thesis to demonise Muslims as more inclined that way because it is evidently not, that is, if you do a research, not be motivated by whats famous. There are terrorist groups like ISIS. Now lets listen to Baghdadi's sermon to his followers. Does he quote theology? Not really. He speaks a very nice, enticing language to motivate his followers. It sounds nice. Think of a chance to rule the world. It motivates people. Especially those who were battered into oblivion by aerial enemies. This is the social weapon used by these people. If you wish to study this a little read up on Robert A Pape or Rohan Gunaratne. Read extensively.

There is a problem with some Muslims and there is no denial of it. But you should also make good analysis of all, not be motivated by whats famous.

Peace.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
The most dangerous terrorist group in the world was the LTTE, and they killed 180k innocent people. They grandfathered the suicide belt. But you seem to have missed them.
I have been in Sri Lanka in those years. My brother in Law is Tamil from Sri Lanka who had to escape from Sri Lanka or be killed.

what do you think their motivation was? Was it Hinduism?
It started out with fighting for a peace of land of their own, and fight against them being discriminated. Fighting against discrimination, I can understand.

The problem I point out in Islam fanatics is not about them being discriminated, but they discriminate, seeing Islam as a religion for all to comply with or that Islam is meant also for others, when they impose "don't draw Muhammad" on the world. That is bad and dangerous. Any religion believing "My way is the highway for all" are potential threats IMO. It needs one Hitler to go terribly wrong. And now with nukes almost for sale on the internet it is more dangerous than ever.

This arrogant attitude is plain "Spiritual Ego", and IMO the most dangerous of all; I do not underestimate this fact.:
1) Imposing on the world "do not draw Muhammad" adding "or we nuke your country" is very dangerous as it can inflame million half-fanatics in 1 sec
2) Praising Paris killing as if it is Allah's wish that blasphemers are killed is inciting hate towards about all humans except Muslims

Of course that is all my opinion. Time will tell.
 
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firedragon

Veteran Member
I have been in Sri Lanka in those years. My brother in Law is Tamil from Sri Lanka who had to escape from Sri Lanka or be killed.


It started out with fighting for a peace of land of their own, and fight against them being discriminated. Fighting against discrimination, I can understand.

The problem I point out in Islam fanatics is not about them being discriminated, but they discriminate, seeing Islam as a religion for all to comply with or that Islam is meant also for others, when they impose "don't draw Muhammad" on the world. That is bad and dangerous. Any religion believing "My way is the highway for all" are potential threats IMO. It needs one Hitler to go terribly wrong. And now with nukes almost for sale on the internet it is more dangerous than ever.

This arrogant attitude is plain "Spiritual Ego", and IMO the most dangerous of all; I do not underestimate this fact.:
1) Imposing on the world "do not draw Muhammad" adding "or we nuke your country" is very dangerous as it can inflame million half-fanatics in 1 sec
2) Praising Paris killing as if it is Allah's wish that blasphemers are killed is inciting hate towards about all humans except Muslims

Of course that is all my opinion. Time will tell.

Well, I agree.

But this praising Paris killing is very scarce. I am Muslim, and obviously I know many. So far I have not met a single person who praised the Paris killing. Yet, I do acknowledge there are places where you get these most dumb fanatics who do.

Nevertheless, this subject cannot be generalised based on subjective experience brother. The only way is to read research well done, that's why I gave you two authoritative guys, not just theologians who praise their religions or bogus pseudo scholars who write to make money by scare mongering. As soon as you read you would know who has the research and not incidental "wow" factors that makes up his thesis.

Peace.
 

PruePhillip

Well-Known Member
Lol. Ill tell you what. Since you are obsessed with making this an Islam vs Christianity, Quran vs Bible kind of thread, let me help you with it by doing something similar to what you are doing. I am sure you will provide the same apologetics seen on the internet. Go ahead. Its gonna be interesting.

Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God

Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. “The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him.” (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 )

Kill Women Who Are Not Virgins On Their Wedding Night

But if this charge is true (that she wasn’t a virgin on her wedding night), and evidence of the girls virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her fathers house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against Israel by her unchasteness in her father’s house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst. (Deuteronomy 22:20-21 )

Kill Followers of Other Religions.

1) If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death, because he sought to lead you astray from the Lord, your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, that place of slavery. And all Israel, hearing of this, shall fear and never do such evil as this in your midst. (Deuteronomy 13:7-12 )

2) Suppose a man or woman among you, in one of your towns that the LORD your God is giving you, has done evil in the sight of the LORD your God and has violated the covenant by serving other gods or by worshiping the sun, the moon, or any of the forces of heaven, which I have strictly forbidden. When you hear about it, investigate the matter thoroughly. If it is true that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, then that man or woman must be taken to the gates of the town and stoned to death. (Deuteronomy 17:2-5 )

Death for Blasphemy

One day a man who had an Israelite mother and an Egyptian father got into a fight with one of the Israelite men. During the fight, this son of an Israelite woman blasphemed the LORD’s name. So the man was brought to Moses for judgment. His mother’s name was Shelomith. She was the daughter of Dibri of the tribe of Dan. They put the man in custody until the LORD’s will in the matter should become clear. Then the LORD said to Moses, “Take the blasphemer outside the camp, and tell all those who heard him to lay their hands on his head. Then let the entire community stone him to death. Say to the people of Israel: Those who blaspheme God will suffer the consequences of their guilt and be punished. Anyone who blasphemes the LORD’s name must be stoned to death by the whole community of Israel. Any Israelite or foreigner among you who blasphemes the LORD’s name will surely die.(Leviticus 24:10-16 )

Sure, that's Judaism. I am not a Jew.
But on that matter - it was pointed out in the 'Old Testament' (Jewish Tanakh) that more often than not
the Jews refused to obey these edicts. What happened in the end was that the people they allowed to
live amongst them turned them into pagans - and the bible states they lost their land because of that.
It's backed up with archaeology - if scientists dig up a Jewish grave from the period of the 5th or 6th
Century you can bet it's a pre-Babylonian captivity grave if it has pagan statues in it. After Babylon the Jews
'put aside' their idols. But then they tolerated the Greeks and then invited the Romans in. With fatal results.
 

PruePhillip

Well-Known Member
Romans 13:4:

For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer.
[/QUOTE]

Christianity isn't Judaism. And the quote here is a warning what TEMPORAL rulers will do.
They are "God's servants" in that they apply the law of the land, ie don't kill, don't steal etc..
These rulers were pagan and it was considered a deep shame if a Christian suffered at the
hands of such a ruler, not for being a Christian, but being a criminal in the law of the land.
 

Spirit of Light

Be who ever you want
As a peaceful muslim i see the word different then those who do evil, is there bad muslims in this world? Yes they are human beings who have not seen the true islam, islam is a path within our self, no need to harm others islam is a path of finding the true being you are. Not a path of hating non believers or other religions.

To be a good muslim is to find your own faults and fixing them. Not about making others become like you by force or hate :)

May the peace be up on you.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
Sure, that's Judaism. I am not a Jew.
But on that matter - it was pointed out in the 'Old Testament' (Jewish Tanakh) that more often than not
the Jews refused to obey these edicts. What happened in the end was that the people they allowed to
live amongst them turned them into pagans - and the bible states they lost their land because of that.
It's backed up with archaeology - if scientists dig up a Jewish grave from the period of the 5th or 6th
Century you can bet it's a pre-Babylonian captivity grave if it has pagan statues in it. After Babylon the Jews
'put aside' their idols. But then they tolerated the Greeks and then invited the Romans in. With fatal results.

Nah. This is your own method. No analysis. Just blind belief. Here you go. Your explanations are not necessary because according to your own position, no analysis needed.

Kill People Who Don’t Listen to Priests

Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12)

Kill Witches

You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17)

Kill Homosexuals
“If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abomile deed; they have forfeited their lives.” (Leviticus 20:13)

Kill Fortunetellers

A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27)

Death for Hitting Dad

Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15)

Death for Cursing Parents

1) If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. (Proverbs 20:20)

2) All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20:9)

Death for Adultery

If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10)

Death for Fornication

A priest’s daughter who loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father also, shall be burned to death. (Leviticus 21:9 )

Death to Followers of Other Religions

Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 )

Kill Nonbelievers

They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 )
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Well, I agree.

But this praising Paris killing is very scarce. I am Muslim, and obviously I know many. So far I have not met a single person who praised the Paris killing. Yet, I do acknowledge there are places where you get these most dumb fanatics who do.
Thanks, good to hear. Having seen PM of Pakistan in the news, it seems there will be more in Pakistan. I also think that Muslims who live in the West value freedom and are educated and are used to other values now, so they will not easily be drawn to ISIS, although I am very surprised how many Europeans joined ISIS, having lived so long in the West. That shows that the danger is very real. IF there is a convincing Hitler type people are known to be still gullible.

In some countries people are even brainwashed that America (or the West) is bad (North Korea and I heard a Chinese say that many Chinese hate America and Americans). Then it's easy to understand that extremism flares up more easy on issues like this, because there is already so much hate and probably jealousy towards the West.

Nevertheless, this subject cannot be generalised based on subjective experience brother. The only way is to read research well done, that's why I gave you two authoritative guys, not just theologians who praise their religions or bogus pseudo scholars who write to make money by scare mongering. As soon as you read you would know who has the research and not incidental "wow" factors that makes up his thesis.
I did not generalize the subject based on a subjective experience. I gave my opinion, using my common sense and my insight, and I just explained why it made sense to me, that Muslims are more prone to terrorism than other groups. By the way, as I said already, this is for all groups thinking "I am superior, my way is the highway etc". That is not only Islam or not even only Religious.

There are even more violent verses in the Bible. So, Christians are also prone to it, because there are verses which can be easily interpreted that way, and it takes insight to see it in another way. And with another Hitler it can be easily inflamed again. Luckily evolution continues steadily.

Even quite a few Bahais believe that finally all have to go through Bahaullah to get to the final goal, so here we have the same "my way is the highway", so even Bahai might be prone to terrorism. BUT there is a huge difference in Scriptures. I have not read much, but I can not recall verses about "cutting of hands and feet and heads" or other barbarian verses, which is understandable, as it was already 1850, so evolution did a good job.

My grandfather fought in WW2 against Hitler, and though not a teacher, he spend the last 30 years of his life going around Holland teaching children history about WW2 and the danger that is still there, as there is still fascism. I went to Berlin when the wall was taken down, and I have seen with my own eyes and heard with my own ears many Germans praise Hitler, and that was like 40 years after WW2. So my grandfather was right that this extremism is still there and very dangerous.

And my grandfather knew through personal experiences that it's wiser to do something now, as he had experienced the cruelty in the war (he had "einzelhaft" for ca. 9 month). It's better not to wait till the war starts. Don't wait till it's too late, when such problems exists "I am better than you", which many Religions have, and white supremacists and many other groups, it's best to address it on a daily basis till it's rooted out completely.

Such people need to be brainwashed that "all humans are equal, and some are not more equal than others" and better do it sooner than later

Note: The above is of course all my personal opinion
 
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firedragon

Veteran Member
Thanks, good to hear. Having seen PM of Pakistan in the news, it seems there will be more in Pakistan. I also think that Muslims who live in the West value freedom and are educated and are used to other values now, so they will not easily be drawn to ISIS, although I am very surprised how many Europeans joined ISIS, having lived so long in the West. That shows that the danger is very real. IF there is a convincing Hitler type people are known to be still gullible.

In some countries people are even brainwashed that America (or the West) is bad (North Korea and I heard a Chinese say that many Chinese hate America and Americans). Then it's easy to understand that extremism flares up more easy on issues like this, because there is already so much hate and probably jealousy towards the West.

You know what? Its not that I would like to be a bigot or anything, but this is my personal observation that in Pakistan they have more of this kind of fanatical nonsense than any other country. Of course you may dismiss this as anecdotal since I have not done any kind of quantitative research in Pakistan. But honestly, the source of most of this nonsense come from Pakistan which is actually one of the latest established Muslim countries in the world.

There are even more violent verses in the Bible.

Violent verses in any scripture has never been proven to have had any effect. In sociology of religion, through extensive research you would learn that it is the circumstantial political environments that triggers people to use these violent verses for their purposes. Do you understand? If the Bible never had any violent verses, the people who need to be violent would another source to communicate their agenda. If the Bible never existed, they would still find some other method to communicate their agenda. Thats bottomline. It is stupid and childish to blame things on a scripture. Some do because its good money, but its very lame. Bro, I am not quoting you. I am just telling you for the purposes of discussion.

"my way is the highway",

My way or the highway you mean. ;)

Brother. Everyone eventually believes that. Maybe you dont, but that's you. But most do. Anyway, that's another whole theological discussion. That kind of thing cannot be said in one post and its absolutely unfair to do so. Thus, I shall respectfully refrain.
 

PruePhillip

Well-Known Member
Nah. This is your own method. No analysis. Just blind belief. Here you go. Your explanations are not necessary because according to your own position, no analysis needed.

Kill People Who Don’t Listen to Priests

Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12)

Kill Witches

You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17)

Kill Homosexuals
“If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abomile deed; they have forfeited their lives.” (Leviticus 20:13)

Kill Fortunetellers

A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27)

Death for Hitting Dad

Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15)

Death for Cursing Parents

1) If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. (Proverbs 20:20)

2) All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20:9)

Death for Adultery

If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10)

Death for Fornication

A priest’s daughter who loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father also, shall be burned to death. (Leviticus 21:9 )

Death to Followers of Other Religions

Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 )

Kill Nonbelievers

They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 )

Sure, that's the law of the Tanakh. That's not Christianity. If you want to know what Christianity
believes then read the Sermon on the Mount Matt 5,6 and 7.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
Sure, that's the law of the Tanakh. That's not Christianity. If you want to know what Christianity
believes then read the Sermon on the Mount Matt 5,6 and 7.

See, this is your own standard. Where no explanation, no analysis is entertained.

Murdering Children

Kill Sons of Sinners

Make ready to slaughter his sons for the guilt of their fathers; Lest they rise and posses the earth, and fill the breadth of the world with tyrants. (Isaiah 14:21 )

God Will Kill Children

The glory of Israel will fly away like a bird, for your children will die at birth or perish in the womb or never even be conceived. Even if your children do survive to grow up, I will take them from you. It will be a terrible day when I turn away and leave you alone. I have watched Israel become as beautiful and pleasant as Tyre. But now Israel will bring out her children to be slaughtered.” O LORD, what should I request for your people? I will ask for wombs that don’t give birth and breasts that give no milk. The LORD says, “All their wickedness began at Gilgal; there I began to hate them. I will drive them from my land because of their evil actions. I will love them no more because all their leaders are rebels. The people of Israel are stricken. Their roots are dried up; they will bear no more fruit. And if they give birth, I will slaughter their beloved children.” (Hosea 9:11-16 )

Kill Men, Women, and Children

“Then I heard the LORD say to the other men, “Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all – old and young, girls and women and little children. But do not touch anyone with the mark. Begin your task right here at the Temple.” So they began by killing the seventy leaders. “Defile the Temple!” the LORD commanded. “Fill its courtyards with the bodies of those you kill! Go!” So they went throughout the city and did as they were told.” (Ezekiel 9:5-7 )

God Kills all the First Born of Egypt

And at midnight the LORD killed all the firstborn sons in the land of Egypt, from the firstborn son of Pharaoh, who sat on the throne, to the firstborn son of the captive in the dungeon. Even the firstborn of their livestock were killed. Pharaoh and his officials and all the people of Egypt woke up during the night, and loud wailing was heard throughout the land of Egypt. There was not a single house where someone had not died. (Exodus 12:29-30 )

Kill Old Men and Young Women

“You are my battle-ax and sword,” says the LORD. “With you I will shatter nations and destroy many kingdoms. With you I will shatter armies, destroying the horse and rider, the chariot and charioteer. With you I will shatter men and women, old people and children, young men and maidens. With you I will shatter shepherds and flocks, farmers and oxen, captains and rulers. “As you watch, I will repay Babylon and the people of Babylonia for all the wrong they have done to my people in Jerusalem,” says the LORD. “Look, O mighty mountain, destroyer of the earth! I am your enemy,” says the LORD. “I will raise my fist against you, to roll you down from the heights. When I am finished, you will be nothing but a heap of rubble. You will be desolate forever. Even your stones will never again be used for building. You will be completely wiped out,” says the LORD. (Jeremiah 51:20-26)

(Note that after God promises the Israelites a victory against Babylon, the Israelites actually get their butts kicked by them in the next chapter. So much for an all-knowing and all-powerful God.)

God Will Kill the Children of Sinners

If even then you remain hostile toward me and refuse to obey, I will inflict you with seven more disasters for your sins. I will release wild animals that will kill your children and destroy your cattle, so your numbers will dwindle and your roads will be deserted. (Leviticus 26:21-22 )
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
Do you really think that Muslims are terrorists much more than anyone else from any movement or theology?

Today, that is undeniably the case.

Is it innate to Muslims? Why do you think what you think?

Clearly, there is a very violent, very radical and very intolerant branch / version of islam that is poisoning these people's minds. This seems again to be undeniably the case.
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
Haha. I was expecting that actually. So please do quote the Quran for your statements. Lets see some lists you could cut and paste from some website that has them. Lets test them. Go on. ;)

Instead of getting into an endless debate about what the quran says (which will inevitably end up in you telling us that we don't understand it because we are reading mistranslations or whatever - been there before), let's just discuss how islam is practiced in actual islamic countries.


Name me an islamic country where gay people are allowed to openly be gay.
In what % of islamic countries are gay people oppressed one way or the other (be it violently or otherwise) as a rule of thumb? In what % of islamic countries are gay people allowed to openly be gay?



Surely if the quran isn't homophobic, we would expect islamic countries to reflect that, right?


...



Right?



:rolleyes:
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
Islamic terrorism is encouraged and ultimately (basically) controlled at the top by the world revolutionary movement (wrm) ... I mean the people who are basically behind all revolutions and political upheaval around the world. So, the point of Islamic terrorism is the following:
  • Provide a boogeyman. They can invade many countries on this excuse and they can also create police states in countries they already control for the purpose of the so called war on terror.
  • It furthers the goal of discrediting the major religions of the world. This time it's to discredit Islam but also in the minds of many people it discredits religion in general.
  • It also provides a cover story for their own covert operations around the world. They can do what they "need" to do and blame it on terrorism. It's simple.
  • Money, funding and advancement of the military industrial complex.
How they do it. They control everything from the top. They definitely aren't the ones blowing themselves up in suicide attacks. They control terrorist organizations. Unfortunately the people who suffer and die are useful idiots and those they destroy for the cause of "Jihad" ... so they think anyway.

This is just conspiracy nonsense.

A US president couldn't even manage to keep it a secret that he was getting blowjobs from his intern secretary. But somehow a conspiracy of this size, necessarily involving thousands upon thousands of people from all over the world, and spanning multiple decades, remains the perfect secret?

Please.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Do you really think that Muslims are terrorists much more than anyone else from any movement or theology?

Today, that is undeniably the case.
Yes, today that seems to be the case to me too.

And to me it's clear that theology motivated is more dangerous than not theological motivated. IF your God/Book 'tells' to kill, is quite a motivator

Clearly, there is a very violent, very radical and very intolerant branch / version of islam that is poisoning these people's minds. This seems again to be undeniably the case.
IMO: As long as Islam as a whole does not fight this publicly it stays. Their "Pope" should instruct publicly to their sheep that this kind of Islam is wrong. They should teach that other (non) religions are okay and that Islam is not any better than these. That would be a good step. "We are better" idea is the main problem.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
Yes, today that seems to be the case to me too.

And to me it's clear that theology motivated is more dangerous than not theological motivated. IF your God/Book 'tells' to kill, is quite a motivator


IMO: As long as Islam as a whole does not fight this publicly it stays. Their "Pope" should instruct publicly to their sheep that this kind of Islam is wrong. They should teach that other (non) religions are okay and that Islam is not any better than these. That would be a good step. "We are better" idea is the main problem.

Ah. I guess you did not read my post at all.

No problem brother. Most people do not wish to explore anything but stick to their idea about another religion. So that's how it goes.

Peace.
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
So please do quote the Quran for your statements

let's just discuss how islam is practiced in actual islamic countries
Makes sense. Lots of barbarian practices and so much discrimination (kill apostates/gay). And even ISIS kills more Muslims than non-Muslims

Name me an islamic country where gay people are allowed to openly be gay.
IF Koran is perfect and book of God THEN all Islamic countries should have the same rules. Killing gay and apostates is far from perfect.

Surely if the quran isn't homophobic, we would expect islamic countries to reflect that, right?
This is the best argument I read in a long time. No smart Muslim will be able to argue that.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
Makes sense. Lots of barbarian practices and so much discrimination (kill apostates/gay). And even ISIS kills more Muslims than non-Muslims


IF Koran is perfect and book of God THEN all Islamic countries should have the same rules. Killing gay and apostates is far from perfect.


This is the best argument I read in a long time. No smart Muslim will be able to argue that.

Hmm. So lets see. Do you think because in India Sathi was practiced the Hindu scripture are bad and violent or even monstrous? I mean I dont think there are more demonic things than that anywhere in the world.

So applying your own standard I would say that Hinduism and all the Hindu scriptures are the most monstrous mainstream theological monstrosity in the world. I dont think this, I am only applying your standard to this.

What do you think?
 

stvdv

Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
Ah. I guess you did not read my post at all.

No problem brother. Most people do not wish to explore anything but stick to their idea about another religion. So that's how it goes.

Peace.
Could you explain why you think that I did not read your post at all? Because I can assure you that I read it quite well.

And besides that, I replied to @TagliatelliMonster his reply (I did put your quote to make clear what we reply to)
 
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