The Gospel shall be preached to all nations and then the end shall come

Aupmanyav said:

You mean no Christian dies young, no Christian gets Coronavirus! Yes, I am interested.
Any idea when Christ is likely to come. People have been saying that for 2000 years.
Let death be there. Without death mankind would be exticnt earlier. We are already too crowded.
Same for eternal life.
Satan does not come under Jesus' or God's rule?
This is 21st Century, URAVIP2ME, What you say worked till middle ages. Now it only seems ignorance.

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Thank you for your reply.
If we think back to the original offer given to Adam and Eve they could 'live forever on Earth' as long as they did Not break God's Law.
Earth was Not a stepping stone to another place. Earth was and is: Home - Psalms 115:16
Earth abides forever (Ecclesiastes 1:4 B) what will Not abide forever are the wicked - Psalms 92:7; Psalms 104:35.
We may seem overcrowded now, but Scripture says even the dessert will blossom - Isaiah 35th chapter.
The resurrection is for the righteous and unrighteous, Not the wicked - Acts of the Apostles 24:15.
Are we now too crowded with wickedness (?) because Jesus will separate people at the soon coming time of separation on Earth - Matthew 25:31-33,37
Satan will be abyssed ( jailed) for a thousand years while Jesus undoes all the damage caused by Satan and Adam upon humanity.
What was guessed or calculated in the past and proved wrong or premature does Not make the Bible as wrong just the calculations as wrong.
I recall when I was young some older people thought littering on the roads or turnpike was bringing ruing to Earth - Revelation 11:18 B.
So, the idea that 'now is the time' for Jesus to come is because we see the selfish distorted form of love the 'world' now displays - 2 Timothy 3:1-5,13.
Never before in history has the good news of God's kingdom (Daniel 2:44) been proclaimed on such a vast international scale.
We are at the ' final stage ' of that work.
Because of modern technology people living in remote areas of Earth can have access to Scripture, even in their own native languages.
Coupled with seeing Jesus words of Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8 fulfilled on a global scale, we see even the detail as found at Luke 21:11.
There Luke mentions earthquakes and uses the adjective ' GREAT' to describe them.
People do class C-19 as a pestilence, so that also helps show the timing is now ripe.
This means we are nearing the ' final signal ' of 1Thessalonians 5:2-3 that the powers that be will be saying, " Peace and Security...." as the precursor to the coming great tribulation of Revelation 7:14,9 before Jesus, as Prince of Peace, will be the one who will really usher in global Peace on Earth.
The executional words from Jesus' mouth will rid the Earth of the wicked - Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:14-16.
What is ignorance is that false clergy keep people in the dark, spiritual darkness, so that people don't know what the Bible really teaches.

firedragon said:

I have given a few reasons why I dont trust the Gospel according to Matthew. If you have any genuine arguments to why I should trust it, I dont mind hearing it.............

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Doesn't Matthew 's gospel account also have corresponding cross-reference verses as the other gospel accounts _____________

URAVIP2ME said:

If we think back to the original offer given to Adam and Eve they could 'live forever on Earth' ..
Earth abides forever (Ecclesiastes 1:4 B) what will Not abide forever are the wicked - Psalms 92:7; Psalms 104:35.

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Nothing abides for ever, not even Gods' names. You know there is a huge black Mamba (Black Hole) sitting right in the heart of Milky Way galaxy. Even galaxies are smashed (Andromeda moving towards Milky way). Sun would burn up in 5 billion years to be a Red Dwarf. However, it may be so hot in just about a billion years to evaporate all water on earth and erase life. And you talk of promise to Adam!
Keep reading your book and sing your psalms, but that does not make any difference.
Did that make any difference anywhere against Coronavirus which has killed hundreds of thousands of people in Americas, Europe, Africa and Asia.

InvestigateTruth said:

Ok, let me ask my question another way. Do you trust that Jesus received a revelation from God, called Gospel, because Quran says?

Do you think, when Muslims trust Quran telling truth, they take it on faith, or they could conclude from historical methods that Quran is telling truth?

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1. Yes
2. I can't speak for all Muslims. I would guess most would simply have faith.

URAVIP2ME said:

Doesn't Matthew 's gospel account also have corresponding cross-reference verses as the other gospel accounts _____________

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Of course. Its what we call the Synoptic Problem.

Aupmanyav said:

Nothing abides for ever, not even Gods' names. You know there is a huge black Mamba (Black Hole) sitting right in the heart of Milky Way galaxy. Even galaxies are smashed (Andromeda moving towards Milky way). Sun would burn up in 5 billion years to be a Red Dwarf. However, it may be so hot in just about a billion years to evaporate all water on earth and erase life. And you talk of promise to Adam!
Keep reading your book and sing your psalms, but that does not make any difference.
Did that make any difference anywhere against Coronavirus which has killed hundreds of thousands of people in Americas, Europe, Africa and Asia.

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I am wondering what the virus has to do with making any difference against it _______________
God did Not cause the virus.
Jesus was Not saying God is causing the words found at Luke 21:11.
Jesus was merely informing us that such things would be happening before the outbreak of the great tribulation of Revelation 7:14,9.
Jesus is forewarning us to as to be forearmed so that we do Not loose faith, loose confidence in a better future coming.
As far as the universe, there are also nurseries for ' new born' stars, so to speak, etc.

This is not the greatest tribulation. There have been two before this. The 14th Century plague and the 20th Century Spanish Flu. These things keep happening.And your God / Allah keeps sitting mum. Now the Stromboli also has erupted. And your Jesus is still absconding. Is there any reason (even one) to believe on words of Bible?

firedragon said:

1. Yes
2. I can't speak for all Muslims. I would guess most would simply have faith.

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Ok, then, you trust that Jesus received a revelation called Gospel which you take it base on faith. It is because you take it based on faith that there is a God, who revealed Quran which is the truth, and eventhough, it is not possible to completely prove, based on historical methods that, Muhammad authored really the Quran, or all of Quran, and though it is not possible to prove there is a God, or that the Quran is from a God, you accept all that purely based on faith.

So, my question is how do you decide to take something based on faith, and when do you decide to require historical methods?

I mean, why do you think, it is appropriate and logical, to trust that Quran is completely authored by Muhammad, and was a revelation from God, without requiring a proof based on historical methods, but it is not appropriate to trust, based on faith that same God protected Bible from corruption, and caused it to be written properly, even if it was written 50 or 100 years later by some anonymous person.


Based on your belief, God is all powerful and all knowing, so, He could have just protected Bible to contain all the required teaching, in His own ways, perhaps inspiring somebelievers, or helping them to write it correctly. Could He not?
Or that some early believers were pure-hearted and did a well investigation and wrote all the truth. This is also possible, but you choose not to trust. However you choose to trust, those who according to an unverifiable history memorized Quran, did that with all honesty.

Do you see what i am really asking?

you don't seem to require historical methods to prove to you Quran is indeed all written by Muhammad and was from God, and you choose to believe that only based on faith, but when it comes to Bible, you say, i cannot trust it, I need historical methods prove it.

I am just trying to understand your Logic.

InvestigateTruth said:

Ok, then, you trust that Jesus received a revelation called Gospel which you take it base on faith. It is because you take it based on faith that there is a God, who revealed Quran which is the truth, and eventhough, it is not possible to completely prove, based on historical methods that, Muhammad authored really the Quran, or all of Quran, and though it is not possible to prove there is a God, or that the Quran is from a God, you accept all that purely based on faith.

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Not at all. If you wish to discuss why I believe in the Quran and Islam you have to ask that question separately.

I can understand what you are getting at. You are looking for hypocrisy in me. Thats called the Tu Quoque fallacy.

InvestigateTruth said:

So, my question is how do you decide to take something based on faith, and when do you decide to require historical methods?

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Thats a loaded question. You have completely twisted whats in my mind, faith and approach to theology to suit your question that's gonna come. Your question is based on a false premise.

InvestigateTruth said:

I mean, why do you think, it is appropriate and logical, to trust that Quran is completely authored by Muhammad, and was a revelation from God, without requiring a proof based on historical methods, but it is not appropriate to trust, based on faith that same God protected Bible from corruption, and caused it to be written properly, even if it was written 50 or 100 years later by some anonymous person.

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I can prove that the New Testament has nothing to do with Jesus or any of his disciples. Any day, any time. Just ask the question directly. If you want to discuss this decently you could do that in this thread particularly for that topic.

Quran and New Testament, are they the same in authorship, manuscript evidence, textual reliability?

InvestigateTruth said:

you don't seem to require historical methods to prove to you Quran is indeed all written by Muhammad and was from God, and you choose to believe that only based on faith, but when it comes to Bible, you say, i cannot trust it, I need historical methods prove it.

I am just trying to understand your Logic.

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You are looking for hypocrisy of another person. And that too, based on a false premise you have created for me. How do you create a false premise for me? Do you understand that question?

InvestigateTruth said:

Ok, let me ask my question another way. Do you trust that Jesus received a revelation from God, called Gospel, because Quran says?

Do you think, when Muslims trust Quran telling truth, they take it on faith, or they could conclude from historical methods that Quran is telling truth?

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There are literally hundreds of different religions all claiming to be truth :

https://www.google.com/search?clien...jEzLjQuMZgBAKABAaoBB2d3cy13aXo&sclient=psy-ab

4,300 religions
There are some 4,300 religions of the world. This is according to Adherents, an independent, non-religiously affiliated organisation that monitors the number and size of the world's religions


Other than the bible there are many other books viewed as holy :

https://www.google.com/search?clien...JgBAKABAaoBB2d3cy13aXrIAQjAAQE&sclient=psy-ab





There are five key books of revelation in Islam. Each of them was given to a different prophet by Allah. Muslims believe that these holy books all conveyed the same message from Allah to the humanity, giving guidance to Muslims on how to live their daily life.



So the question is all these different beliefs just a different way to GOD or is there just one religious belief that he is directing, if so how does one find the truth?

If GOD exist then there must be a Devil because of the conditions we are living under ,GOD is righteous and loving and wants people to be happy and live in perfect conditions .

So why then are we living with so much evil and violence in the world if GOD is real? which book tells us how we got here and how do we find the right religion with thousands of religions?


Religious Classification What/Who Is Divine Example
Polytheism Multiple gods Belief systems of the ancient Greeks and Romans
Monotheism Single god Judaism, Islam
Atheism No deities Atheism


My answer is the truth is not found by you the truth finds you ,if a person really wants to find GOD then GOD knows that, who ever GOD is seems to me with his great wisdom he would know that and since if he really does exist then its logical he is GOD alone or another higher power created him and still that high power was himself created by yet another higher power and so on and so one in perpetuity. So its logical that GOD is one deity that always existed and alone GOD.
So if one is really seeking the truth and searching for the true GOD ,GOD will let himself be found thats why the Devil has confused thousands of different religious beliefs to hide the one religion that he knows is the truth.If there is one GOD then its reasonable that he only has one way to himself not all roads lead to the same place not all religions lead to GOD only one road lead to GOD.The question again is which road is that?
Let God be found true and every man a liar.

firedragon said:

Not at all. If you wish to discuss why I believe in the Quran and Islam you have to ask that question separately.

I can understand what you are getting at. You are looking for hypocrisy in me. Thats called the Tu Quoque fallacy.



Thats a loaded question. You have completely twisted whats in my mind, faith and approach to theology to suit your question that's gonna come. Your question is based on a false premise.



I can prove that the New Testament has nothing to do with Jesus or any of his disciples. Any day, any time. Just ask the question directly. If you want to discuss this decently you could do that in this thread particularly for that topic.

Quran and New Testament, are they the same in authorship, manuscript evidence, textual reliability?



You are looking for hypocrisy of another person. And that too, based on a false premise you have created for me. How do you create a false premise for me? Do you understand that question?

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I dont think you are a hypocrite. I simply don't see logic in your beliefs and approaches. I dont judge your intention. Not mine to judge your intention.

Ok, I continue in the other thread.

Aupmanyav said:

This is not the greatest tribulation. There have been two before this. The 14th Century plague and the 20th Century Spanish Flu. These things keep happening.And your God / Allah keeps sitting mum. Now the Stromboli also has erupted. And your Jesus is still absconding. Is there any reason (even one) to believe on words of Bible?

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Right. It is not the great tribulation. that is not what @URAVIP2ME is saying.
What we are seeing is a composite sign, where on an unprecedented scale all of what was prophesied is seen on a global scale - including, the preaching of the Good news, as a witness to all the nations before the end comes.

Think of it this way...
Warnings are being given that an eruption from a volcano is immanent.
People are saying, "Nah. It likely won't. Or it may come later, but not now. More is to come."
Some are heading the warnings, and moving to safety.

Do you know the history of Mount Pelée?
It's an interesting historical event. Lessons to be learned from that, and lessons to be learned from similar events.(Luke 17:26-30)

Mount Pelée begins to erupt, burying Caribbean city
Caught up in the midst of an important election, residents of Saint Pierre failed to heed the mountain’s warnings and evacuate. The nearby residents mistakenly believed that the only danger from the volcano was lava flow and that if lava started to flow, they would have plenty of time to flee to safety. In fact, some people came from outside the city to view the action, even after ash from the eruption began to block roads.

On May 7, activity on the volcano increased dramatically and the blasts grew significantly stronger. Overnight, there were several strong tremors and a cloud of gas with a temperature of more than 3,000 degrees Fahrenheit spilled out of the mountain. Finally, a tremendous blast in the early morning hours sent an avalanche of boiling ash down the side of the mountain.

The city of Saint Pierre was buried within minutes and virtually everyone died instantly. There were only two reported survivors–one was a prisoner held in an underground cell. Legend has it that he went on to be a circus attraction. In addition, 15 ships in the harbor were capsized by the eruption. One ship managed to stay afloat with half the crew surviving, although most suffered serious burns.

Luke 17:26-30
Moreover, just as it occurred in the days of Noah, so it will be in the days of the Son of man: they were eating, they were drinking, men were marrying, women were being given in marriage until that day when Noah entered into the ark, and the Flood came and destroyed them all. Likewise, just as it occurred in the days of Lot: they were eating, they were drinking, they were buying, they were selling, they were planting, they were building. But on the day that Lot went out of Sodʹom, it rained fire and sulfur from heaven and destroyed them all. It will be the same on that day when the Son of man is revealed.

(Luke 21:34-36) 34 “But pay attention to yourselves that your hearts never become weighed down with overeating and heavy drinking and anxieties of life, and suddenly that day be instantly upon you 35 as a snare. For it will come upon all those dwelling on the face of the whole earth. 36 Keep awake, then, all the time making supplication that you may succeed in escaping all these things that must occur and in standing before the Son of man.”

It is the Christians who are keeping awake.
We certainly don't expect everyone to be doing that, so when people say the things you are saying, it is no surprise.
If you and all the other eight billion plus agreed with what was said in scripture, and you accepted it, it would mean the scriptures were wrong, and Jesus was wrong, but that is not the case.

(2 Peter 3:3, 4) 3 First of all know this, that in the last days ridiculers will come with their ridicule, proceeding according to their own desires 4 and saying: “Where is this promised presence of his? Why, from the day our forefathers fell asleep in death, all things are continuing exactly as they were from creation’s beginning.”

When the 'end of days' comes, then also we have to die. It does not matter if we have accepted Jesus or not. 'That he will save you' applies only after your death. That is a promise. How do we evaluate a promise? What value can we put to this promise?

Aupmanyav said:

When the 'end of days' comes, then also we have to die. It does not matter if we have accepted Jesus or not. 'That he will save you' applies only after your death. That is a promise. How do we evaluate a promise? What value can we put to this promise?

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If you believe that based on other text, I can certainly understand that, but reading the Bible, I see a different picture. Revelation 7:9-17
13 “These who are dressed in the white robes, who are they and where did they come from?” 14 So right away I said to him: “My lord, you are the one who knows.” And he said to me: “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
(Proverbs 2:21, 22) 21 For only the upright will reside in the earth, And the blameless will remain in it. 22 As for the wicked, they will be cut off from the earth, And the treacherous will be torn away from it.
(1 John 2:17) . . .the world is passing away and so is its desire, but the one who does the will of God remains forever.

Do those scriptures read as though they are talking about after death? No.
There will be survivors of the coming destruction. The Bible reads that way.

Aupmanyav said:

This is not the greatest tribulation. There have been two before this. The 14th Century plague and the 20th Century Spanish Flu. These things keep happening.And your God / Allah keeps sitting mum. Now the Stromboli also has erupted. And your Jesus is still absconding. Is there any reason (even one) to believe on words of Bible?

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Details, details, details such as found at Matthew 24:21 that there will be great tribulation such as has Not occurred since the world's beginning.....
Such a tribulation has never happened. That great tribulation is still ahead of us - Revelation 7:14,9
Jesus was Not teaching the Spanish Flu nor C-19 is from God, but just that such things would be happening as found at Luke 21:11.
Yes, there is reason to believe the Bible's words such as found at 1 Thessalonians 5:2-3.
The powers that be will be saying, " Peace and Security...." and that will prove to be the precursor to the coming great tribulation of Rev. 7:14,9
So, it will come as a shock to many peoples when the political world surprisingly turns on the religious world.

Aupmanyav said:

When the 'end of days' comes, then also we have to die. It does not matter if we have accepted Jesus or not. 'That he will save you' applies only after your death. That is a promise. How do we evaluate a promise? What value can we put to this promise?

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Why say, 'only after death' ?
Please notice that the figurative mild humble meek ' sheep ' (people) are alive on Earth at the coming 'time of separation' on Earth - Matthew 25:31-33,37.
So, they can remain alive on Earth to see calendar Day One of Jesus' 1,000-year governmental reign over Earth when it begins.- Revelation 7:14; Revelation 7:9.
So, what the Bible really teaches or promises is that there is a great crowd of living people who will come through the great tribulation alive.- Isaiah 26:20
That great crowd can gain 'everlasting life on Earth' as originally offered to Adam before his downfall.

URAVIP2ME said:

Why say, 'only after death' ? Please notice that the figurative mild humble meek ..'

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Yeah, the humble and meek are always fooled by that. Humble and meek will not inherit the world immediately, not in their life time. Another promise by a snake-oil seller.

Aupmanyav said:

Yeah, the humble and meek are always fooled by that. Humble and meek will not inherit the world immediately, not in their life time. Another promise by a snake-oil seller.

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I do wonder why you say Not in their lifetime.
I see increasing hard conditions around the world as foretold at Luke 21:11; 2 Timothy 3:1-5,13.
I see such global troubles now in a pronounced way today.
Right here in the USA we see opposing voting sides which shows close elections showing that there is No clear majority which thus weakens presidential power to act thus leaving No clear way to implement policies.
It is Not a snake-oil promise about God's kingdom (Daniel 2:44) but that we are forewarned so that we can be forearmed.
The powers that be will be saying, " Peace and Security...." (1 Thess. 5:2-3) and this is the 'final signal', so to speak, before the outbreak of the great tribulation.
If the coming great tribulation was categorized as hurricanes are it would be more than a Cat-5 and more like a Cat-6.
Being humble, mild and meek does Not have to mean: ignorant.

1 Thess. 5:2-3, 'Doom's day lobbying', the way of the Abrahamic religions, not just Christianity. Yeah, people in Israel in 1st Century were superstitious, like everywhere else. They passed on the virus to half the world. It is another type of corona - religious coronavirus.