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Question to Christians - What is required to happen for Jesus to return?

Ehav4Ever

Well-Known Member
Question to Christians:

According to Christianity, what things must happen in the world for Jesus to return?

For example:
  1. Is there a certain number of people in the world that have to become Christian first?
  2. Are there certain people who must become Christian first?
  3. Are there certain things Christians must correct among themselves or do first?
  4. Are the 144,000 mentioned in the NT a part of this equation?
  5. Is it purely based on certain world events?
  6. Is it purely when the Christian God decides it will happen with no other factors involved, including the above?
Thanks in advance.
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
Question to Christians:

According to Christianity, what things must happen in the world for Jesus to return?

For example:
  1. Is there a certain number of people in the world that have to become Christian first?
  2. Are there certain people who must become Christian first?
  3. Are there certain things Christians must correct among themselves or do first?
  4. Are the 144,000 mentioned in the NT a part of this equation?
  5. Is it purely based on certain world events?
  6. Is it purely when the Christian God decides it will happen with no other factors involved, including the above?
Thanks in advance.
Nobody knows.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Is there a certain number of people in the world that have to become Christian first?

For JW - I believe they think it is the 144,000 from their denomination... however, that is not the mainstream thought. What it does say is:

Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness to all nations; and then shall the end come.

Are there certain people who must become Christian first?

It doesn't mention a certain number specifically... but God knows when it is time.

Are there certain things Christians must correct among themselves or do first?

I don't think so. There are always new believers that need to grow and change and be corrected.

Are the 144,000 mentioned in the NT a part of this equation?

It varies. In my persuasion the time-line is this...

There is a "catching-away" of Christians replaced by the 144,000 Jewish evangelists and a few years later the return of the Messiah.

Is it purely based on certain world events?

World events are part of the equation:

  1. Construction of another Temple where sacrifices are reinstated
  2. A coalition of nations (which nations is unknown) - General vicinity Europe/Middle East
  3. An Armageddon where Israel is attacked and but delivered by YHWH - two of the nations are believed to be Russia and China... but that is a theological position.
  4. Israel must be a nation again (already done)
  5. 1 Then 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, (Perhaps when people finally say there is peace in the world?)
There are other signs:

2 Tim 3: 3 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,



Is it purely when the Christian God decides it will happen with no other factors involved, including the above?

I would prefer saying the G-d of Abraham, Issac and Jacob. But, no, He has spoken as to what will happen before it happens... much the same as He prophetically spoke about the image to Nebuchadnezzar.
 

pearl

Well-Known Member
  1. Is it purely when the Christian God decides it will happen with no other factors involved, including the above?

There is no 'Christian' God, but the God of Israel in whose time there will be a 'second coming' and/or the first for the Messiah of the Jews.
 

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
Question to Christians:

According to Christianity, what things must happen in the world for Jesus to return?
the essence of what jesus is, claimed "to be" doesn't come/go. it is inherent to all because of his statement I AM with you always, and what you do unto the least of these, you do unto me. basically the idea of keeping in mind, mindfulness. its a shared state of mind between two distortions of form.

For example:
  1. Is there a certain number of people in the world that have to become Christian first?
  1. distortion of numbers is relevant only to those who are hypnotized to the illusion of forms or the play of maya.
  2. Are there certain people who must become Christian first?
    again a relevance to numbers; when in truth all are one.
  3. Are there certain things Christians must correct among themselves or do first?
    not just christian but all states of mind that operate upon distortion of difference in form vs action. there are only two types of action even if there are myriad forms. is self promoting a form vs other form? or an action of absolute love?
  4. Are the 144,000 mentioned in the NT a part of this equation?
    again the number associated with mount zion upon which stands this One is symbolic. is has to do with the temple mount and wholeness. 144 is a gross, a whole. Number 1000 Symbolism, 1000 Meaning and Numerology
  5. Is it purely based on certain world events?
    more metaphorical to change of events in self/ego.
  6. Is it purely when the Christian God decides it will happen with no other factors involved, including the above?
    love changes things.
Thanks in advance.
 
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Brian2

Veteran Member
Question to Christians:

According to Christianity, what things must happen in the world for Jesus to return?

For example:
  1. Is there a certain number of people in the world that have to become Christian first?
  2. Are there certain people who must become Christian first?
  3. Are there certain things Christians must correct among themselves or do first?
  4. Are the 144,000 mentioned in the NT a part of this equation?
  5. Is it purely based on certain world events?
  6. Is it purely when the Christian God decides it will happen with no other factors involved, including the above?
Thanks in advance.

Wars, plagues and environmental disaster is also on the cards. These things have and continue to happen and probably will reach a stage where the world leaders just don't know what to do any more.
Nations and people will be wanting to escape from the laws imposed by God and His Messiah. Ps 2
Events with the nation of Israel are a big part of the end times prophecies.
 

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
As a Catholic I was taught that nobody knows when Jesus will return. So...answering your sixth question...my answer is yes, only Jesus (God) knows what conditions will be necessary for Him to return.
Btw...the Second Coming has a universal spiritual meaning, since we Christians believe God is the God of all Nations.
As the Gospel of Matthew says, the Angels shall come forth and sever the Wicked from among the Just.
And the Wicked can be of any religion, even Christians (so being Christian does not save).
And the Just will be of any religion/nationality too.
 

Brickjectivity

Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
Staff member
Premium Member
According to Christianity, what things must happen in the world for Jesus to return?
I am not a Catholic priest, so there may be some things I don't have access to, but we'll ignore that for now. I'll attempt to justify my reply.

The answer appears to be cryptically present inside of various passages! I Corinthians has a passage which appears to insist upon physical resurrection of the dead, however it also appears to say something opposite: "The last enemy to be destroyed is death." In this case death is an enemy to be fought, however it says Christ (note it doesn't say 'Jesus') has been resurrected. Confused? Why doesn't it simply say Jesus has been resurrected? I find this significant and related to your question as well as the surrounding passage.

This passage in 1 Corinthians refers us to Psalm 8 as does Matthew 21 showing it has great significance to early Catholics. They probably quote it a lot in the (now burned) lost writings, since its appearing both in a gospel and a letter. I will use Psalm 8 to decipher what the heck I Corinthians means. This is not an attempt to bore anyone, but this is what it takes sometimes to answer questions. --> (Psa 8:2-6 NIV) "2 Through the praise of children and infants you have established a stronghold against your enemies, to silence the foe and the avenger. 3 When I consider your heavens, the work of your fingers, the moon and the stars, which you have set in place, 4 what is mankind that you are mindful of them, human beings that you care for them? 5 You have made them a little lower than the angels and crowned them with glory and honor. 6 You made them rulers over the works of your hands; you put everything under their feet:"

Here the Psalm appears to be filling in something which 1Corinthians hasn't literally explained, but it points us to Psalm 8. Christ is, in fact, not Jesus in this case but is a lot of people, people who are like mere children. He is referring to the Christians. In this letter Christ rules through these Christians who are unlearned, like infants. That is a theme in Christian passages, so I think its a reasonable guess. Perhaps the writer on 1 Corinthians wavers back and forth speaking of Christ as an individual but also as people. This also suits since Paul elsewhere says the Church is they body of Christ. Hence he can speak about them or about him in the same sentence.

Now perhaps having examined this I have got the ability to partially answer your inquiry though I am not trained in the traditional sense and don't have a degree! Revisiting you inquiry:

  • Is there a certain number of people in the world that have to become Christian first?
  • Are there certain people who must become Christian first?
  • Are there certain things Christians must correct among themselves or do first?
  • Are the 144,000 mentioned in the NT a part of this equation?
  • Is it purely based on certain world events?
  • Is it purely when the Christian God decides it will happen with no other factors involved, including the above?

(1Co 15:22-26 NIV) "22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death."

So firstly *all* will be made alive. This is a universalist kind of phrase, and in my opinion the early Christians are universalists. It suits me, but even if they aren't universalists the meaning here is that there is no number specified in this sense. Perhaps the 144000 idea you ask about is symbolic for more people? That's likely I think. Otherwise its inexplicable why its not repeated here. It also says "Each in turn". First the firstfruits*, then the harvest, then the end. The harvest in this context means "All." Everyone eventually. This is the belief not that people have to preach but that everyone will simply be drawn in and will join. We see this is the expected pattern as large numbers of Romans of all classes eventually start converting. This also means that is what the coming of the harvest means and is the meaning of "When he comes." The enemies are named: 'Dominion', 'Authority', 'Power' and 'Death'.

*Its likely that early Catholics count themselves as the firstfruits, since James uses this term in reference to them. Firstfruits is (to those who don't know) a type of offering mentioned in Leviticus, and the early Catholics here are re-using it to refer to first converts to Christ, themselves. Firstfruits is offered early in the growing season, well before the full harvest.
*********************************************************
Nutshell:
Is there a certain number of people in the world that have to become Christian first?
All

Are there certain things Christians must correct among themselves or do first?
Romans
16 says they must live in peace, among other things.

Are the 144,000 mentioned in the NT a part of this equation?
Probably a symbolic number representing all people in all nations, because its only mentioned in Revelation and nowhere else. I suspect there could be more info about it hidden at the Vatican or in a tomb somewhere.

Is it purely based on certain world events?
Independent of world events.

Is it purely when the Christian God decides it will happen with no other factors involved, including the above?
No.
 
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